Well I love la folie (before it became lounge), zuni, picco, gary dankos.

Noticed black krim and marvel stripe mentioned a few times and am growing and eating a ton of these. I want to try indian stripe next year which is like cherokee purple and an oxheart

I want to try indian stripe next year which is like cherokee purple and an oxheart

*****

I hope you mean that next year you want to grow Indian Stripe, which a "version" of Cherokee Purple and that you ALSO want to grow an oxheart variety as well.

B/c Indian Stripe is not a heart shaped variety. I should know b'c I introduced it. LOL

As for heirloom varieties that restaurants use, I sold to chefs for many years and it all depends on where in the country the restaurant is, how savvy the chefs are, what's available at what time of year, and so much more.

Carolyn

Carolyn

Yes, I meant I wanted to grow IS and also an oxheart. Damon (sportsguy) has been generous to offer me a plant so I am thinking anna russian.

I usually type too quickly on blackberry

Carolyn:

Just a curious question. How often do you feel the urge to "educate" the chefs on heirloom tomatoes and try to persuade them to use certain kinds ? I find there seems to be two things people are defensive about: 1) don't tell me how to raise my kids and 2) don't tell me what to do with my garden. I worked in restaurant for almost ten years and find it rewarding at the end of the day even though it was tough. Now I just see men all day long (IT world). How the hell did that happened ??? lol.

Out of curiosity, has anyone tried the "Early Girls from Dirty Girl" variety that is mentioned in this article? Any idea where to get seed for this? Thanks!

Ignore my previous comment. After googling, it looks like Dirty Girl is a farm that uses dry farming techniques to grow tomatoes. So, it's not a strain, but a technique to improve flavor by providing as little water as possible.

Some of the best salsa I have ever had comes exclusively made from Early Girls.

and
Daniel Patterson, Coi, S.F.: ..... But I have largely stopped buying heirlooms. They are too often of poor or erratic quality. .... Heirlooms are meant to be eaten warm from the plant, not schlepped hither and yon, which requires them to be picked underripe.

maybe he'd like this hybrid which is black, firm and it also likely contains some disease resistance

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Not that I'm an expert on varieties, but that's the first black I remember seeing that doesn't have heavy green shoulders.

Can you tell us anything about it, or is it a secret work-in-progress?

And more importantly, how does it taste?

The shoulders arent green because it contains the ug gene from one of the contributing parents. This particular parent used in the crossing scheme also contains the crimson gene (more red/higher lycopene) and several other useful genes (called Parent A below).

The black comes from Cherokee Purple, Black Cherry and Gary O Sena in the parentage background. It picks up attributes of those flavors but is more tart in this F1 due to the contribution of the other parent. I expect that to segregate out some in later generations.

This is from a cross of a hybrid x hybrid so the other offspring was different. The basic scheme was this: (black/flavor Parent B x Parent A) X (black/flavor Parent C x Parent A)

Here is a sister line that happened to segregate for the crimson gene. It's a little hard to tell in this picture but the interior of this fruit is more "red" than most tomatoes. It's flavor is slightly sweeter than the black sibling. It's avg brix was 5.9 and the black's was 5.5°.
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The reflected light is messing with the intensity of red but look how deep red the gel is

Having worked on the produce market for several years, I know that some restaurants do not want to order/buy everyday and need something that holds a little longer. Some do not want soft tomatoes because they will not work well in the slicing machines or may even fall apart in presentation. Some market farmers also need this trait so that fruit can be picked early when its ready and hold till the weekend when sold. I think what has happened is that with the introduction of lines like 'Florida MH-1' years ago that selection for the firmness trait has gone to the extreme based on the system and methods in place with little or no emphasis on flavor. That seems to be changing some. That said 'Florida MH-1' may likely be somewhere in the distant background of the firmer parent.

Both look and sound very promising, mulio. I'd probably go for the red one, since my brain hasn't entirely gotten rid of the "tomatoes are supposed to be RED" idea.

I gather that Europeans tend to appreciate crunchiness more than Americans do.

You mentioned restaurant attitudes. Have you found a prejudice against differently-colored shoulders on the part of restaurateurs -- or their patrons? Did you chose the parent plants hoping for uniformly-colored tomatoes?

Green shoulders tend to be a regional like/dislike.

Most times those are not seen in restaurant use (cut off or simply not used in a way that it is seen - see above uses from the chefs). It matters to grocers more - who don't really like it. I think it gives perception they didn't ripen correctly to some consumers. They don't sell as well.

Reds outsell here. Pinks sell more to people who are older. I live in KC and the Ozarks used to be known for pink tomatoes which they individually wrapped and sold. people who remember that think that is the way a tomato "should be".

Uniformly colored was just but one of the genes I was hoping to recombine. I was rather surprised it came out in the F1 but the potential was there.

I will probably go back and look at other F1's from this line.