Almost Eden 'Belle of India' Jasmine gamble

11 years ago

I noticed that Almost Eden (a wonderful mail order site for those who don't know) is offering two types of Jasminum sambac 'Belle of India'. The first is just labeled 'Belle of India' and the second is labeled 'Elongata Belle of India'.

My gamble is that the first Belle could be 'Mysore Mulli' and their 'Elongata' is probably the traditional Belle with elongated flower buds and petals that companies like Logee's and Pepper's Greenhouses offers.

I ordered Almost Eden's 'Belle of India' today and if it turns out to be the normal Belle and not 'Mysore Mulli' (yes I already have one small plant but I figure two in one pot wouldn't hurt) I'll just give the plant away as a gift. ;)

Hopefully the one I get in the mail will have buds/flowers which should tell me right away what kind I got. I might also be able to tell by the leaves (Mysore has more rounded leaves).

Wish me luck! :)

-Robert

Featured Answer

Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author

11 years ago

Welcome to the forum, Lakshmi!

I'm glad you're now posting. I've learned so much from people on this forum!

To answer your question, yes, I have measured the blooms from Pepper's Greenhouses (Accents for Home and Garden). They are two inches across with elongated flower buds.
I'm assuming that Almost Eden's 'Elongata' is the same.
AE's 'Belle of India' flower buds are still too small for me to tell what they will turn out to be ('Elongata' has longer flower buds than 'Mysore Mulli').
I grouped them all together this morning and snapped a photo (but it's not really that clear).
The sepals surrounding the small flower buds on the new AE's 'Belle' look different from 'Mysore' and my 'Elongata' from Pepper's so maybe it will turn out to be a different sambac cultivar all together or maybe it will turn out to be 'Elongata'. :)

The big plant in the back is Pepper's 'Elongata'.
The small plant on the left on the purple table in the orange pot is 'Mysore' and the plant on the right in the brown pot is the new 'Belle' from AE.

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Comments (52)

kandhi
11 years ago
Robert, Yes, I remember the fragrance it is strong floral similar to regular j.sambac yet there is difference. I like the double petal flower, it's so beautiful. I checked the AD website the 'belle of india' variety they have is elongated petal one, not the one I posted above. They do not have these available at this time. The elongated j belle has a different fragrance that is very good too. If you do not have that variety, you will love that one too but this is definitely not 'mysore mulli'.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Got my 'Belle of India' Jasmine from Almost Eden today.
It's huge! 2ft tall and very well packed!
Took me forever to cut open the box and carefully cut through the tape and rubber bands and what not (that's how carefully they pack their plants).
It has flower buds so I will resist the urge to shake off the existing soil like I normally do and repot with my fast draining mix and leave it be and see if the buds become flowers and report my findings if I think this could be 'Mysore Mulli' or not. :)

-Robert
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No-Clue, You live in CA so you might be able to find large specimens of 'Belle of India' though it only took a year for the ones I got from Pepper's to get large (I grow them in the 5:1:1 mix). :) As for Aglaia odorata (Chinese Perfume Plant) it does indeed smell wonderful though it is a light scent. Don't expect a heavy scent like a sambac jasmine will deliver. :) You can order them from all sorts of places like Pepper's, Logee's, Amazon, Zone 9 Tropicals, etc. Here's what I wrote about Aglaia on Logee's site- I grow many fragrant plants- jasmines, brugmansias, brunfelsias, etc. and Aglaia odorata is definitely one of my favorite scents. Ive heard descriptions ranging from a clean, sparkling lemony scent to Limoncello and Roy Genders in Scented Flora of the World states the following: Said to be the most exquisitely scented of all flowers, like vanilla but with spicy undertones. LOccitanes lemon verbena Eau de Toilette comes close to the scent when the real thing is not available. The fragrance is variable depending on ambient temperatures and humidity. I do not know why more people do not grow this wonderful, attractive plant. -Robert
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Thanks, kemistry! Good to join in with you folks. I have been on GW for several years, I tend to hover around and read posts on several forums, especially the tropical and fragrant forums :) I just don't find the time to post as much as I used to. I have to figure out an easier way to post pictures (maybe there is and I don't know yet?) directly from my phone, so i can post pictures. Most often, that is what keeps me from posting coz, a picture is certainly worth a thousand words :) I promise, this weekend I will post pictures of all my jasmines..and we can take guesses at what they are :) Roseyd, The first plant you posted looks a lot like traditional MM (Indian origin), the second one looks like an oriental version of MM. Since these sambacs all resemble each other, the only way to tell them apart is from scent. I wish there was a way to add that to the posts! I would be in heaven smelling all the flowers that you guys post :) TT (I know they are taboo here) classifies sambacs into three - MOO (single sambacs), Belle of India (MO, AK and MM) and Grand duke (Tuscany and Supreme). The origin is what makes them different. Hope this helps. Mrao77
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maanu76_m
11 years ago
Hi Robert ,

Can you post your feedback as soon as possible once it starts blooming. I want to take mysore mulli too.

Maanu
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Hi Maanu,

Yes. I will take a pic when it blooms and give my thoughts on its ID. :)

-Robert
dl99
11 years ago
Hello ,
I have been shy to post until now. I ordered the Belle of India from Accents, but it hasn't bloomed yet.
According to AE's description of Belle of India Elongata the bloom size is 2 inches. Have you measured the bloom from accents?
It may help. I am also going to order this plant from AE.
Thanks,
Lakshmi.
Dar Sunset Zone 18
11 years ago
Whoa! :O
Your jasmines looks so lush Robert.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Thank you!
Ah shucks...you're making me blush. :)
I'm actually going to try my hand at foliar feeding soon. I've read that many plumeria growers swear by it (and of course I want as many plumeria blooms as possible) so I've got all the ingredients ready (Dyna-Gro, seaweed extract and Coco Wet) and will probably try it this weekend.
Figured my jasmines, brunfelsias, brugmansias, etc. could probably benefit from it as well. ;)
kemistry
11 years ago
Hirts garden on ebay has a Belle that looks like mysore?

Here's the description for anyone who is interested ;) Strongly fragrant 1" double white blooms
Flowers are borne in clusters of 3-12 blooms
kandhi
11 years ago
Robert your 'Belle of India' Jasmine from Almost Eden looks beautiful, keep us posted on the pic of the flower after bloom.

Kemistry, I checked on Hirt's and the reviews are not that good on gardenwatchdog. Also they copied one of my picture i posted here on their site for this plant. When you click on the link below and click on the 'belle of india' plant, the 2nd pic their is my photo that I posted here on one of the discussion thread.
http://hirts-gardens.hostedbywebstore.com/s?searchKeywords=jasmine&Action=submit
kemistry
11 years ago
Hi Kandhi, you are right, i did recognize that pic of yours :).

I bought from Hirts before but this was over 2 years ago and it was a good experience. But yeah, do use ebay with caution.

(How are you and your plants doing? I miss seeing your plants' pictures on here! :) )
kandhi
11 years ago
I would be hesitant to buy from them, they should have their own picture source instead using copying pics available of web, but I am not that bothered with that. We tend to get tempted looking at the pics on the nurseries website and order them expecting them to be the same..

Anyhow, my plants are doing great,lot of new growth and buds. I will post the pics once they are in bloom.
dl99
11 years ago
Hello everyone,

Yes indeed, this website is loaded with information. It is addicting!

You are so kind Robert, Thanks for the picture. Your plants are so lovely.

I only had J.MOO to begin with, but after reading your experiences with fragrant plants, I couldn't resist. It is tempting, just when I think to stop,I will read about another fragrant plant and I begin to lust after it.

I also got Aglaia,J.Molle, J.Grand duke,Vietnamese gardenia from Accents.

Other fragrants include J.nitidium,Murraya,Tuberose.

Have you tried Tuberose? It is my favorite.

And when the Aglaia bloomed, it was a delight.

A question - How do you attach more than 1 photo?

Thanks,
Lakshmi.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
My partner and I adore Aglaia! We have two and both have blooms right now. We love it when it wafts over to you. ;)

I love tuberoses as well, but not as much as Kemistry!
I feel guilty that I've a pot of little babies that I haven't done anything with all season. I know they're never going to bloom at this rate. :(

Has your J. molle bloomed yet?
I've about three plants with blooms right now.
Very easy to propagate using the Forsythe pot method that Kemistry shared with me when yours gets big and needs to be trimmed. :)
I love all the different scents of the many different kinds of jasmines.

As for multiple photos I just copy the HTML link and paste and then hit enter to drop to the next line and copy and paste again.

Good luck!

-Robert
kemistry
11 years ago
Hi Lakshmi! Hi Robert!

Lol Robert is right about that one. If I have to live with only 1 plant, i'm sure i'll live totally-happily-ever-after with the tuberose. Lol.
sunhere
11 years ago
Hello All,
I am a silent reader of your posts.. and I always enjoy your posts and the pics.. I am an ardent lover of fragrant flowers. and thinking about these plants reminds me my childhood days back in India. it is sooo tempting to order for these plants online.. I could not find Tuberose in Accents.. Where did you order this Laxshmi?
I am planning to order Belle of India from hirts, there is a variety of tuberose on that site,but I am looking for the one in the above picture..
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Hi Sunhere!

Glad you're finally posting. Welcome! :)
The single variety that Laxshmi posted the picture of is commonly called 'Mexican Single'.
There are many sites you can order from though most offer them earlier in the spring.

Robert

Here is a link that might be useful: Tuberose 'Mexican Single'
maanu76_m
11 years ago
Hi Kandhi and Robert1971, I have a question regarding orchid bark, which one did you bought. Because here in CA we are getting 8Qt for around $6 which are insuffient for 1 plant also. Is Rose food( 6-9-6) is ok for jasmine or do i need to get dyngro. Also in e-bay there is a seller who was selling Mysore malli for $40. Is it worth or any comments

Maanu
dl99
11 years ago
Hello friend,

Tuberose is a must for fragrant lovers. It comes in Single & double variety. I ordered from touch of nature 5 years ago and they come alive every spring. They bloom in July for me. I prefer single because all flower buds bloom and fragrance is stronger. I do have a few double tuberoses which are beautiful but are pale in fragrance and quality of blooms.
Tennesse tuberoses process tuberose all year long. Other sites may have ended the season. both are good sites to order from. You won't be disappointed. There is still time in this growing season. A few mature bulbs may bloom for you.

www.touchofnature.com

http://www.tntuberoses.com/

Maanu, I have used Miracle gro for my jasmines since it is readily available in my area. I haven't tried Dynagro so I cannot comment. My jasmines have always rewarded me with beautiful blooms, but I am not sure they reach their potential since I have not tired other fertilizers nor do I have the luxury of giving them more warm weather - Zone 4 -ONLY 3 months of sunlight per year!
dl99
11 years ago
Hello Robert,
I read in a previous message that you use ironite to green up the leaves of the Jasmine. How do you apply them? and what brand do you use. When you find time, kindly elaborate. I have experienced yellowing of leaves and have not tried anything yet.

A picture of my Jasminum Nitidium. It has a fragrance which I do not care for, but it looks so lovely, like stars during the day!
Thanks,
Lakshmi.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Hi Maanu,

You might want to post your potting mixture question in the Container Gardening forum (I just looked and there are lots of posts about Al's gritty mix).
Someone might be able to give you info on where to get the materials in your area.
I do know that some people use Repti Bark for their mixes.
As for fertilizer I'm with Lakshmi and I'd use what you have until you run out, then you can order different fertilizers online like Dyna-Gro if you want.

Lakshmi,

To answer your Ironite question- Ironite is the name of a chelated iron product.
I use their granulated product but you can also buy a liquid form (there are many liquid chelated iron products by the way).
Just read the package on whichever you decide to try. :)
I personally just spread however much of the granules I think the plant will need and watch to see if the leaves green up.
Here's some links that might be helpful-

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-chelated-iron.htm
http://www.ironite.com/
http://www.ehow.com/how_7546355_fertilize-gardenias-ironite.html

Good luck!

Robert
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Woops!

Almost forgot Maanu's Mysore Mulli eBay question.
I personally wouldn't pay $40 for it. I went for the smaller one that Dhan is offering for $19.99. :)
Jasmines grow fast and I can wait.

-Robert
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Just F.Y.I. for those who are waiting for my plant to bloom...it hasn't.
So far the developing flower buds don't look like any sambac I've grown before. There's a green stem (possibly the style) in the middle of the developing flower bud.
Sorry you can't see it in my crappy phone pic below.

-Robert
Dar Sunset Zone 18
11 years ago
My 'Belle of India' had a single bloom today and I was shocked... Holy moly! This flower is pretty gigantic. It's almost the size of a Michelia flower.
The plant is kinda small and scraggly and the last time it bloomed was back in February indoors but the flowers were way smaller and had a very different appearance. This one is almost spidery.
Dar
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Aren't they amazing! The 'Elongata' Belle is my favorite sambac. I love the scent, the size of the bloom and their spidery star shape.
How lucky you are to be able to compare it to a M. alba bloom. ;)
dl99
11 years ago
Oh she is a beauty.Thanks Dar for sharing with us.
Mine from accents is yet to bloom. A few nice shoots have appeared.
Robert, My molle is a small one. I got it in fall from Dogwood(Ebay). It is growing well but no flowers yet.
This fall I will try my hand at the forsythe method.I did some reading on that.

Do try to grow Tuberoses. It is very rewarding.

Thanks for the ironite info. I did visit some stores and found a granular ironite which suggests 1 tbsp for 8 -10 inch pot. I will try that.

Eagerly waiting for your AE plant to bloom.

Hello Kemistry,

Thanks to you, I have added many plants to my collection.
Hope your plants are doing well.

Thanks,
Lakshmi.
Dar Sunset Zone 18
11 years ago
By the way, this one came from Accents. The first time it bloomed, the flowers looks exactly like the picture in their catalog that lasted for only 1 day before they turned purple, now I get this gigantic form that lasts a few days. I'm amazed now.

They smell amazing too! This one has a slightly different note than from what I remember in February. I can't describe it but I like it way more than 'Grand Duke'.

I guess first impressions are not always great, but I am impressed now. And to think, I made this one share a pot with another plant (that's delegated for plants I'm not too crazy about, lol, due my limited space/lack of pots).
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
We're probably growing the same plant (I got mine from Pepper's as well)!
I think it smells better than 'Grand Duke' as well. Sorta honesuckle like with a very high note.
She's the star in my jasmine collection. Laugh.
dl99
11 years ago
Hello everyone,
I got my Belle of India plant from AE, wonderfully packed with buds too. But the blooms were single or semi double like MOO. Belle is a sport of the sambac,so some blooms may be single? Kindly give your opinions.
Kandhi,how was your plant? did you have blooms like these & as the plant matured, did you get double blooms?
Thanks.
kandhi
11 years ago
dl99,
I am afraid that yours is not belle of india, it is for sure maid of orleans. It might have been a mistake on AE part. Email AE with the pic and ask for a replacement, they should take care of it.
dl99
11 years ago
Thanks Kandhi for the reply.I appreciate it very much. I asked John about it and he replied that sometimes blooms may be single, did that ever happen to your plant?
Regarding replacements he offered to send Belle of India elongata since that is true. I have another plant which has not bloomed yet, I will also wait and post the picture.
Any idea to other characteristics such as leaf shape which will determine which Jasmine it is ? Thanks,
Lakshmi.
bunti
11 years ago
Lakshmi,

That's definitely Maid of Orleans. If the plant is week or in stress, it may have smaller flowers not single flower. You have got wrong plant. It's very hard to tell from plant leaves. I can differentiate Grand Duke, Arabian knigts, Mysore Mulli. Other varieties are kind of hard to tell.
dl99
11 years ago
Thanks Bunti,
So both plants I received were MOO! It was only a mistake. AE is a wonderful nursery and they always have been nice to me.
I was hoping for Robert to post some pictures.He also bought the same plant. Do I wait till the second one blooms till I contact AE again?
Thanks
kandhi
11 years ago
Lakshmi, I am pretty sure AE will replace your MOO for the correct variety if they still have it.
dl99
11 years ago
Thanks Kandhi, They do have 3 plants in stock and John has promised to resolve this issue.
Meanwhile I am so anxious for the second one to bud & bloom. The wait for Robert's bloom picture is killing me!
Thanks.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Ha! Lakshmi, you made me laugh at work. ;)

Sorry but my little plant is still not cooperating! I've got it planted in the same pot as 'Mysore Mulli' to make it easier to compare blooms and so far Mysore is producing more flower buds but the Almost Eden one is being difficult. :)

I'll post a pic if and when it ever does bloom!

-Robert
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Okay. I might be done with this plant.
It continues to put out a couple of deformed petals and never really flowers and I can't smell anything.
I've waited and waited and finally cut it back and potted it into a larger pot with my Mysore Mulli but it's still making these deformed blooms.
Anyone familiar with this problem?
I'll probably trash the plant and just keep the Mysore Mulli in the pot.
The Almost Eden plant is the one on the left and Mysore Mulli (which I adore) is on the right.

-Robert
kemistry
11 years ago
Robert I had that same problem with one of my Moos in the past. After waited a year I trashed that Moo. I'm not sure what had caused the problem.

Your Mysore Mulli looks really nice! :)
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Good info to know!

Thanks, Kemistry!

That sucker will probably be in trashcan by tomorrow. ;)

-Robert
kandhi
11 years ago
Robert, sorry to hear about your plant. I did have similar problem with TTs Mysore mulli order one time that I trashed it after few months.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Thanks, Kandhi!

Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose with plants.

Interesting that it also happened to your sambac.
I wonder if insects or a virus or something else could be causing the misformed blooms?

-Robert
kandhi
11 years ago
Robert, Based on my experience when a plant forms deformed buds/blooms it does not recover back to normal blooming. I had experience with 2-3 jasmine varieties. One of them I had with this issue for 2 years and I finally trashed it. Cannot give to anyone else as no one else wants a plant that does not bloom. Feel bad to trash such a healthy looking plant but due to space issue for indoor maiintenance I had to do that.

Attached pics are this year blooms from logees flore plena that has double blooms similar to mysore molle and I noticed that as this variety ages the root and stem are getting stronger and blooms more.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Gorgeous! Thanks for sharing your pics.
I'll admit I've been wanting that one. Laugh.

-Robert
dl99
11 years ago
Mysore mulli is beautiful Robert.

I am sorry to hear about your plant.

Do you remember reading this
http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/houseplt/msg11070339533.html?15

Did you contact AE regarding this issue.

Kandhi such gorgeous blooms ,thanks for sharing.
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Hi dl99,

Thank you for the link. I've never read it before. Kemistry's plant never recovered but it's good to know some people's plants did recover!

I didn't contact AE about the issue.
I've received so many big healthy plants from them that I'm not worried about one especially if it is caused by fertilizer issues.

There is always something new to learn about plants! :)

-Robert
dl99
11 years ago
No Robert, my suggestion was to contact AE regarding the bloom blight,causes & a solution maybe.

I agree with you, AE sends healthy plants. This little issue wouldn't stop me from purchasing at AE.
Thanks.
birdsnblooms
11 years ago
Everyone's plants look great.

I'm green w/envy. Seems the only Jasmine I can keep is MOO. :(
For some reason, they die.

What am I doing wrong? I've tried Night Jasmine, 'too tired to search its Botanical name, lol,' several times, to no avail. It's been a few years since I adopted a Jasmine, guess I gave up.

Almost Eden is one of my favorite nurseries. Been ordering from John and his wonderful wife, Bonnie for years.
So far, I've never been disappointed. Toni
eena
11 years ago
hi i am interested in buying belle of india elongata below are the links
http://www.accentsforhomeandgarden.com/catalog_i7958432.html?catId=292393
http://almostedenplants.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=9822&bc=no

which is belle of india elongata
Robert (zone 7a, Oklahoma)
Original Author
11 years ago
Hi eena!

I bought my plants from Accents for Home and Garden (Pepper's Greenhouses) but I believe the Almost Eden 'Elongata' version is indeed the same plant however I have not purchased the 'Elongata' version from Almost Eden but from the pictures and descriptions they are the same plant.
Accents plants are cheaper but also smaller.
Almost Eden's plants are larger.
So it really depends on how long you want to wait for a larger size plant.

I hope this helps you decide! :)

-Robert
remy101
10 years ago
I am interested in different jasmine cuttings. I have cestrum nocturnum and roses cuttings to trade
Thank you