You should contact Ebay and file a complaint with the form they have online. It would be interesting to see how long before the seller pulls the photo and inserts a new one.
Have you contacted Richard to let him know which photo is yours?

Which daylily is it?

Julia

Julia,

I failed to mention that this is not the same seller that has been mentioned before but a different one. The only place that they could have gotten my picture of Dixieland Band was here on Garden Web. That is the only place I have posted it.

Dianne

Ugh - Been there, done that! Even if you don't have a watermark on your picture, it is still copyright infringement for someone to use it without your permission. I have had this happen more times than I care to remember. However, all those I've found who illegally used my pictures (on the Lily Auction) except one pulled the pictures off and apologized when I contacted them.
In your place, I would definitely contact E-Bay.

Good luck!

Julie C~

I would first send a message through ebay to the seller and ask that they remove the photo. Believe it or not there are some people that don't think it is wrong to borrow photos until thye are told it is. Most of them will apoligize and remove them.

In the case of the scammer, they simply don't care who's pictures they use or wat the plant is either, they just want to sell plants.

Just a querry, is it wrong if you use it for your own personal use and not to promote sell or pass it off as your own? I often copy pictures of garden, home or daylilys that I have that have not bloomed in my garden so I can plan where to put them....personally I mark them with the extension .nmp (not my pic)...but am I doing something morally or legally wrong?

Sue, as far as my pictures go, I feel that they should not be used for personal gain(ie income, praise, awards etc). Using them for personal pleasure is fine with me(planning, layouts, desktop backgrounds). I don't know if this is how others feel....

I looked up DIXIELAND BAND on eBay. I had a problem with this seller a couple of months back (I am the one loney neutral on her feedback.) I Paypaled the payment to her immediately, and nearly 3 weeks later I still didn't have the seeds. She wouldn't answer my e-mails, hence the feedback. The only reason she didn't get a negative from me is she finally did send the seeds. I would immediately contact her and let her know that you do not appreciate her stealing your photo and you want your picture taken down immediately! I would also let her know you have alerted this community to her photo theft, and that you will continue to alert everyone you know in daylilydom that she is using photos that are not her own. I would also alert eBay to her photo theft. eBay may not do anything about it, (depends on who you actually get ahold of at eBay) but contact them to make sure it is on record somewhere that a complaint was filed. Make sure you tell them that she stole the photo from your web page without your permission. Be sure to list all the auction numbers that contain your photo. A while back she had dozens of seed auctions listed and those auctions were of very high-dollar plants. I wonder how many surprised people there will be (myself included) when the seedlings bloom!

While many don't think it is wrong, using other's pictures is against eBay rules and violation of copyright laws as well.

Here is the link to the policy and to report it to eBay. Using this link instead of an email will help it get to the right person at eBay.

Here is a link that might be useful: photo theft

fairysoapgirl, Thanks...thats sort of what I figured, (your pic's are beautiful by the way)..If I download a pic (of anything) I never pass them off as my own for any reason. If I needed a pic of a certain flower for a auction I think its just as easy to ASK for one...I think a lot of people would volunteer their pic just for the credit (ie: PIC provided by Janet X).

I could be wrong - and I'm looking a little further into it as we 'speak' - but I think that seller is a seed reseller. What I mean is that they purchase seeds from the Lily Auction (put in minimal bid on the low auctions) and then resells the cross on eBay. Perhaps that's why the shipping is slow? Maybe the eBay seller hadn't actually received their seeds from LA before having to forward to you?

It would also explain why they wouldn't have their own photos of said plant, no?

Anyway, again, I could be wrong. I just found it a little odd that the eBay person made a lot of the same crosses last summer as a good friend of mine did. She sold her seeds on LA so I'm waiting to hear if she had a single buyer that snapped up some of her auctions super cheap.

I'll keep you posted...

Marianne

It's possible, Marianne. BTW, she has 95 auctions up right now. Since eBay no longer allows payment by check or money order, a seller's address is eliminated on the invoice eBay sends to the winner. She did not put a return address on the mailer the seeds came in, just her name. I do have her name and e-mail address. She lives in Rapid City, SD. While she is using a lot of hybridizers' photos (as do a lot of sellers on the Lilyauction) I wonder if she is indeed even selling seeds from the crosses she has listed. Since I had to file a Paypal complaint to even get her to respond to me, I sure as heck would never buy another thing from her, but now that I know she uses photos without asking permission, well...it does not say a lot about her business practices.

Okay, just heard from my friend and yes, she did have some identical crosses on the Lily Auction. It doesn't prove anything as someone 'could' have made identical crosses. The Dixieland Band X Joan Senior and the Chateau De Fleur, Purple Pyro, etc. are a match to seeds she sold on LA.

Even if they're buying low on LA and selling higher on eBay, there's nothing illegal about that.

She did say that none of those pictures are hers. That would be her only concern.

Marianne

Michelle and Sue, I couldn't have said it better myself. If people are using pictures for their own personal use and not for personal gain (income) then I don't really see a problem with it. I have sent an email to the seller asking them to kindly remove my picture from their listing. If they would have emailed me and asked if they could use my picture, I may have said ok but they didn't bother to ask. It all goes back to the concept of "don't take something that is not yours".

judydu2, I am sorry to hear about your bad experience with this seller. Like I said, I will probably not buy any more daylilies from Ebay unless I know who the seller is. There is a lot of fraud going on right now and I would be pretty unhappy if I got a daylily and found out it wasn't what it should have been and that the seller knowingly sent me an imposter!

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and advice. I have put on my big girl pants now and I think I am getting over it. LOL!!!! :O)

Okay, there's a fly in the ointment. My friend just reviewed a few more of the auctions and she said that her cross of Purple Pyro X Mal only produced 3 seeds which she included as a bonus to LA bidder 'Rcnanni'. This is the same buyer that won all the auctions that now appear on eBay under seller 'gnomer'.

However, 'gnomer' is now selling 5 seeds of that cross. I do math for a living and something is not adding up correctly...

Well, well, well...

Seems as if "another one" (dishonest eBay seller) has been discovered! There is nothing wrong with reselling seeds...or buying any other thing to resell on eBay (or other auction sites). This seller, on the other hand, in my opinion, is bilking unsuspecting buyers. Bait and switch to say the least! And of course it will be two years or longer to actually see whatever may bloom from these seeds. What a shame!

I just did a little checking on eBay/Lilyauction. It seems that you were absolutely right, can mi. The woman "gnomer" is indeed a seed reseller. For what it's worth, here is what I discovered. She "gnomer" joined eBay March, 1998 and from 1998 to 2001 she made 2 sales. No more feedback for 7 years. She started selling daylily seeds on eBay September, 2008. She - "Rcnanni" - started BUYING seeds on the Lilyauction August 2008, getting her first feedback on the Lilyauction August 11, 2008. So it seems she started selling seeds on eBay one month after starting to buy on the Lilyauction. Since August of 2008 until now, she has 728 feedbacks (all positive) and all for daylily seeds. No plants at all. Where she is getting the pictures for all of her auctions on eBay is an interesting question...I did notice she changed the photos of DIXIELAND BAND on her eBay auctions that did not have bids (you can't change a listing once it has a bid..only add to the description). So, although reselling seeds is quite okay, I am assuming that she is pirating most, if not all, of the photos she uses on eBay.

She must be getting the pictures elsewhere as its unlikely these are from her plants. She may not even have plants.

However, reselling seeds is only 'OK' if you are selling what you say you are. How does a cross of 3 become a cross of 5? Only by adding a couple more seeds from another cross. And, like you said, if it takes two years to see the bloom, will you even remember who sold you the seeds? It's not like you can leave negative feedback at the point anyway.

I did notice that she's going for the low priced auctions on LA. In addition she's grabbing auctions with multiple seeds and multiple crosses that she probably breaks down into smaller sizes for eBay.

It could be a smart move if (1) ask for photo permission; and, (2) if you only have 3 seeds, then sell 3 seeds.

Hi all, a friend here just told me about this woman on ebay reselling the same seeds she just bought from me! Nothing wrong with that, but as my friend in the above post mentioned, she is selling some poor unsuspecting person 5 seeds of my cross. Here's exactly how my auction was worded "Purple Pyrotechnics X Mal 3 seeds", now she has thrown 2 more seeds of who know what, in the mix & has made her auction for "5 seeds" of this cross. & the woman has not bothered to leave me but one feedback out of about 16/17 auctions she's won from me. She has bought mostly seeds from evergreen parents......do you think they would make South Dakota winters, no way, that's why you aren't seeing any daylilies for sale from her on ebay!!! & I also stuffed her envelope full of bonus seeds, so she's really getting a boon from my trusting, generous ways!! Just trying to be nice!!
lynn18

All of her Dixie Land Band, Chateau De Fleur ebay seeds she's selling, are what she bought from me, I used irfan to make a double panarama pictures of each one of my seed auctions, I guess that's why she didn't steal my pictures, she is using individual pictures. I take back that 16/17 auctions she's won from me, try 24 & one feedback!!!!& if I said something about it, she would probably go in there & wreck me with 24 bad feedbacks!!!
Lynn18

Maybe she pulled two seeds from the Purple Pyrotechnics x Morticia cross, lynn18, or maybe just two off-the-wall seeds from some other seller's bonus seeds. Whatever the case, unless she acquired other seeds from that very same cross from someone else, they are not fully the cross she is selling them to be. I am sorry to hear that you were so generous with your bonus seeds only to find they are being resold. Kinda like a slap in the face for you and it makes it bad for those of us who really do appreciate bonus seeds for our garden.

I found her source for the 'new' Dixie Land Band photo - wonder if she asked Blueridge for permission?

Here is a link that might be useful: The Blooming Auction

Judydu2, you are so right, amazing what some folks will do for a buck. If my hands weren't tied with the feedback problem, I would really give her a piece of my mind!! You know if she pulled this kind of fraud with these seeds, she more than willing to do it again & again, & has probably already done it.
Lynn18

If Blueridge didn't know before, they do now! I sent them an e-mail. I seriously doubt that she asked for permission to use their photo...I saw no credit given to them in her listings. I wish there was a way for everyone who owns photos she has pirated to find out about it and nail her on her photo theft. There is no way she doesn't know what she is doing is wrong...

The photo she is using of GRAPE SODA belongs to LaCygne Daylilies of Kansas. Again, no credit given.

I have a pretty good idea that she just uses google's image search and takes whatever she needs.

I've been selling seeds to this Rcnanni for two years on the LA. She had a fit one time because a couple had sprouted. I even resent fresh seeds to make up for them, since she said she wasn't ready to plant them and couldn't accept sprouted seeds. She's all over the LA buying seeds.
I had looked at ebay and noticed that it looked like someone was selling smaller lots of the same crosses that had sold on the LA and with the same pictures. When I saw it was South Dakota, I wondered it this was her. Now I better take another look and see if she took any of my pics. I guess that it wouldn't bother me so much, but it sounds like some of the pics she uses are copywrited and that selling seeds that are probably not what they are supposed to be is a real downer. That is a horrible thought for a seed-aholic like me. You know you can block her from buying your seeds on the LA.
Nina

I guess those MANDALAY BAY X BASS GIBSON seeds I bought from them are not really what she advertized.

The really sad part of all of this is I sell a lot of Daylily seed on ebay, and it really makes things harder on me.

I bought some of that cross on the LA. Maybe gnomer sold you some of thr real deal. I hope you didn't get burned.
I think winter is just too long or maybe I am just a pot stirrer, but I just went through the LA and looked at all the seed sellers lists and emailed those where Rcnanni was bidding and let them know to look for their pictures on ebay. Was that bad? or am I just performing a civic duty?
nina

Nina, I say it's a civic duty!! Been burned once, it sure won't happen again!
Lynn

Hi Nina,

Maybe you should point those sellers to this thread. I can guarantee that if sellers have any problem with bidders on the Lily Auction one email to Mike Longo will fix it one way or the other.

To bad Mike wasn't running eBay, huh?

Marianne

I did point them to this thread. I hope they all take a look. One emailed me already with a thank you.
Nina

Can you block buyers on the LA like you can on Ebay??

Yes, you can block them on the LA.

Well, one thing is for certain...she sure is making a lot of Lilyauction sellers happy. Just today she was added nearly 40 more positive feedbacks. Rcnanni's feedback shows she is a good-paying customer.

The LILY MUNSTER photo came right from Shooter's website. I just emailed the Shooter's to let them know.

I have been able to find almost all of her images by searching the google image bank and then tracking them back to original source. Unfortunately I don't have the time required to let everyone know. I'll do what I can though because only the owner of the photo can file a complaint with eBay.

I'm not sure what action Mike Longo can take as she 'appears' to have maintained a decent rep on the Lily Auction. :(

Okay, just sent same message to David Kirchhoff of Daylily World - photo MULBERRY TRUFFLE

Sent another to a gardenweb forum member for her photo of ETHEREAL BEAUTY

I'm on my lunch hour at work so I can't keep this up... :(

that Tree of Gascone pic is from Gaskins website.

tracie

well, well. i just found one of my pics on her listing for Joan Senior. it is a 4 flower "bouquet" photo and easily recognizable.

tracie

All of the Lily Auction people I alerted wrote back and were grateful for the info. One went as far as to say he did feel "miffed". It just doesn't sit well with me. Maybe I should just get over it, but getting good crosses and growing them out myself means a lot to me. It's not just the money, it's the daylilies that matter to me! I also want to help keep the LA a great place. It's the best I've found on the web. I love how so many of the hybridizers take time to talk to me and talk about their crosses and what they are trying to achieve. We as users of the LA and ebay have to police these things. It's the responsible thing to do. People have been sued for copywrite infringements for smaller things. I think it's a good thing for all those owners of the pictures being used to know about it.
Nina

I recieved this message a few days ago.
Dear gpborger,

My name is Richard Norris. I am a hybridizer of daylilies. You can check out my credentials through Google. The person from whom you purchased Ginny Mitchell listed an offering using an image stolen from my website. It was of a plant that had never left my property. I complained to eBay and his listings were removed.
I checked out his other daylily listings and many are of fictional plants with stolen images. It is quite certain that the plant you received is a cheap substitute. It will most certainly not be the plant from the image you saw in the listing.
Please check out the discussion of this problem on the garden forum at TinkerÂs Garden. The link is http://forums.tinkersgardens.com/active_topics.asp or at GardenWeb http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/daylily/
We would like to see to it that he does not continue to cheat people in his offerings.
- norashwd14m1

Here is my response:
Dear norashwd14m1,

You say stolen from your website but you didn't say what your website was. I did however go to the gardenweb forum. The taking of others pictures concerns me for a few reasons. 1) I do not know if what I paid for is what I'm getting. 2) I ask permission from the people I buy from to use those pictures on my website that shows what daylilies I currently have. (I do not sell, only show)I did not even ask about yours yet because it hasn't been planted yet. Obviously I don't need to ask him though if they are not his pictures. Thank you for letting me know this though. 3)I know that many honest, serious daylily growers sell on ebay, Blueridge Daylilies, Northern Lights Daylilies, Marietta gardens to name a few, I know because I have bought from almost all of them. I would hate for many growers and sellers get a bad name because of one incident or one grower. I also wanted to let you know that I just checked and ebay has NOT removed this persons listings. Thanks gpborger

Hi gpborger,

Yes, Richard Norris is a daylily hybridizer (a very good one!) and yes, the eBay seller he is talking about continues to sell (god knows what) daylilies under fictitious names with stolen photos.

Unfortunately eBay is very difficult to deal with. They will only remove the specific auction that had Richard's stolen photo attached. Only the owner of the photo can make a copyright complaint. That means that the seller can continue to run auctions with other stolen photos until the owners of those photos come forward to file a complaint.

That, of course, ignores the fact that the plants he 'claims' to be selling can't possibly be what he claims they are because those plants have not yet been released by the hybridizer.

I have included the link to Richard's website below.

Marianne

Here is a link that might be useful: Ashwood Daylilies

Thanks bunches Marianne and Richard. I spend hundreds and last year thousands on daylilies and occasionally other plants but this person will not get any of my business again.