Thanks everyone. digdig, you make a good point about spreading out the fall color. Many trees just go brown and that's it, but some, like liquidamber and birches have lovely fall color. Rico, sounds like it worked really well for you, congrats! Any chance you can post a photo? (I'm very visually oriented.) The terrain goes over a gentle hill lengthwise ( middle 50 feet), with dry, somewhat rocky soil in the middle, and good loam on either side. That alone will force different planting so I have happy trees on that dry bit. The other side will only be seen if you walk around it. It's not visible from the road or from the neighbors. There are no overhead wires. There are underground utilities that cut across one section. I plant to just plant across it. If they ever need to be dug up, fine. My understanding is that most tree and shrubs roots do not go deep and will not interfere with them 4 feet down. Alyrics, you bring up a good point that I have been debating. Should I just plant some trees and mulch around them 4 feet and do crazy mowing between all of them? Or should I try to do a complete kill of all the grass with roundup and mulch heavily with wood chips? I'm leaning towards the former because it's easier. Although in reality it will probably be weedy for years. Right now I have a small hill of woodchips that I got from the highway cleanup crews after our October surprise snowstorm last year. (2 large dumptrucks full) I'm usually able to get woodchips around here pretty cheaply, so the cost of the mulch won't be an issue, it's more the labor of placing them. Groundcover is out, that is definitely too much work. Any thoughts on the mulch versus mowing versus weeds? Thanks for all your input.

I've previously mentioned that the windbreak brush that I have around my fruit plot is about 6 to 8 ft tall. It's an all native mix and I don't have a clue what it is. I just started to put in some spruce trees and will be adding many more when the ground thaws again. (We've got ice fisherman out on the lakes already!) I've been looking at all of the comments on this forum about currants and elderberry. Been thinking about gradually replacing the unknown brush with these 2 fruit bearers. What I think I know: Elderberries - several varieties - mostly vigorous - grow to 7 or 8 ft tall and are usually a very full plant for a good windbreak. Problem - Deer might love them. Not good for me (wind break is on the outside of the deer fence). Currants - several varieties - They would be a lower tier brush (only 3 ft high). Also a very full plant. May be too short. Potential problem - I've got Big White Pines about 600 ft away - potential for White Pine Blister Rust) Do fruiting plants outside the plot create new problems with birds or help solve them? I like that they attact bees and other pollinators. What are your thoughts on these or other low fruiters for the outside of a deer fence wind break? (remember zone 3/4). The OP (oldryder) is looking at the same opportunities/problems that I am.

I'm going to pile on here: Take the opportunity and plant a couple of apple or pear (real ones) trees. You have enough space so that fallen fruit won't be unbearable. Blueberry bushes are a delight - no thorns, nice fall color and pie, pie, pie! You only need two or three to get all the berries you can eat with some left for the freezer. That said, I would also suggest that you include one or two American elms in your parkland. They grow quickly, and there are several varieties out there showing good disease resistance. Look for 'princeton,' 'New Harmony' or 'Valley Forge.' You may have to struggle a bit with your nursery guy. He may be more interested in selling you ornamental pears than shade trees. Big shade trees like sycamores, tulip poplars, beeches, white and red oaks, white pines and European hornbeam are not high-margin species pricewise and he may even tell you he doesn't carry them and can't be bothered to plant them. Don't give up.

It is nice to see so much enthusiams for Virginia pine, but if I were looking for a nice conifer to plant for an ornamental, this would be near the end of the list, unless I was a collector and had everything else. But it is native to a wide area and in that area if you want native trees, I guess this is a good tree. For a good specimen, I know of one much larger than the one described by beng. In Lacy woods park in Arlington, VA, to the west of the woodland growing in a semi-open location is a Virginia pine that is about 80 feet tall and almost two feet in Diameter. There is another one not quite so large growing nearby. They are reported to grow up to 120 feet on very good sites, but I have never seen anything approaching this. I don't know how old this tree is, but I would guess something like 70 years. But generally these are one of the shorter lived pine trees. Well, if you like this kind of tree, that is good--I love diversity, but on my 8 acres here in Winchester I don't think I have room for one, and I may have something like 95 kinds of trees so far and am still going. I guess I am posting this because I don't want too many people to decide to plant this tree instead of all the other possibilities and then be somewhat disappointed. I am usually a defender of out-of-favor trees, but in this case I advise a little caution before one becomes too enthusiastic. --Spruce