You'd be better off to switch to coal, than electric! Oil is still cheaper than bottled water. I don't know of anybody in NE PA, who has baseboard electric and uses it. And I think, electric homes are harder to sell.

Granted, an electric boiler isn't resistance baseboard, ...

It depends upon the cost of electric in your area. In PA, it wouldn't make sense with the upcoming 35% increase in rates in two years, but in Ohio it might. Coal is also available to you.

Electric boilers are 100% efficient and will heat most homes very well. They are very durable, trouble-free and don't require any maintenance. You'll need a 200 amp service, most likely.

See the website: efmheating.com

tmajor, I didn't know you were a coal fan.

Yes, I've lived with it all my life .. almost.
I've been on the Anthracite forum looking for answers to my stove problems. Got it pretty well worked out, now. I guess, I should have been getting the plow on the Jeep or something. The "dusting" has turned into about 6 inches of snow and a "snow advisory"!

I guess, I'll forget about dinner on the deck ...(sigh)

{{!gwi}}

What brand of stove do you have? We have about 2" here.

I've got a Russo C-35. My cousin used to be in the stove business ... it's one I commandeered.

See you on the Anthracite forum.

can you send me the link for the anthracite forum?

If you're serious about switching to gas, check with the gas co. they may offer incentives/rebates and be willing to pay for installing the gas line.

If you're buying a new boiler anyway, why go electric?

Baymee, I sent you an email earlier. ??

http://www.nepadigital.com/bb/

Here is a link that might be useful: Anthracite Coal

Sorry, tmajor, not that i know of.

Tmajor, I tried to sign up but I can't get past the confirmation screen no matter how I type the letters. I have an email into the moderator now.

I don't know. I see lots of new folks everyday. He did, just redo the site, so there may be a gliche there somewhere. Let me know, when you get in, unless you use the same name, ... so I can bust your stones!

Our current boiler is just fine, we don't have to replace it. We would replace it just to be able to switch fuel sources. Home heating oil is very expensive and poised to be even more so this year. Gas is much less expensive, but we do not have a gas line to the house. I want to switch away from fuel oil and thought electric might be an option. I'm not planning to use electric baseboards. We would still use the hot water baseboards, just with a different type of boiler.

It seems the opinion is that an electric boiler would be as expensive as fuel oil, am I right?

My sister lived in SE Ohio and had natural gas, which was dirt cheap!

The way I've always felt about oil, was that there was some competition on the local level.

NE Ohio is a good place to think about coal ... hm-mm, maybe a combination oil/coal stoker?? (I don't even know if they make one, but it sounded good.)

Yes, an automatic rice coal stoker, with oil backup is made by efm at efmheating.com

Currently, in eastern PA, coal costs about 1/3 the cost of oil in annual heating cost, but coal in OH will probably be higher due to transportation.

The stokers aren't cheap, but they have a very long life without much maintenance.

Baymee, they have coal out there, however it may be bi.

FWI, the anthracite forum is temporarily down.

Anthracite coal, (hard coal) is ONLY found in northeastern PA. Nowhere else in the USA. I know they ship it to Ohio though, and even farther West, because there are efm stokers there.

baymee, did you ever get in? If so, you'll find me on there as "Dallas".

I believe a high efficiency gas boiler is your best bet.

The electric boiler is 100% efficient but, what does the electric cost? There are 293kW in 1 million Btu's. Multiply your electric rate by 293. If you spend $.12/kW, 1 Million Btu will cost, $35.16.

If gas costs, $1.40/ therm, 1 million Btu's cost $14.00. Divide the new boiler efficiency by the cost using 92%, for a 92% AFUE boiler, the result will be $15.21 for 1 million Btu's in your home.

My calculator tells me that it's almost 60% less expensive to heat with gas than electric. Based upon the rates I used

Good luck,

tmajor, yes I did. as the stoker man

Bonanza,
Thanks for the formula. My bill says I pay 5.6 cents per kWh for electricity and I just looked up natural gas costs and it's about $10.49 per Mcf. I wasn't sure how to compare the costs using these numbers...?

Thanks for your help.

Pompeii

Pompeii,

If the electric rate you quoted is the dollars you paid divided by the kWh's. You are buying electric at $16.41 per million Btu's. (293 kW per million Btu) Electric baseboard is 100% efficient.

The final gas heating cost is determined by dividing the gas cost, $10.49 per million Btu's, by the furnace efficiency. If your new boiler is 92% AFUE your final cost is $11.40 per million Btu's.

Using the information from above, gas will be about 30% less expensive to heat with.

Don't forget, electric baseboard will be much less expensive to install than the new boiler. How long do you plan to be in this house?

I hope this helps.

Bonanza,
We have no plans to move from the house any time soon, although once the youngest is through school (about 5 years) and the market rebrounds (hopefully), who knows?

I don't think we would want to replace all the baseboards as the current hot water ones work just fine. I guess it looks like having a gas line installed to the property and replacing the oil-fire boiler with a gas-fired one would be our best option. Even though we have baseboard heat, we also have ductwork run for the AC, so we could get a furnace and switch from baseboard to forced air. But baseboard is generally considered a better system than forced air, isn't it?

IMHO, baseboard hot water is superior to hot air .. usually. With the hot water, you have residual heat after the furnace shuts off. Plus, I don't think it's as dusty.

Hot air gives you "quick heat" and you don't have any pipes to freeze or leak. You'll be a bit chilly before it comes on and and a bit warm before it shuts off.

Since your boiler is fairly new and in good shape, can the "burner only" be changed to gas?

tmajor,
We've been told that the burner only can be changed to gas, but we would lose a lot of efficiency that way. That was my original plan a couple of years ago, but a heating contractor said that since the boiler was made to use oil, switching it to gas would make it less efficient. Of course, with the astronomical price of oil now, we might still be ahead.

I would look into conversion a bit further. To start, Google: oil to gas conversion burner

You'll find such sites as Adam's Manufacturing, among others.
"The Adams Manufacturing Company was founded in 1945 by Sidney Schonberger. The first products manufactured were gas conversion burners and they are still a very important part of the product mix. A furnace or boiler fired with coal or fuel oil can be converted to gas with the installation of an Adams Speedflame Gas Conversion Burner."

Here is a link that might be useful: Adam's

Also, I'd contact a Weil-McLain representative to see if they have a gas burner for your particular boiler.

I just joined gardenweb since I was so interested in this subject.

I also have an oil boiler, with no option of changing to gas on my street, and the heating oil prices are outrageous this year!! Does anyone know if an oil boiler could be replaced with an electric tankless heater? At these prices, the heating oil companies are going to switch everyone away from their product eventually.

My Mother lives in an old 1903 Victorian in Lewistown, almost dead center in PA.

She has a 1954ish Burnham Jubilee oil boiler.

I'm trying to convince her that when it's time to replace the boiler (if it ever is) to go with an dual fuel coal/oil boiler and run rice coal through it.

If I ever move into that house, that's the first thing I'm going to do is replace the boiler with the dual fuel.

which personally I would, given that it's only 5 years old...

Look into a Harmon direct vent stoker stove that burns rice coal.

I've been seeing very good things about them, and you don't have to build yourself a chimney.

Here are a couple of links for it...

http://www.harmanstoves.com/callouts.asp?id=4

http://www.harmanstoves.com/features.asp?id=4

http://www.harmanstoves.com/specifications.asp?id=4

And dang...

75,000 BTU on high?

I could heat most of Mom's house very nicely with that monster by placing it in the front hall and using fans to move the air around...

"At these prices, the heating oil companies are going to switch everyone away from their product eventually."

Or their customers will insulate, weatherize, replace old windows and replace their old inefficient, oversized, poorly designed heating systems. That's what some of our heating oil and propane customers are doing. Cost per gallon and BTUs per gallon can't be changed (with the price exception of pre-buy and price-cap programs), but they can change how many gallons they burn.

With all the old leaky homes, old inefficient heating systems and driveways full of 4WD trucks and SUVs we see on a daily basis, you wouldn't think people are concerned about fuel prices.

It's the OP again --

We went ahead and converted our existing oil boiler to natural gas and ran the lines inside and out, for a total cost of less than $2000. I just received the first gas bill, which was for 2 weeks, and it's $141. Believe it or not, that is great news, since our oil was running $600/month this winter.

So if I figure a savings of $300/month and four winter months per year (I'm in NE Ohio), we will pay for the conversion in less than 2 years.

The next project is insulation. Since we currently have next to none in either the walls or attic, that may halve our bills again! Thanks for your help, everyone.

That's good news!

Go for the insulation in the attic .. it will do more than the sidewalls and it's usually easier to get to. IMO

Keep an eye on your roof, following a snow. Notice how the snow remains or melts, over time, compared to other's in your area.