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Hybrid Musks Vs. Noisettes

12 years ago

I have several roses in each of these two classes and I have found that noisette roses outperform the hybrid musks in my garden. Of course, I love the hybrid musks, but they seem to only bloom in the spring and again in the fall. Has anyone else experienced this or is it that hybrid musks bloom less during times of high temps?

Molly

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Comments (6)

jerijen
12 years ago
Molly, here near the CA coast, I find that the HMs do perform best in the cool spring months. I also find that they need more water to do their best than my Noisettes require.

Jeri
ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
12 years ago
The hybrid musks have never done well for me in Southern California, and I've tried them in three different gardens. At the same time, the noisettes haven't prospered as well for me as the teas and Bourbons, for instance. Neither type seems overly fond of hot, dry heat.

Ingrid
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Well, my Bubblebath turned out to be mislabelled (I think it's actually Cornelia) so that's not a good data point. I've planted all my bands directly into the ground. I like to order/put them in around September when we start to get decent rain. They go dormant and grown roots all winter, then really take off in the spring. I've planted well over 100 roses this way, and only lost a few (and those looked like the roots were really too tiny for them to have been sold.) It probably all depends on where you live and what your soil & weather conditions are. I put some in later this spring due to some various sales, and they haven't done nearly as well as the fall planted bands. Of course, we've been having ridiculously dry weather--only about 1/3" total rain for the last 3 months, and NOTHING is like rain for watering the plants.
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You might ask the folks at the Antique Rose Emporium, with their experience with roses in the south. They offer a lot of Hybrid Musks. This information probably isn't very directly useful to you, since a rose's performance depends so much on climate BUT I wish to put it on the record that a happy mature plant of 'Cornelia' is one of the most flawlessly beautiful sights in the entire rose kingdom. Like any work of art it's greater than the sum of its parts. About the habit of the Hybrid Musks, some have a shrubby self-supporting habit, for example 'Felicia', while others are like pocket ramblers, with flexible canes that are easy to trellis: 'Cornelia' falls into this class. You can grow it without support, but it will lounge, like 'Buff Beauty' in the photo above. Melissa
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R. moschata is a fine rose, that has a 3 month bloom season, from august 1 through Halloween and then some. Gorgeous leaves and growth habit and its' fragrance has a wafting trait that can spread several feet from the bush. vintage also sells several remontant musk roses that I have yet to track down when I'm there on dirt day, but I'd love to see "Reverend Seidel" in person. I love 'Secret Garden Climbing Musk' (remontant, but of unknown breeding) Hybrid Musk were once bred and named 'Pemberton Roses' in England by the man , whom I believe, bred many of the best in that class. I've grown c. a dozen Hybrid Musks and my favorites include 'Cornelia' coppery glints on pink, stamens show on some blooms. 'Callisto' yellow and fragrant, musky-rose. 'Maid Marion' 'Penelope' as well as 'Queen of the Musks' red buds, open to creamy white to light pink roses. and 'Bubble Bath' for its scent. Lux.
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Comments (23)
Thanks, everyone! I ordered from ARE last week: Cornelia, Madame Berkeley, Mutabilis, Sally Holmes, and Marie Van Houtte. These last three didn't come up on this thread, so hope I chose well. Mutabilis and Sally were on my want list, but I had forgotten about them. I've seen both around here looking really stunning. Marie Van Houtte was more of an impulse buy. I wanted Mrs Dudley Cross, but read MVH is less prone to mildew. Rosette Delizy was also a contender, but her color not as good with my existing plants. I really wanted to order the Cochets, but restrained myself due to the balling. Sigh... Marie VH and Mme Berkeley will have lots of sun; Mutabilis, mostly sun; Sally H will have morning sun. Not sure yet about where to plant Cornelia. I've read conflicting reports about how much sun she likes. I'll probably get one more shade tolerant rose- maybe Pax, Buff Beauty, or Reve D'or. My clay soil is waterlogged, so I'll probably need to wait awhile to plant. No complaints about the rain, though!
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jardineratx
Original Author
12 years ago
Jeri, you are probably right about the HMs needing more water and cooler temps. We had a sprinkler system put in this March and the noisettes have really responded to the increased water and are blooming more than ever.(Mary Washington, Jeanne d'Arc, Natchitoches Noisette, Blush Noisette and Fellenberg). The HMs, however, are still refusing to bloom this summer, so I believe Ingrid is right in her determinatin that heat is a problem for this class of rose. Of course, there are always exceptions and my NurMahal is beautiful in spite of the heat.
sherryocala
12 years ago
My Nur Mahal started improving, i.e., keeping leaves on him and blooming, when I added a sprayer at his feet AND he's in only part morning sun on the northeast corner of the house. My other HMs are gone. I guess they're not meant for the heat. I have Blush Noisette, Princesse de Nassau and Fellemberg. They are surprisingly slow to mature, but I'm hopeful.

Here is a link that might be useful: If only sweat were irrigation...
jerijen
12 years ago
They are lovely, lovely roses. They just have . . . NEEDS.

Jeri
spiderlily7
12 years ago
We're in the second year of drought in south Louisiana, and the heat index will be 105 degrees today, but with a little extra water from a sprinkler, Darlow's Enigma continues to pump out huge quantities of bloom. Buff Beauty is also blooming, though not as copiously.

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