I haven't seen any evidence of the anti-crease program in my machine either, so the manual seems to be wrong.

The manual has another error: It omits mention of the fact that the internal heater doesn't operate on the Normal cycle. Without the heater, the Normal cycle is essentially broken and useless. But the workaround is easy -- use the Custom cycle instead. It's pretty much the same thing, with wider options and a functioning heater.

suburbanmd, thank you so much for the information on the anti-crease program. Can't tell you how much I appreciate it. I have not read anything in these forums that pertains to this issue. I felt this was probably the case, but I didn't want to assume anything. My main concern is my new units are not mal-functioning. Why is it Miele doesn't seem to know this?!

The one BIG complaint I do have is the Operating and Installation manuals are not very comprehensive. It omits some very basic operating functions and pertinent information, one of which you mentioned. I did learn of that in one of at least 2 dozen calls I made to Miele.

Again, thanks for taking the time to post! :)

I agree, the manual could be more informative. Would be nice if it described each cycle, giving details like wash action and water level. Were you by any chance able to get that information?

I haven't bugged Customer Care as much as I probably should. One thing I did ask was the spin speeds, and this was the answer, hopefully the same answer you got:

Max-1400 rpm
High-1200 rpm
Med-900 rpm
Slow-400 rpm

suburbanmd...

In one of my 2 dozen calles to Miele, I did ask the spin speeds however Customer Care didn't know. The Customer Care representative asked if I would like to talk with her supervisor. The supervisor informed me he has the 4840 and gave me the following spin speeds:

Max: 1400
High: 900
Med: 600
Slow: 400

I can see my numbers differ from yours. I'm not surprised. I've been disappointed with both Tech Support & Customer Care. I have been getting many contradictions and most frustrating, suggestions and guesses. At this point Miele has authorized a Miele technician (employed only by Miele) to come out, and now I'm waiting for their call to set up appointment. When the Miele technician does come out, I will confirm the spin speeds and hopefully other specs.

About the instruction manual, I would like to see each cycle described as to the process it goes through, e.g. drum rotation being slower/faster with either full rotation or 1/4 turn; approx times e.g. min to max. I feel the internal water heater should be explainted as to when it is utilized. Also I thought the 'comforters' cycle was quite interesting & different, but the book says nothing. I do not like being told just to select a cycle by type of fabric and the machine will do the rest!

Also, I've noticed with the washer, after the cycle starts and water fills, the dispenser drawer pops open about 1/8". This baffles us. Too, at times right after I push the 'start' button the machine starts and maybe for 3 seconds starts adding water, then for unknown reasons, stops and the 'start' button flashes again. It is inconsistent. These are 2 issues I will discuss with the technician.

I like my washer and dryer. I don't think there is a perfect machine out there for me that has all the combinations of spin speeds with functions I would like.

The one thing I would like to see on the dryer is a shorter timed cycle rather than just the 45 min warm. Sometimes the clothes just need 5 to 10 minutes longer.

Our main objective was to get units which we felt were well built, clean well and protect our garments. So many others were just too plastic looking with shiny chrome buttons and dials, with features like 'steam' which doesn't do anything.

BTW, any preference on detergents?

Great, two different answers on spin speeds :( My question was via e-mail, so they didn't feel pressure to give an immediate answer. Also, I find 1200 for "High Spin" more plausible than 900, because: 1) 900 just isn't that "high"; 2) "Max Spin" looks faster than "High Spin", but not that much faster. Maybe it's time to find a cheap strobelight tachometer (if such a thing exists) and measure it myself.

Incidentally, I measured the drum radius as 29 cm, and based on that, computed the g-force at 1400 RPM as 635g.

Re heater operation, if you've got time to make observations, plug the machine in through a "Kill-A-Watt" box (now $21.98 on Amazon), and you'll be able to see when the heater is on. When it's drawing 1000+ watts, the heater is on.

The "Comforters" cycle starts with a "Venting" step, presumably to remove air, then drains and spins and goes through a regular wash sequence with slow tumbling. For some reason it doesn't spin at all between the wash and the first rinse, unlike the other cycles I've observed. Seems to rinse fine for me anyway, even without an extra rinse, maybe because the Sears Ultra Plus Free powder rinses out easily. I use this cycle a whole lot, because we use comforters without covers and my wife likes them washed :) One of our comforters has a particularly dense shell that holds water, and the machine can have trouble spinning that one; all the others aren't a problem. Nowadays I usually rearrange the comforter after the Comforters cycle has spun it (at High Spin, the highest allowed on that cycle), and put it through a Drain/Spin at Max Spin. Partly because Max Spin extracts a little more than High Spin, and partly because the comforter fills the whole drum while spinning, and the part that stays near the center isn't exposed to a lot of g-force. Rearranging it moves that part to the outside so it's extracted better, which helps because comforters are notoriously hard to dry.

The dispenser drawer has a spring-loaded flap at the back of the main detergent compartment. My guess is, opening that flap is what causes the drawer to pop out a little.

The initial burst of water after pushing Start is for the entrapment detection feature. If the machine detects drum movement at that time, it assumes an animal or child is inside, and it pauses the cycle and unlocks the door. I've seen it activated on occasion, but not often. Maybe your loads are stacked up or pushed to one side, so the burst of water makes them fall over and rotate the drum a bit.

We use Sears Ultra Plus Free powdered detergent, like I mentioned above. Pretty much no need to use liquid chlorine bleach anymore; washing whites on Hot with non-chlorine bleach gets them whiter than I ever got with chlorine bleach in "hot" water in an old top-loader.

Please let us know what you find out from the Miele tech. I agree, there's no perfect machine, but this one is really pretty good.

I would agree with your logic regarding the difference in our numbers on the 'High' spin of 900 vs 1200. Too much difference between 900 and 1400, and yes 900 doesn't seem all that high. Hopefully the tech will have answer.

Interesting point on the "Kill-A-Watt" box. Will give it some thought.

Your observation and report on the 'Comforters' cycle is impressive! I've observed it only twice and didn't recall the step-by-step sequence. I'm sure it will come with time. I washed a queen-sized mattress pad, not a comforter. How large of a comforter do you wash? I don't recall the dimensions, but Miele had given them for comforters. I thought it to be the size of a double bed, not queen which is what we have. I had the same issue with the machine starting, adding a small amount of water, then advancing to 'pause.' This happened about 4-5 times before the cycle eventually started without stopping. The point you brought out about the 'part that stays in the center isn't exposed to as much g-force' really makes sense. Something I hadn't previously given any thought to. At the end of my cycle, I did put it through a spin/drain just as you do. From here on out, I will first rearrange the mattress pad...thanks! :)

We have observed the spring loaded door at the back of the main wash compartment. I believe dispenser drawer pops out during the water intake. Is this a normal action? At times the door can be pushed back in, at others not. Does your dispenser drawer react in this same manner by popping out about 1/8"?

I've read other good reviews about the Sears laundry powder. I know powder is recommended over liquid. I myself find liquid too sticky. Is your non-chlorine bleach a powder? I also use Oxi-Clean with favorable results, sometimes adding it to the prewash...or heavily soiled I believe it's called.

Previously you had asked if I got cycle descriptions from Miele. The answer is no. I asked if there was anything documented in which would describe each cycle. Same answer, 'no.' What I was told as far as amounts of water, cycles which lend more to cottons will use less water as they can take more agressive tumbling action, and those which would fall under a category of more delicate or light fabric would use more water, as water provides more cushioning for the clothing.

We now have an appointment for the Miele tech to come out on Friday and check out our machine. Want to make sure the pause issues we've been having are checked out. Also, 'door blocked' fault has come up 3 times in the first 10 days so want that checked out as well. I am told the cool down cycle time can be incresed as well. Sometimes I find the clothing to be ever so slightly damp, and thought added a little longer cooldown could rectify that issue.

Buying a new washer or dryer is sooo time consuming. I've literally spent hours observing these cycles (& calling customer service)...and Miele was our third set after returning both Whirlpool Duet and Electrolux! ;)

Will let you know what we find out. Again, thanks for taking the time to enlighten us! :)

AN ADDED NOTE: We are interested in observing an actual demonstration on the washer/dryer. I've contacted one of the showrooms and was told they do conduct them. I feel any tips or information learned is well worth it. Our Garmin tells us it's about 67 miles from home...a nice drive on a sunny spring day.

Comforter size: We haven't washed anything larger than "full". Once tried to fit a "full/queen" comforter, but would've had to force the door closed, and hold it until it locked. I figured that wasn't a wise move, since the comforter might rub hard against the seal and possibly twist it. So our experience size-wise is consistent with Miele's advice. Lots of people on this forum are able to wash king-size comforters in comparably-sized machines. All I can figure is, their king-size comforter isn't very thick.

Our dispenser drawer pops out a little, but less than 1/8", maybe 1/16" or less.

Definitely powdered non-Cl bleach with powdered detergent. Been using Clorox 2 so far...I ran across a non-scented version at Wal-Mart a while ago.

"Door blocked" fault: On the washer? Did you by any chance use the Pause button? I only saw that fault once, in the middle of a cycle (so, clearly a spurious fault), and I'm convinced it was caused by pausing at an "inopportune" time. The pause function on this machine is definitely flaky. Sometimes it'll say it's locked when none of the usual reasons apply, and if you try it again right away it pauses. And sometimes it pauses but doesn't unlock. Fortunately I don't often have to add items to a running cycle.

The 'Door Blocked' fault was on the washer. The size load varied from small, medium, to medium-large. I am careful not to fill more than 3/4 full, as stated in the manual. No, I hadn't pressed the Pause button. It happened at the end of the wash cycle after water pumped out and drum just started to rotate for spin. I believe this was the case all 3 times. I too generally don't add items once I've started a cycle.

My personal opinion of the washer, with the computerizations, electroic sensors & safeguards, it's very persnickety.

Today we were graced with the prescence and a visit from a Miele technician...all I can say is WOW!!! He was like a doctor for the washing machine!

I was in sheer awe with the light unit he hooked up to our units, which enabled him to view exactly what our units were doing, while they were doing it, on his computer! As well allowed him to see any faults the units had previously displayed. It did show the 3 faults from the 'door blocked' issue we had. To play it safe, he replaced the door latch assembly.

The computer showed line by line functions & options, some of which could be changed from the factory presets. It was amazing to see our washing machine with all it does, showing up on a computer...not that's something I can relate to, better than the engineering end of it.

He started a cycle, selected 'hot' water which is 60c or 140F (without clothing) which utilizes internal heater (normal doesn't utilize internal heater--something to do with meeting Energy Star Compliance by having a cycle that conserves energy by NOT heating water, only utilizing hot from our water heater) and as drum tumbled we watched the computer register the temperatures as they increased to that of 'hot' water at 140F.

From that point, during the spin, I was able to view on his computer the actual RPM's for the selected spin speed. He also explained how the RPM's by itself didn't tell the entire story of water extration, but understanding 'g force' was just as important. As I was very interested in knowing the RPM's for all 4 spin speeds, he selected each speed and I viewed it on the computer...yes with my very own eyes...again while machine was in the designated cycle. Here are the numbers as I observed them. Ready for a chuckle? Here they are:

Max: 1400
High: 1000
Med: 600
Slow: 450

He added that a basic top loader, not inclusive of some of the newer high end units spin out at 450 RPM's.

Also, as I've mentioned, I asked about the dispenser drawer popping out just a little when the cycle starts. He explained this as normal. The reason as I understand it was for 'venting' air through the drawer into the machine as the drum and closed door are sealed units. Again I'm not a techy person, and my husband understands those things better than I.

He addressed any and all questions we had, and confirmed the warranty as 5 years. What a wealth of information he gave us...no guessing! ;) From the time he arrived at our home, to the time he left, 3+ hours had passed. Both my husband and myself are feeling even more confident we purchased the right washer & dryer! He confirmed these units are designed, manufactured and assembled in Europe.

It was such a positive experience I feel as though I'm coming down from a high! ;) I am of the belief you get what you pay for...and after today's experience, I know why we decided to pay more for the Miele. Additionally their track record over many, many years first making FL washers in the European market says a lot! Should in years to come we may find a need for service, we know Miele will come though for us.

You're going to make me sorry that I've never needed the services of a Miele tech :-) I could call about the "Door Blocked" fault, but that happened only once in the eight months I've had the machine, so doesn't seem worth the complication of replacing the door latch.

What did he say about your seemingly too-sensitive entrapment detection function?

I guess that's the final answer about W4840 spin speeds :-)

Incidentally, the basic Whirlpool-made top loaders, from the last 15 years or so, are said to spin at 640 RPM. But remember that g-force varies as the square of the spin speed, for a constant radius. So if the Miele drum was the same radius as the old top-loader's tub, the spin g-force at 1400 RPM would be 4.78 times as much. And I think the drum is bigger, in which case multiply 4.78 by the ratio of drum_radius/tub_radius.

Regarding the sensitivity of the entrapment detection function, the tech stated it is all related to the electronic latch assembly, and hopefully replacing it should take care of what seemed too frequent. Will just have to see how it goes from here.

Still want to go to the showroom and learn some tips or tricks of our units from the angle of customer care vs that of a tech. One thing the tech said his wife does is dilute the grocery store fabric softener in the bottle, as I told him I first put about 1/4 cup of warm water in the softener compartment prior to adding softener.

Your Miele tech is exaggerating. Very few toploader spin (on regular speed) as low as 450 RPM. As suburbanmd says, all Whirlpool-made direct-drive toploaders have spun at 640 RPM ever since the design was introduced in the early 1980s (that would be approx 28 years), whether a low- or high-featured model. Current Speed Queens are 710 RPM. My Fisher & Paykel toploaders reach 1010 RPM. The first GE and Frigidaire toploaders in the late 1940s spun at 1140 RPM.

dadoes...I got the feeling from the Miele tech he was referring to an average RMP of older, top loading units. I myself do not remember the numbers from our machines of the 70's and 80's, which were GE, Maytags & Amana. However from the data you site, it would seem the tech wasn't as knowledgeable about the older units. Our daughter has a top loading Whirlpool Cabrio, and I believe the max RMP is around 900. I appreciate your information. I was surprised at the 1140 in the late 1940's...which my husband's mother was still using a wringer washer!