there are numerous things i don't like.

upon entering a front door, no one likes to see table legs and chair legs as a view. My opinion. Eyes need a destination, that is beautiful and high, not low down and leggy. Even if you put something nice on the table, eyes go down to the big things under the table. It's like an animal thing. As humans we are uncomfortable when the crotch is the focus, in every view, all the time.

in drawing #2 you are using wishful thinking in showing 42"w aisles and 24" countertop depth.

it appears you expanded the garage.

Thanks for the response!

The front door leads into an entryway that then leads into the living room to the left of the kitchen. There isn't much traffic going from the dining room up to the kitchen (perhaps you were thinking that hallway leading up to the kitchen was from the front door?). If you're referring to the view of the table from the living room, well there isn't much getting around that. If we don't have the "fixed" table at the end of the island we'd have a movable table sitting between the beverage center and the french doors leading outside. Thats what we currently have and my wife hates it even without the new doors.

And yes we are planning on moving into the garage to create more space in the kitchen. This idea originally began as just making pantry space, but soon grew into fridge/oven space. Its doable according to our contractor.

You're probably right on the measurments, the 42" will likely end up being 40-41" after its all crammed in there.

I am a newbie so I don't think my opinion counts much but did want to say that I am in the process of using a designer and on the drawings she is starting with and the drawings I'm using to try various layouts, we consistently add 6 inches of depth for every wall. This can seriously impact design and I suspect (though I'm new at this) that when we actually go further down the line, the designer will take various shortcuts she knows she can do (but I don't) but better to design on the conservative side, IMO.

I like your design and don't see as many problems with the general layout other than to strongly suggest you add for the walls which I know can have big impact and limitation.

I may not be the best one to criticize because I'm dealing with a house that is 75 years old and have many challenges that you don't have - I envy you. Good luck.

Great point about the walls. My measurements are inside wall measurements. I'm also using a designer and the fancy drawings she gives us do have 6" wall thickness at least. I wanted to scan in one of her drawings but we end up with chicken scratch all over those drawings by the end of our meetings so I don't feel they're the best for presentation here.

I tried a few of the free CAD programs to draw a layout but wasn't thrilled with the ones I found usable on a MAC (without running a windows environment) so I just hand drew them.

The doorway with 'the legs' is the dining room, not the entry...correct? So, I don't see any problem with that at all. Did you see this picture, on another post?
{{gwi:1625274}}From Kitchen plans

I think this will work well, with your layout and there should be plenty of room for stools, with the pantry behind the seating.

Can you extend that bump out, into the garage? It would be nice to have maybe broom closet/narrow, extra pantry, fridge, then a counter space, with ovens, on the end. You need a landing space, by the fridge and ovens, IMHO, that isn't just the island. Many will disagree, but that's what I like...and it can make a great snack area, too. You could move the microwave over there, too (above counter or drawer version) between the fridge and ovens.

The prep sink might work better, closer to the cooktop...maybe even on the end (where you have the microwave now) so you can use it from the fridge and snack area, too. Have the faucet on the cooktop end and I think you could use it from either side of the island.

Also, if you move your mudroom/back door over a foot, you could have hooks back there, for coats, leashes, etc. Maybe add a bench in with what looks like cubbies, so you can sit down to take off boots/shoes. Hope this helps :)

I think the question that arises is what, in the kitchen is most preferable to see from the entry, from another room, or as a focal point.

This becomes an issue because there is so much function that has to be put into a kitchen.

A sink with a window over it would seem to be a natural focal point but then sometimes you look straight into the house and see a full dishrack and various soap and detergent bottles piled around a sink.

A range with a nice hood can make a nice focal point, but then sometimes one sees a cluttered cooktop.

The same can be said of a table if the table is piled with mail and junk as well as eaten at.

I've always personally disliked seeing the sink in many views because they are often so cluttered.

You have to analyze what is preferable for you to look at. In my case it would probably be the table , because our table is always kept clear except when we eat at it.

Hi bodhi,

I like your future colour scheme.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with your layout, you already know its imperfections but...have you thought about a peninsula instead of an island? Personally, I'm not too fond of shallow islands but I think this is what you have already so maybe you're cool with that. If you were comfortable having your clean up sink on the peninsula, maybe make it deeper for seating, put your rangetop about where your sink is (a window on either side, like somebody did here), then going left, your double ovens, and your refrigerator around the corner. I think it would fit, maybe. You could do a corner pantry or a shallow pantry on the garage wall.

I guess there's not really a spot for a prep snk, mmmm, anyways just a thought. Btw I hear about trying to find a design program for a Mac. I hadn't got rid of my pc yet so I dug that out and use that instead. Good luck!

I'm glad I was mistaken in my first post. It got the thread started.

have you tried the stove on the 'pantry' wall/ext wall? would probably be room for ovens there also. with fridge where you have the stove? pantry on lower wall where ovens are and move ovens to the right (if not on ext wall w/stove). don't like ovens that close to a doorway.

Not crazy about the pantry at the end of the run, even though its only 18" deep
but the tall height will block the run of cabinets that are to the left of pantry. everything else looks good

lavender_lass:
Yes, the doorway pointed right at the table is just a small hallway to the dining room, not the front entry to the house.

We did consider bumping out into the garage more but was advised against it since we'll have to put a support beam above that bump-out and the larger it is the harder (probably more $$) it is according to the contractor.

I definitely hear you on the landing zone for the fridge, but we currently land on the island (2 ft away now though) and it seems very comfortable.

I also proposed putting the prep sink in the exact location you suggested and was shot down by my wife and the designer. They felt that end space was needed for landing zone and shouldn't have a sink right on the end. Maybe if we had a better landing zone for the fridge it would be doable though.

The right hand side of the mudroom will actually have a small broom closet with 4 18" deep cubbies to sit down on, take off shoes, hang coat up on rungs, with storage above and below.

palimpsest:
Very good points about focal point in the kitchen, it can really add or detract from the look, IMHO. Most people will first see our kitchen from the living room angle so they will be looking down the table/island and there is going to be a nice painted hood above the range. I think it'll be blue like the island. Likely white backsplash below with gray counters and white cabinets. I think it'll make a nice focal point and because of this I don't think I want a large light/chandelier above the table to get in the way of that view.

momo7:
Thanks for the vote of confidence on the colors! We did consider a peninsula at one point and I don't recall why that got shot down. We definitely prefer a table 4 of us can sit down for dinner at and look at each other over a row of seating at a peninsula, and I think the peninsula made my wife feel boxed in in the kitchen. Shallow isles might make us feel boxed in too though!

davidro1:
Yes, thanks for getting things started! This thread was about to drop off the first page without a response.

desertsteph:
What you describe is similar to what we have now depending on where you stick the sink in there. We currently have the sink in the corner with two windows that you can't really see out of well. One of our goals was to get the sink on that wall directly facing a larger window. Some have set up a range/cooktop facing a window (and induction is probably a good candidate for this) but I don't think we'd like that as much as a sink. At one point we were thinking of putting the cooktop in the corner with the wall ovens on the end of that counter run next to the door but facing the island. We felt that vertical run of ovens right there would look weird and we didn't like the cooktop in the corner much either.

ihelpu:
Thats a good point about the pantry blocking some of the cabinets. I like how its recessed at the bottom compared to the counter, but I do forget the top will stick out 6".

Keep the feedback coming, I do appreciate all the comments!

Counter plus attached table = 13'. That's a long way round (though the kids will love it for playing tag). And it's inflexible. Maybe a bench attached to the end of the island that would face into the family room? Then the table could be freestanding in about the same location and have the same feel.

I'd check on that support beam and find out how much more money it would be...or is it just a little more time? What about a steel beam or does the contractor mean it's just more expensive for a larger engineered beam? I'd want to know, before I ruled out the idea. Then, you can make an informed decision.

Your colors sound great (I like blue, too) and the range hood will make a wonderful focal point. Everything else seems like it will look/function very well.

Oh, one more question...are you putting a pocket door, between the mudroom and kitchen...or is the dog shower (with window above) going to be planned as part of your focal point? Seriously, a stained glass or uniquely shaped window could add a lot, as long as it's meant to be seen from the family room :)

More great suggestions.

Christina504:
I agree that is one long island/table. Just discussed this with my wife and I plan to ask the KD if its possible to design the table to be movable/detachable. I originally thought it would be but it turned into a stationary deal.

lavender_lass:
My wife agrees about putting the pantry over by the fridge so I'll ask for more details about why we were advised against pushing more into the garage. It does eat up some storage space in the garage, but thats probably easier to deal with than a poorly designed kitchen!

Yes, we will have a pocket door going from the kitchen to the mudroom. We want a glass door so we can see the dogs if they're in there and so light can still come in through the large mudroom window if the door is closed. That window points NNW so a good amount of light comes in that direction. Below that window will be a 24" depth counter with storage underneath for dog food/stuff and other non essential kitchen stuff. The dog wash will be beside that counter but out of the view from the kitchen. Its a bit of a splurge but we're planning on getting one of those stand up SS doggy wash stations. This can double as a utility sink to hose off boots, muddy kids, etc.

I spoke with the contractor and it is possible to push out into the garage for a longer distance so now we have to decide if thats what we want to do. We meet with the KD again on Monday to go over some details. Getting close to ordering cabinets I think. Please keep the great comments coming!

Bodhi- Congrats! Be sure to keep us updated and don't forget pictures. I'm looking forward to seeing the blue island and cooktop hood :)