doublej, normally 4-6 weeks max from planting your seed till they are ready to go out. I used Jiffy-7 peat pellets which come in plastic trays with a dome. Just add water and watch them swell up. Pop a couple seeds in the hole at the top, cover and your done till they germinate and remove the top and put under lights. And people are going to say the netting surrounding the jiffy-7's is going to interfere with the roots is just a bunch of hooey. I transplanted mine into 4" "CowPots" using Fox Farms "Light Warrior" potting mix with mycorrhiza. When your ready to set them outside you plant the plant and pot. No transplant shock no nothing. Couldn't be simpler. Ami

If it were me I'd harden them off when in the 4 inch pots and I see no need to transplant them to one gal pots before setting them out in your 18 gal containers. And when setting them in the 18 gal buckets set them deeply and no need to add more soil as they grow.

I grow mine in 2 inch cells, harden them off in those 2 inch cells and then transplant directly to the soil or to containers. Yes, they may be a bit rootbound but that's what I want. I set them out when about 6-9 inches tall and that's worked fine for me thru my tomato growing career and that means over 2000 different varieties grown successfully over the years.

Unlike Ami, my experience with Jiffy Pellets has not been a total success b'c I find they wick water and I'd never but never advise anyone to use peat POTS for the same reason.

But do try different methods to see what works best for you.

Be sure you use a good artificial soilless mix for seed starting.

And it should take no longer than about 8 weeks from seed sowing to setting out so I think a January seed start is way too early. One of the problems you have in WA is cool Springs and there's really no sense in setting out too early b'c of that. As in temps being too cool to allow for effective self pollenization of blossoms/

Carolyn

For April set-out I wouldn't start them before mid-February at the earliest.

I agree with Carolyn that you'll have much better luck using cell packs or just about any small plastic container than the peat pellets. I've tried them several different times over the years and they have far too many problems for me to recommend them to anyone. Same goes for the peat pots and similar concoctions - most experienced seed starters will tell you to avoid them.

Good luck! ;)

Dave

I just wanted to start them early to get a jump on the growning season but, what Carolyn says about the pollen makes sense.

I don't plan on using the pellets or peat pots. I don't like either and have not had any success with them. Should I start them directly in the 4" pots and bypass the starter tray all together?

I don't plan on using the pellets or peat pots. I don't like either and have not had any success with them. Should I start them directly in the 4" pots and bypass the starter tray all together?

****

No, I would not start them in the 4 inch pots directly.

It's important to take the small seedlings at the 1-2 true leaf stage and transplant them b'c that way they then will develop the fibrous root sturture desired whereas if you seed directly you get a tap root sturcture which you don't want.

In addition, doing one transplanting also shocks the seedling and encourages root growth at the expense of vegetative growth of foliage and stems, which is also desirable.

And speaking personally, I wouldn't go directly from the seed tray to a 4 inch pot. I'd transplant to 32 cell tray plastic inserts with individual cells about 2inches. They can be grown to transplant size in those two inch cells as I mentioned above, or then transplanted to your 4 inch pots if you insist. ( smile)

Below I've linked to the info an the two different root structures. Just scroll down until you come to the tomato section.

Carolyn

Here is a link that might be useful: Root Structure

Used to use mix in egg cartons but I've used the Jiffy pellets 2 yrs running and have had zero problems that I can attribute directly to them.

I like the ease of bottom watering, the secure fit to their cells and the containment that the top of the netting provides until sprouted. The netting comes off easily at first transplanting.

They are not necessary but I've found them to be handy.

Starting early can give you a jump but you'll earn it and Jan is pretty early :-)

Have fun!

I have been lurking on this forum for a couple of years (a regular on the Florida Forum) I have gleaned so much incredible info from you people but none more valuable than the link on on Root Structure. It all makes perfect sense!! Carolyn, thank you so much. I am in the process of starting various heirloom seeds here in SW Florida for my winter tomato crop and seedlings to share at an upcoming plant swap in Boca in Oct. Today, I actually contemplated planting some of my seeds I would keep in paper/cardboard type pots that could be set directly into my containers and break away the bottom pot when the plants were large enough, without transplanting seedlings up to a larger pot in the process. This article has changed my mind completely about that idea. Thanks again to everyone for making me tomato-smarter!! I will continue lurking and learning! Oh by the way, I start multiple seeds in the plastic containers I get my Compari Tomatoes in at the grocers when the weather here is too hot to grow my own. The containers have lots of holes and a lid. The rain doesn't wash em away and they seem to do well. Here's some Homestead 24F seedlings just starting with a newly planted container of Sunmaster. I like to line the bottom with spent coffee filters with some grounds attached. Keeps the snails at bay. When I move them outside my pool cage
{{gwi:1376105}}

Doublej, when I gardened in Seattle, it was mid-May before the nights were warm enough to have them outdoors.

Here in Graham it is more like June 1. With our chilly spring this year, they stayed in a hoophouse and never did make it outside. The results were very good.

Your plants might not recover from April nights outdoors.

I'm in the opposite school on startng early, especially here in the PNW. you need all the lead time you can get.
I'm in the second year of experimenting. Last year
was a major success. 10-15' plants, lots of toms.

I start way too early, but put the plants out
about normal time.

However, this year, it did not help alot.
I started getting ripe toms on the first of June.
Then the alternating cold/heat blasts in early june and july devastated any lead time I gained. Knocked all the flowers off. I don't think cold frames would have helped in this instance.
So I have huge 10' plants with few toms. They are just now starting to ripen(stupice/glacier started ripening earlier).

Had it not been abnormally cold/hot, I'd of had
toms from June 'til now.

Related: I gave super early starts to my parents in home built earthtainers. They had toms in late may.
The cold/heat affected them, but not nearly as bad as me.
they've had ripe toms for weeks now. they are now sick of tomatoes and give them away by the bucketload.
8 plants, 1 big, 1 small, 4x 32gallon earthtainers.

If you want to experiment with just one started super early, make it the stupice. It's flowers withstood the cold
well.

But starting that early is ALOT of work for 40-80 plants.

This is my first year growing from seed but I did make a couple observations I plan on using next year...

I planted some in Jiffy pellets and found they dried out way to fast. The ones in the 4 packs didn't dry out as fast and had better root systems.

I recycled 20 ounce styrofoam cups and planted some of my plants in those as deep as I could leaving only the top couple of leaves. The ones in the cups developed the best root systems of all my plants...it didn't matter if they were started in the pellets or 4 packs.

I started my seeds the end of March and every day the temps were over 50 degrees, I would move them outside for a couple hours and then back in at night under lights before the temps dropped...probably a lot of extra work but then I only started about 30 plants. I am thinking the styrofoam cups made good insulators since the ones in these were my healthiest plants so I plan on doing the same next year.

I made lots of mistakes (I found out reading this list) but was very happy I tried. We have been eating lots of fresh tomatoes since just after the 4th of July...I will never buy starts from the store again.

I guess it never hurts to try. Have fun and see what happens. Kim

elskunkito, where abouts are you located in the PNW. Ami

doublej
Looking at your list which included Cherokee Purple and Mortgage Lifter I have Mortgage Lifter(estlers) and Cherokee Chocolate if your interested in trying a couple of varieties of Cherokee and Mortgage Lifter.
Jim
University Place,Wa

@meisenbacher
maple valley,wa.

If you have a window that will give you light to grow tomatoes I would start my first two to four seeds in 6 inch post in January.

Big pots make it harder to transplant, but the plants will be twice the size of plants that are transplanted from small pots.

You only need a very few plants the get a jump on the season, and have early tomatoes while your neighbors are just putting their tomatoes in the ground.

Here is a link to my Flicker PhotoÂs showing the first seed I planted last year.

Karyl
====

Here is a link that might be useful: My Flicker Photo's of First Seed Planted

Once I use up my peat pots, I don't think I'm going to buy any more. Last year, I started my tomato plants in small plugs. When they got big enough, I transplanted them into large peat pots. When they were ready to go outside, I transplanted the peat pots into their final containers.

Fast forward to end of season. I was clearing out the dead tomato plants from the pots. I pulled one out and the peat pot came out INTACT. It had never broken down or fallen apart, and the poor tomato plant, even though it was in a large container, was pretty much potbound still inside that little peat pot. Very few of the roots had ever found their way out into the rest of the container.

I used some peat pots this year because I still had some, but I made sure to tear them before I transplanted so the plant roots could find their way out.

I had the same thing with peat pots this year. They never broke up and handycaped the root growth. Later, I made sure to remove the bottom of each pot. Think I will do with out them next year.
I see Carolyn like to transplant at two leaf stage to develope better roots. This is new to me. Will some one remind me of this next Febuary?
Kenny

jwr6404

I got stiffed on my Mortgage Lifter. They were out of stock. If you have a few seeds to trade for what I have, It would be appreciated. You can see what I have above. Email me at john.l.jones1@gmail.com

K2marsh:

I don't have a window but I do have a 3 bulb, 48" light bar. A total of 120w of plant growth light in my bedroom where it can stay 60 - 70 degrees should be plenty. I am only starting 16 seeds and that will be thinned to 8 just before the second transplant and the start of hardening off.

Thank you to everyone for all of the information. I love this forum!!!

Hi Jim, jwr6404 z 8 b,

This year I am trying to beat the seasons.

Last year I covered my tomatoes in the ground, and had tomatoes that ripened in January.

This year I have planted a cutting in a 5 gallion container, and it should be starting to produce tomatoes by November. Before it freezes I will take it inside and put it on my porch. It should produce tomatoes for quite some time being at the peak of it's maturity.

I will start four tomato plants in Feburary in 6 inch pots to get an early start on the season. They should be in bloom when I plant them out being a month or two ahead of the people that buy their plants to set out.

Karyl
=====

Here is a link that might be useful: My Flicker Photo's. Covered toamtoes last year.

doublej
Tried to send you an e-mail. Got a failed mail.

I start most of all my plants from seeds ( I'm way too cheap to buy grown plants) and no matter what the kind of seed it is, I have NEVER had good luck with jiffy pellets or peet pots. The best starter container I have found is recycled jello, yogurt or pudding cups. I punch plenty of holes in the bottoms and use soiless seed starter.
I have tried recycled deli containers but they usually dry out too quickly.
Thanks for all the tomato info. I learn so much just by reading all the post here at GW.

Try john.l.jones1@navy.mil