New Trane system needed, quote review and insight

12 years ago

Would like an opinion of the following quote: The house is 3100 sq feet, no basement and about an hour northwest of Atlanta. Have NG hot water heater and furnaces currently and gas logs that are for looks mostly : ) Lots of single paned wooden windows....duct work has been inspected and recently cleaned and is fine. We may need to add one or two returns, at a cost of $150 each...Several techs have all advised a heat pump to have the dual fuel option and ALL advised the variable speed furnace..We usually have fairly mild winters and hot, somewhat humid summers. We will be in the house at least 10 more years. We requested Trane quotes because it is what we have now (but 20 yrs old!!) and we want something very reliable and long lasting.

Trane XL16i 3.0 Ton Dual Fuel Heat Pump System

Trane XL16i Heat Pump System

4TWX6036 Heat Pump

4TXCB036BC Evaporator Coil

TUD2B080A9V36 Furnace

Includes (if necessary):

Condenser Pad

1" Filter Rack

Honeywell IAQ Thermostat

Drain Pan

Water Safety Switch

All Labor

Warranty:

12 Year Compressor

10 Year Evaporator Coil

Lifetime Year Heat Exchanger

10 Year Parts

10 Year vendor Labor with on-going vendor Preventative Maintenance Agreement, they also say they will replace the entire unit if the compressor goes out within the first five years

Trane XL16i 2.0 Ton Dual Fuel Heat Pump System

Trane XL16i Heat Pump System

4TWX6024 Condenser

4TXCB025BC Evaporator Coil

TUD2B060A9V36 Furnace

Includes (if necessary):

Condenser Pad

1" Filter Rack

Honeywell IAQ Thermostat

Drain Pan

Water Safety Switch

All Labor

Warranty:

12 Year Compressor

10 Year Evaporator Coil

Lifetime Year Heat Exchanger

10 Year Parts

10 Year vendor Labor with on-going Preventative Maintenance Agreement

Replace current 2 system HVAC with 2 Premium Dual Fuel Trane XL16i 2-stage heat pumps, variable speed/2-stage XV80 Trane gas furnace. Current downstairs thermostat will be relocated to wall in den (approx 12" from current)

Also includes touich screen programmable thermostat, new pad, correctly sized outdoor breaker box, mastic seal all connections, aux. drain pan w/safety, rework flue to code, Ultravation 5" media filter, complete start up, all labor, warranty.

The total is $13,800....does this seem reasonable? It is a lot of money so we want to make an informed decision.

It does include a Ultravation air cleaner unit which they install on all their jobs apparently and as stated above, what appears to be a no hassle compressor warranty. Are there any extended warranties that are worth pursuing also, or do they run concurrent and are not a good use of $$$.

Also includes touich screen programmable thermostat, new pad, correctly sized outdoor breaker box, mastic seal all connections, aux. drain pan w/safety, rework flue to code, Ultravation 5" media filter, complete start up, all labor, warranty.

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Comments (12)

heatseeker
12 years ago
Go for it, you get what you pay for. Good warranty.
mike_home
12 years ago
How much is the preventive maintenance agreement?

Have you asked about getting a 10 year labor warranty from Trane? The vendor labor warranty assumes the contractor will be in business for the next 10 years. I would rather pay the money to the manufacturer and feel confident the waranty will be honored.

The Trane heat pump experts should give their opinion on the XL16i. There may be better options.
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carter, while the cooling BTUs for a two ton are about 10% short, it probably doesn't matter since you are going up in size. I do recommend that your ductwork be checked to verify it can handle the extra cooling BTUs. you also should re-check the evap coil model number-probably one of these below. 3427218 Active Systems XR15 TRANE 4TTR5024E1 4TXCB004CC3 *UD060R9V3 21400 13.00 16.00 3427381 Active Systems XR15 TRANE 4TTR5024E1 4TXCB048BC3 *UD060R9V3 21200 13.00 16.00 nice systems, price seems reasonable.either qualifies for tax credit. I would add a 4-5" pleated filter media box cabinet. IMO Good Luck!
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Thanks for the feedback!! Yes, I am considering the XV80 its $600 more, and the tech said it would help to further dehumidify during the summer making us feel more comfortable. In fact I actually asked about going up in SEER to the XR14. This is when he told me I should instead think about the var speed furnace. He said that going from 13 to 14 SEER would save me $30 ($10 per ton) a month during the cooling season (5 months) = $150. The cost to upgrade is $1500, so it would payback in 10 years. I don't know if I will stay in this home this long. Also considering the humidifier option, as in the winter it is so dry, but the problem is I have 2 units, the downstairs unit is broken which I will replace, but we sleep upstairs, so not sure if the humidifier running on the downstairs unit would help. I cannot afford to replace both units at this time, just this single unit is hard to deal with. I will bring up the sizing with whomever I decide to go with to make sure they do the calculation. When I asked, he simply said 3 tons per 1500, your at 2750sqft, so a little over but that should be fine... I don't think he was interested in doing the calculation. The duct work I have is the flexible type. Where it attaches to the plenum (I think that's what its called?) it is all taped up with silver foil tape, but over the years I had to replace it as the tape would unlift or unstick. I managed 2 more quotes one was $50 more, the other $1800 more. The quotes didn't provide any details, just turnkey Trane 3 ton 13SEER system. As tigerdunes points out this is basic low end Trane, if I went with a different brand would I get more features/product for the money? The first guy that came out and recommended the Trane, said he has access to all brands and said he could install whatever I wanted. I would need to decide. Thanks for all your help hotintexas
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Thank you for the attention. Yes I got the model numbers from a quote. I'm bummed to hear they are not a good match. That's why I love gardenweb though. I do not understand how to use the AHRI directory. Tigerdunes - I'm replacing a 5/3 split. 80% furnance because the install of a 90% (particularly the pvc vent) is problematic in this location, and if I'm going dual-fuel heat pump then I shouldn't be using the furnace that much anyway, right? I have a load calc on a different company's letterhead (last year). Cooling capacity is accurate, heating is a bit of overkill on the 3-ton side but I think that's because the furnace is being sized to the AC not the load. Reviewing the audit results from last year I think I will get more mileage improving insulation and sealing duct work than buying fancy equipment - it might even let me downsize from a 5-ton to a 4-ton. If you send me an email address I could share the energy audit if you want to see the numbers. Half of the house is over a concrete-lined crawspace. Trying to decide if it's worth spending ~$1500 to have it sealed. Humidity (especially in the basement) has been a problem this summer. so I'm thinking the answer may be "yes" but I don't have infinite money to spend on this...
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well, you say relatively easy, but keep in mind a new system is just that, a NEW system. they may be able to disconnect and reuse most of the duct work, but there likely will still be new returns needed. and ALL electrical/gas service has to be run new, as well as new linesets. it may not be as easy as you think. i was quoted around 5k to replace my old unit with a 13SEER trane. this was reusing my existing ducts and electrical and running new linesets. call around and get a at least a couple more quotes. there is no way anyone here can tell you if that is right for your situation from only a single quote. also, MAKE SURE they run a Manual-J to properly size teh system. do not trust anyone who just says, yep a 2 ton is what you need.
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prtyof4
Original Author
12 years ago
The maintenance agreement is $218/yr for both systems after the first year. It covers the spring / fall checks that they do on both systems and I think it is required to maintain the 10 -12 year warranty. I did not know Trane offered their own labor warranty - i will have to check into that, but I wonder if the installer would be the one to do the work anyway.....
I would love to hear any opinions on the heat pump! It is only a few hundred more than going with the 16i AC units, but it $1700 more than going with the XR15 2.5 ton and 2 ton heat pumps...
heatseeker
12 years ago
Generally company's that sell Trane or AS are good solid, established company's however I would check into who is backing the labor warranty like mike said.
weedmeister
12 years ago
When it comes to the HPs, I would want to know the price of your electricity and the price of gas.

I'm not an expert on this, but it has been said that the 2-stage Trane isn't all that great in that the two stages are not that far apart. You could save some $$$ doing the X15 single stage and still have a comfortable system.

Keep the variable speed blower. It makes a big difference.

Btw: is your choice between a gas furnace / AC system and a dual fuel NG / HP system? If so, do you have bids for the former? Or are you already decided on the HP?
mike_home
12 years ago
If your contractor is an Authorized Trane Factory dealer, then he would do the warranty repair under the Trane warranty. The differnece is Trane is paying for the repairs. The $218 per year is required by the contractor to maintain his labor warranty. You should ask Trane what is required to maintain the parts warranty.

It may end up costing the same money, however you will have the option to use any Trane dealer for future repairs.
prtyof4
Original Author
12 years ago
We are not completely sold on going with a heat pump..we currently have an 8 seer 2.5 ton AC and an 8 seer 3 ton AC with gas furnaces. It is a 200 dollar difference to go with the 16 i heat pump versus the 16i AC units (same VS furnace.)
For a 15 the quotes were:
Trane XR15 2.5 Ton Dual Fuel Heat Pump System

Trane XR15 Heat Pump System

4TWR5030 Heat Pump
4TXCB031BC Evaporator Coil
TUD2B060A9V36 Furnace

Includes (if necessary):
Condenser Pad
1" Filter Rack
Honeywell IAQ Thermostat
Drain Pan
Water Safety Switch
All Labor

Warranty:
10 Year Compressor
10 Year Evaporator Coil
Lifetime Heat Exchanger
10 Year Parts
5 Year Labor with on-going Preventative Maintenance Agreement
Trane XR15 R-410A 2.0 Ton Heat Pump
4TWR5024
This is $12,100.

For the AC option:\Trane XR15 2.5 Ton AC System

Trane XR15 Split System

4TTR5030 Condenser
4TXCB031BC Evaporator Coil
TUD2B060A9V3 Furnace
Honeywell Pro 4000 Thermostat
Warranty:
10 Year Compressor
10 Year Evaporator Coil
Lifetime Heat Exchanger
10 Year Parts
5 Year Labor

Trane XR15 2.0 Ton AC System

Trane XR15 Split System

4TTR5024 Condenser
4TXCB025BC Evaporator Coil
TUD1B060A9V3 Furnace
Honeywell Pro 4000 Thermostat
Warranty:
10 Year Compressor
10 Year Evaporator Coil
Lifetime Heat Exchanger
10 Year Parts
5 Year Labor

This XR15 AC option is 10,400.

I had not heard that the 16i was not a significant upgrade over the 15...i hope an expert will chime in. The sales rep suggested a heat pump in case natural gas prices stay low you would have the option of NG heat....
david_cary
12 years ago
$200 more for heat pump is a no brainer. Right now, NG is so cheap there isn't a huge advantage. But it still could pay for itself in a year or two depending on your rates.
prtyof4
Original Author
12 years ago
WINTER Ã¯Â¿Â½ NOVEMBER 1 - APRIL 30 BILLING
Service Charge @ $ 9.75 per mo.
First 900 kWh @ 8.50Ã¯Â¿Â½ per kWh
Over 900 kWh @ 7.60Ã¯Â¿Â½ per kWh
SUMMER - MAY 1 - OCTOBER 31 BILLING
Service Charge @ $ 9.75 per mo.
First 900 kWh @ 8.50Ã¯Â¿Â½ per kWh
Over 900 kWh @ 11.25Ã¯Â¿Â½ per kWh

Our natural gas is currently $.58 per therm fixed rate per 12 months...
harlemhvacguy
12 years ago
The prices for all the systems quoted are well within reason. I like the option of the dual fuel because you have the option to use the furnace all the time if NG stays low or as a dual fuel if prices sky rocket on NG. Make sure outdoor sensor is used for dual fuel control. I like the xl16i units but sometimes the added cost is not worth the return on investment. I also live in GA and find the xl16i not to dehumidify as well due to how it stages the compressor and fan. I would look into the xl15i to keep the 12 year compressor warranty.
neohioheatpump
12 years ago
I like the heatpump option for sure. I"m not so sure about $218 per year service contract. Seems like overkill. Thats just me though. Others might want a once a year clean check. I don't think its necessary if everything is running fine.
prtyof4
Original Author
12 years ago
Anyone have any info on using zoning? This has also been suggested as we have the proper amps already and are mostly downstairs during the day and upstairs at night for sleeping..It would use EWC zone controls and one 4 ton trane heat pump with a 80furnace...

New Trane system needed, quote review and insight

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heatseeker

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