Supporting stone veneer wall - Footing??

13 years ago

I originally posted a question in the Landscape Design forum, but then I found this forum where you might be able to answer it as well.

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/design/msg0807575829794.html

I am building a wall around my 4'x6' front porch. The wall itself is about 19" wide all the way around and 34"-40" high. I am building it with a treated 2x4 frame, covered with stone veneer. I figure each side will weigh about 500-600 lbs all said and done. (There are pics at the original posting)

So my question is what kinda of support do I need?? I was planning on sinking a cinder block at each of the corners for support, possibly driving down re-bar and then filling the blocks with cement. The other thing I considered was somehow attaching to the existing concrete porch with masonry nails/screws. I am concerned about the weight distribution and whether I am making a mistake by not digging a footing 3-4' deep or whatever. Do I even need any support?

Here is a link that might be useful: Original Posting

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Comments (3)

macv
13 years ago
The description is unclear. A masonry "veneer" is nominal 4" thick masonry supported on a foundation (that extends below the frost line) with a cavity between the masonry and the sheathing of a back up wall (wood or concrete block). If that is the case I recommend using concrete block behind the masonry veneer and extending down to the frost line.

If by "veneer" you mean some kind of thin light-weight imitation masonry product, I would use a cement board sheathing over pressure treated wood frame supported at the corners (piers to frost line) or a concrete block wall like described above.

Where the wall comes close to the house wall you must remove the siding and install flashing under the siding and over the wall cap (or into a reglet cut into the wall cap. Otherwise water will collect in the small gap and eventually cause everything to have to be removed and replaced including the wall of the house.

Why does the new wall need to be so thick? Why can't the platform be extended to the side wall (against the foundation with proper flashing and pitched to drain away from the house) and some kind of tile installed to cover it.

You could also consider covering the platform with composite decking and installing a wood or composite railing or bench around the perimeter.
landscapenewb
Original Author
13 years ago
Thanks for the response!
Yeah, I meant the lightweight option. The stone veneer is advertised as not needing the masonry ledge, so it can be installed in many more places. I guess an outdoor kitchen is a good example of the construction method I was thinking. I found instructions on ThisOldHouse:
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Based on other websites, it sounds like I should be fine building a concrete patio, and then the wall (or "kitchen") can be freestanding. I will make it approximately 6" deep on top of a gravel base, and be very careful to grade the patio away from the house.
I do plan on making flat concrete caps to top the wall.
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If you leave a gap there's a good likelihood of water finding its way in there. I live in a 100 year old house- trust me, I know how water loves finding any and every crack and crevice. I can't speak as to the "right" way to do a stone veneered, 2x4 framed porch add-on because I've never seen it done that way. It's not how I would do it. Where I've seen structures built with framing, backer board, and veneer is usually outdoor kitchens (and they use steel studs anyhow). They can work because they're all supported on a poured slab, so even if the slab moves/settles, it's all doing it together. If I were building this, first of all I'd be ooked out by the idea of wood framing in contact with the ground and tied into the house (because removing the siding and attaching to the structure is what I would do). Then I'd also be concerned about how I'm supporting the walls and columns without them shifting or settling differentially. To be honest, I would do footers to frost depth (or deeper if it's a new construction home), and at that point I may as well use CMUs (concrete block) for the structure. And then if I was going through all THAT, I'd just jackhammer out the stoop and start from scratch so it was all one piece and I didn't have to worry about independent parts moving. But again, I'm looking at this through the lens of how I would approach this as a pro. As a homeowner job where you're accepting all your own liability- it could work, I guess. Maybe. As far as the design end of things, I always think in terms of having Thanksgiving at your house. With your existing porch Sid, Myrna, and their three kids can't all stand on the landing while you come to the door, but there's still kind of a connection between the up and down spaces. with what you have drawn, it's almost like mom and dad are in the vestibule and the kids are still outside. But that's just one person's thought; I'm sure others will disagree. Yay internet!
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macv
13 years ago
Fake masonry against the side of a house would be a very difficult detailing challenge for me and I've been solving difficult detailing problems for a living for 42 years.

The real thing is often easier, cheaper and almost certainly lasts longer, but it is the manufacturers of the imitative/simulated materials that control the information highway. So, don't believe everything you see on the internet ... caveat emptor!

Supporting stone veneer wall - Footing??

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macv

landscapenewb
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landscapenewbOriginal Author

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landscapenewb
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