Sans Vide cooking

10 years ago

Hi all,

While I'm considering to purchase a Combi Steam Oven, Miele or V-Zug I come across Sous Vide cooking. The later cooking technology looks quite interesting to me.

What I need is a convention oven for baking 2/3 salmon slices and bread, roasting chicken thighs etc. (not roasting the whole chicken nor 10 lb pork roll) and a steamer for cooking. I wonder whether buying a Sans Vide Supreme plus a convention oven would be more advantageous. The total price would be much cheaper than buying a high-end Combi Steam Oven. I don't need purchasing a high-end convention oven to do such simple baking/roasting job.

Advice would be appreciated. Thanks

Rgds
satimis

Featured Answer

barryv_gw

10 years ago

Regenerate is indeed to reheat. Many of the combi's have a reheat or regenerate mode - which uses less steam than normal combi mode, with convection heat to reheat but not dry out foods. I use it pretty regularly, and it is fantastic. The one caution is that if you leave it in the reheat mode for very long, it can water down a dish that has a sauce , like fettucine alfredo, or the sauce will get "rinsed" off the foods - like bbq ribs, so I avoid that mode for those foods. It does a great job with pancakes, and most other meals, and it short bursts, it does a good job with even stuffed shells, they don't come out crunchy like they would reheated in a conventional oven.

While I don't have a sous vide, from what I have read it is still a novelty item. It does a great job making food moist because it doesn't overcook, but I would not think it is a substitute for a combi.

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Comments (20)

applnut
10 years ago
I have a SOUS VIDE SUPREME and while I use and enjoy it on a semi-regular basis, it definitely wouldn't replace my combi-steam oven. I also am hesitant about those that say they sous vide cook in their combi-steam ovens. It's an intriguing concept, but I admit I haven't tried it, and am concerned about whether food that isn't fully submerged the water bath would actually cook safely.

Also, know that while I've never had an issue with my Sous Vide Supreme, it's not a true immersion circulator. My understanding is that the price of the PolyScience unit that does that recently dropped significantly, so if I was doing it again now, I might go that route. (I've had my Supreme unit a couple years now.)

Sous Vide is an interesting technique, but I don't believe it's a "for everything" kind of cooking method. I also don't think it's a necessary cooking element, at least not the way I (and most) cook. It's a nice novelty, and has helped me create some interesting meals, but after a bit of experimenting there are a few dishes I do again and again in our sous vide--mostly long-cooked beef dishes and quick cook fish--and those I try once, find OK, but not amazing, and don't repeat.

It seems as if you're fairly unfamiliar with sous video cooking in general and I have to note that there's a steep learning curve, and it won't be a style of prep that works for every cook, definitely isn't appropriate for every dish.

In terms of utility, I guess that a combi-steam oven is far more versatile and useful than a sous vide cooker for 99% of cooks.
satimis
Original Author
10 years ago
HI,

Thanks for your detail advice.

It is possible doing Sans Vide in Combi steamer or Steamer. Please visit following link;

AEG ProCombi mit Sous Vide-Funktion (in German)
AEG ProCombi with Ã¢ÂÂUnder VacuumÃ¢ÂÂ Function
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sycfOh8emH0

AEG ProCombi
http://www.aeg.co.uk/Plan--Design/Series/ProCombi/

I'm now looking at Gaggenau BS 270/BS 271/BS 274/BS 275 Combi Steam Oven;
http://www.gaggenau.com/hk/en/product/BS270/BS271/BS274/BS275#mainfacts

in re of Cooking methods:

Combi-steaming, steam baking, juice extraction, grilling, grilling with circulated air, grilling with steam, low temperature steaming, low temperature cooking, regeneration ......

What does it mean "regeneration"? To regenerate overnight foods as freshly cooked? Not just to warm up the overnight foods which can be done in most cooking vessels? I have been searching it on Internet a while and could NOT find an answer. Can you shed me some light? Thanks

Rgds
satimis
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foodonastump
10 years ago
From Modernist Cuisine at Home:

"The combi oven is the most versatile kitchen tool we know. It can do just about anything a conventional oven, convection oven, steamer, or sous vide water bath can do: steaming, proofing, incubating, dehydrating, and baking."

I can't speak to replicating sous vide in a combi oven. But I can tell you that sous vide can be cheap to hack together with a little ingenuity. There are products such as Sous Vide Magic which at $170 will control the temperture of devices you likely already have, like a crock pot. I don't know what, if anything, it can do better than a $20 digital controller off eBay, but I can tell you that with such a controller, a $15 aquarium pump, a $35 aquarium heater, and a cooler I put together a circulating system that holds temp +/- .3 deg C, if I recall correctly.

All that said, I'm having a hard time jumping on the sous vide bandwagon. My wife has flat-out demanded "No more sous vide steak!" but I've also had some desirable results, with pork in particular.

I'd take a combi oven in a heartbeat, and definitely wouldn't consider a sous vide setup a replacement for one.

p.s. You keep writing sans vide. I assume a repeated typo?
jwvideo
10 years ago
I thought it was a pun.

"sous vide" = under vacuum

"sans vide" = without vacuum = steam oven?
satimis
Original Author
10 years ago
Hi Barryv,

Thanks for your detail explanation. During reheat mode (or named "regeneration" in combi steam oven) is the amount of steam used under control? What will be the difference to reheat the overnight foods in rice cooker with water in the bottom bucket?

Hi foodonastump,

Thanks for your advice. You are right. I can get a hot water bath for dentist at much cheaper price than the Sans Vide Supreme. What I need in addition is a Vacuum Sealer.

Sous-vide is French
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sous-vide
Sous-vide is a method of cooking food sealed in airtight plastic bags in a water bath for longer than normal cooking times .......

Cuisine sous vide
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuisine_sous_vide
La cuisine sous vide est une mÃÂ©thode de cuisson des aliments conÃÂ§ue pour maintenir l'intÃÂ©gritÃÂ© des ingrÃÂ©dients et leurs qualitÃÂ©s organoleptiques......

Rgds
satimis
foodonastump
10 years ago
JWVideo - For a brief second I thought you were on to something!
barryv_gw
10 years ago
Satmis, I have a Viking, and for their reheat, the amount of steam is fixed. I think Gaggenau models, for the most part, have separate controls for steam and heat, so you could choose 300 degrees of heat, and then set steam to 0, 30%, 50% or higher. Note that 0 % means that the vent to the outside is open, 30% is no steam, but the vent is closed so any moisture generated by cooking is kept in the chamber, and 50% is the first setting where steam is added. I think the major manufacturers are concerned that the US market would not want to set the steam manually, so they have a set of cooking modes which have different amounts of steam - sometimes you have to read the manual pretty closely to figure out which is which.
fourten1j
10 years ago
I have been full ahead on cooking sous vide. I started out with fish, then moved on to several meats. The most impressive I've had was with beef brisket. And steaks (especially ribeye). My next venture is to experiment with different temps and times for braised beef short ribs.

I'm a full believer in cooking sous vide. With good planning, you can have nice tender meats for dinners, though you'll need to drop each meat in at the appropriate times before you want to serve them. So steaks are about 1-2 hours, whereas brisket, short ribs and ribs go from 48-62 hours.

Having a chamber vacuum sealer is very nice, as well, as is a torch to sear meats. The circulator I use is by PolyScience (they're also sold at Williams Sonoma). I prefer using plastic tubs because you can use the correct size, and just cover the top so there's no moisture loss for your 1, 2, 3 or 4 days of continuous use.

My favourite is to finish steaks by searing in butter and a thick aceto balsamico in a pan. Delish!!!

Here's a photo of the cooking sous vide process for a ribeye (60 minutes in the water bath):
fourten1j
10 years ago
This is the result of the ribeye after being seared in butter and aceto balcamico. It was so good!!!
fourten1j
10 years ago
62 hour bbq pork ribs with liquid smoke infused prior to the water bath.
fourten1j
10 years ago
The ribs were really really really moist and fall off the bone tender. Yum!!!
fourten1j
10 years ago
Here are the 62 hour liquid smoke-infused bbq beef brisket. It was like heaven!!!
fourten1j
10 years ago
Here is a picture of the actual cooking process. It's very hands-off. I let it run while I was away for work for the days. It's also nice that this stage does not need to take place in your kitchen; you could do it in your garage, a spare room, even outside on the patio.
kitchendetective
10 years ago
Is that generic plastic wrap that you use to seal the top, or something else? Also is the bin Cambro? OP may also refer to the Cooking forum for sous vide discussions.
fourten1j
10 years ago
Yeah, I just use generic plastic wrap when I do anything that's over 4 hours, so that the moisture doesn't escape. It's effective enough that I don't have to refill water.

I have no clue what the plastic tub is... it's just a generic one that Williams Sonoma gave me when I purchased the circulator. I also got a smaller 15L tub from a kitchen supply store (the ones where restaurants go to get supplies).
satimis
Original Author
10 years ago
Hi all,

Thanks for your advice particularly to FoxCrane for his detail explanation with photos.

Actually it is not difficult to build a hot water bath for "sous vide" cooking. A temperature controller, a circulation pump, a heating element and a circuit relay would do the job. While I was in Industry, I have built several similar systems for temparture control on plastic injection molds. Omron offers a wide-range of digital temperature controller in market for precise temperature control. But I won't build this system in kitchen at home. I would buy the Sous Vide Professional on market.

However before purchasing I would do some experiments in kitchen first.
I tried poached eggs according to following video. The quality is perfect and wonderful!

Perfect poached eggs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Mr5QNLbLcY
4 min
plastic film

Poached Eggs - How to Perfectly Poach an Egg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rtst1iRXI1g

I'll try "Sous Vide Steak" according to following video;
Sous Vide Steak Ã¢ÂÂ¢ ChefSteps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q21O515OLxU

I don't have Sous Vide Professional nor Vacuum Sealer. I'll use the cooking thermometer to monitor water temperature and water displacement method for vacuum sealing.

Seal Food for Sous Vide Cooking or the Freezer with Just a Bowl of Water
http://lifehacker.com/5978333/seal-food-for-sous-vide-cooking-or-the-freezer-with-just-a-bowl-of-water

Comment and advice would be appreciated.

Rgds
satimis
satimis
Original Author
10 years ago
Hi all,

I have done a test on "Sous-vide" for steak. It was quite successful even without the required equipment. I have put all data in respect of the captioned test on my website;

http://cuisine.satimis.com/experiment-on-sous-vide-cooking/

It is NOT a commercial website only to be used by my friends interested on cooking.

Summing up the experience on the test aforesaid, I have following opinion;

1) I'll consider building a hot water bath for "Sous-vide" with the temperature controller available on market, selecting a precise model.
2) There are already hot water baths, low temperature, available on market, which I can modify it for "Sous-vide" cooking.
3) Timer to turn off the heater at preset temperature is not important. Because the food must be removed from the hot water bath immediately at finish.
4) Even switching off the heater current water temperature in the bath still continues to rise a while. Unless we can remove the heating element from the water bath simultaneously. Therefore it is impossible to maintain an ABSULUTE STABLE temperature in the water bath.

Rgds
satimis
dcarch7 d c f l a s h 7 @ y a h o o . c o m
10 years ago
I don't check on this forum much. I am mostly on the Cooking Forum.

I have been doing sous vide for a long while. I will not cook meat any other way.

Meat is expensive. Meat shrinks 5% less Sous vide cooked. That works out to be a 5% discount on meat on all your purchases. You can turn very inexpensive tough meat into juicy tender meat, another great way to save money. If you spend $100 on a beautiful piece of prime rib, with sous vide, there is no possibility for you make a mistake by over or under cooking. The prime rib will always be perfect.

1. A vacuum machine is not required for sous vide.

2. There are now many sous vide devices selling for under $200.

3. I would be extremely careful about food safety with sous vide cooking not by water bath. Thermal mass (specific heat) of water to conduct heat into food is significantly higher than either moving air or steam.

I would love to discuss sous vide cooking with you guys over on the Cooking Forum.

dcarch
fourten1j
10 years ago
I just ordered a chamber vacuum sealer and it arrives this Friday. My remodeled kitchen has a drawer that is the perfect size to store it, so I pulled the 'buy' trigger. Cannot wait!!!!!

Sans Vide cooking

barryv_gw

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