First, and most importantly, double and triple check *locally* the disease resistance of the roses you are thinking about. Then you don't have to worry about crowding issues, and the perennials can grow up to (and under) the roses.

So my answer for (1) is 'huh"? They just grow together. For (2), no, I plow through the underbrush. For (3), good roses don't mind some crowding. Whether you from an aesthetic standpoint what that kind of garden is a different question, but that doesn't have much to do with the roses.

Very ambitious plans. But before you go further, maybe you should decide how much time and money and effort you want to expend in spraying fungicides. Even if you get roses with good disease-resistance, you are still going to have to spray every couple weeks starting in early spring and probably through autumn. If you aren't willing to make that commitment, you have two choices: accept that you will have blackspotted roses, or cut back drastically on the number of roses you will grow.

I'm not sure how to answer the "how close" question. It depends on what the mature size of the rose will be. If the mature plant will be five ft, I would plant the perennial so that it grows right up to that 5ft perimeter--but I would also have to figure how wide the perennial will be at maturity. In other words, their mature drip lines should touch.

I don't plant directly under a rose because I want to be able to pull back the mulch periodically and apply fertilizer and other things to the rose. However, I do plant some shorter plants directly in front of the rose, again at the mature perimeter.

I imagine lots of gardeners do it different ways. My experience is that most people greatly underestimate the mature size of their plants and then end up having to dig up some of them later so that there will be enough room for the other plants.

Hope that helps.

Kate

Because the size of a plants root system is related to the size it is above ground, I plant perrenials that are one-third or shorter than the nearest rosebush. Violets, Old fashioned Pinks, Lavender and Chinese forget-me-not are some of my favorites.
I love Iris, but in California they spread quickly forming a tight mass beneath ground and can choke a new own-root rosebush, so I've planted just a couple Iris, towards the sides of a rose garden, with smaller rooted perrenials between them and the nearest rosebushes.
Landscapers draw circles where each plant is, with its' name on paper, before they plant. If I were planting a garden the size of yours, I'd spend a bit of time doing this on grid paper, with inches corresponding to feet.
I'd plan it out in 10 foot long sections.
Best wishes for a beautiful rose garden,
Lux.

Luxrosa's advise is excellent. I would add, be careful about the perennials you choose; stay away from anything "invasive" or in 3 years you will be wildly pulling plants out.

Unlike Dublinbay, I prefer a no-spray garden and therefore live with blackspot. Besides choosing roses that are more resistant, the best defenses are no overhead watering and good air flow, both around and thru the rose. Before you go for any kind of spray program, please read the labels, find the active ingredients, and read about their effects. Then make an informed decision about whether you want those effects in your garden (and on your planet).

Also, unless you are planning and have the willpower to maintain a fairly formal garden, eventually you will stick all sorts of things wherever you have space. This is offically called a "Cottage Garden" or sometmes and English Garden. Roses do very well in Cottage Gardens.

catsrose, I did not say I prefer a spray garden. The poster was complaining about blackspot and I told him the truth: either he will have to spray or he will have to live with some blackspot. Airflow alone won't stop blackspot (though it can help)--that is one reason why I told him to get some disease-resistant roses--to increase the odds that his roses will stay healthier. But I think he may have to spray anyway if he wants to eliminate BS--the PA posters seem to regularly complain about the high BS rate in their state.

Please do not put words in my mouth. I did not state my preference, but just stated the facts.

Kate

My apologies, Kate. You suggested a spray routine and I jumped to conclusions. And you are correct. To eliminate BS completely, one usually does have to spray regularly. I was too focused on being sure that poster understood that spraying also has a price.

catsrose--no problem. And I'm glad you reminded posters that there are alternative approaches to gardening that are better for one's health and for the environment.

Kate

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone.
For the record, I'm a "She". :-)
I pretty much have all the roses that I'm going to grow either in ground or in pots growing out. My selections have all been shrub rose type and those reputed to be hardy to zone 6. I figured I would get blackspot no matter what, so that wasn't part my choice matrix.

Setting them out in what is currently lawn has been hard on them, I think as the weeds and grass quickly grow into their spaces and I am looking forward to incorporating them into the border so that the mowing and pulling of grass rhizomes out of their root spaces can stop. Also, with the high price of gas, who wants to constantly be mowing to keep the grass down around plants?

I have found that practically anything I have planted grows twice as large as I expect it will. I have a lot of relocating to do and have to search for more perennials that will really stay shorter in my soil and nearer the roses.

All I have to say is I hope you post some beginning pics and pics during the process so we can see the changes from the beginning on. Good luck to you! Judy

Save your back! Instead of digging out the entire area, there is an alternative. Lasagna Gardening. Do a search on this board for more information. I have seen many successful flower beds that were created using this method.