Keeping the poo on ground doesn't do anything for it except dry up and smell some more. It will encourage other dogs to simply mark their territory and poop/pee over it- just a hot mess!

I've noticed that dogs are pretty fastidious about where they step - just like Cheech and Chong, they don't want to step on it.

https://youtu.be/Gj_Mwvsabfo

I've used that observation to get dogs to not poop in particular places. I've collected dog poop, dissolved it in water, and poured that water around trees that I don't want dogs to pee on, etc.

Gross, I know, but it works.

>>I figured the moisture from the poop will break up the dry clay, along with the fallen leaves I bury with it. Works like a charm!

I bet it does, but it's the combination of organic matter + biological activity that improves the clay, rather than the moisture.

Agreed, but, the moisture does help. If I buried the poop dry along in rock-hard dry clay soil, the biodegradability will be slower or just preserve the dry poop if there's no moisture to move it along. There's a reason why stuff doesn't break down as easy if exposed out in the desert! Preserved dried turds like the stuff I see out when I walk- people leaving out their dog's poo to dry on the cement.

Oh, I didn't know you were in the desert!

I have not read the above comments and solely replying to the original post. I have always cleaned up dog poop before I mow the lawn. I can't imagine allowing myself to breathe in the fine dust like particles that would be released into the air when the mower blades hit the dried poop ... no thank you, just who knows what parasites and pathogens might be contained within, ugh!

Am I the only one who picks it up and flushes it? I do clean my toilet very throughly 3-4 times a week, though, and I wouldn't do this if she had diarrhea.

Sandra, I pick up and flush my dogs' poop in the winter when the ground is too hard for me to bury it.

That's better than the landfill which is where most of it ends up!

I guess some municipalities can't handle the added fecal material or processing of inhuman pathogens that would accumulate if everyone flushed their dogs' poop, but she licks my daughter's mouths after she cleans her butt and she hasn't gotten sick and we live in NYC, so I'd bet our sewage plants have had to sterilize a lot worse than what my mutt adds to the mix.

Sandra, I just went to a wastewater treatment citizen class. Once the fecal matter is in the system, its really indistinguishable at the processing plant- its all about making sure what goes in is filtered through a sieve, then the residual sediment is scooped up for incineration then is trucked to a fertilizer company like Scott (for free). The fluid side is "chomped up" of by the resident bacteria in the holding tank and goes through UV filtering system as the final recycle process (for recycled water or flowing back to the waterways. All the treatment plant is worried about are wipes and other non-organic material clogging and busting the sewer pipes as well as chemicals that will mess up the bacterial decomposition process- poop is poop and will break down as is should when flushed by water. Since most systems are gravity fed, they are just happy there is "flow" going through the sewer system to move things along to the sewer plant to be processed. That's what truly matters.

Thanks, Shasa. This stuff fascinates me.

Shasa, different places have different treatment regimes, but in many places (most?) the residual sediment (or sewage sludge) is not burned. They let the solids settle out, and then those solids are also 'chomped up' by bacteria - with various technologies involved, both anaerobic and possibly aerobic bacteria, hopefully capturing any methane (biogas). All this reduces volume and then may be treated by processes akin to pasteurization to remove nasties, and usually 'dewatered' (water removed in part - with the water going back into the fluid process you describe). In most jurisdictions there are regulations for when it's safe to use on farmer's fields and how to apply it, etc.

It's true though that their biggest concerns are non-biodegradable stuff like wipes going into the system. Don't want to get too specific, but while we might think of 'poop' as a solid, for the sewage system, it'll partly dissolve or get mixed in with water, some will settle out into sludge. Most 'biological waste' in the sewage will be mostly (90% or more) water or stuff that dissolves or is suspended in water while being treated (including a lot of the microbes like bacteria), some will settle out - a little bit like coffee particles. Then even the stuff that settles out will also be 'chomped on' and reduced in volume/weight.

In the past I heard that sewage utility types discouraged dog poop because it had too much stuff that settles out - grit, sand, whatever; personally I don't find that a convincing argument against but I'm not a specialist.

I can't imagine that pet waste is so much different from human that it would be noticeable at the sewage plant, especially since the number of pets is usually quite a bit smaller than humans in the average community. And there's plenty of grit in the sewer system already - think of all the washing that goes on in the average house, and all that goes down the drain. Everything from vegetables in the kitchen sink to Junior's muddy sneakers to kitchen floor mop water.

Sewage does look pretty much like murky water when it gets to the treatment plant. The whole process is designed to remove dissolved and suspended organics from that water so the water is clean enough to be discharged, and then to manage the residues.

I agree, as I said, I don't find the argument that dog poop is somehow different at all convincing or persuasive. Sewer systems are designed to handle poop; I can understand they don't want the effluent from a pig or dairy farm dumped in the sewage system, but that's a different situation (volume especially).

Yep, it's all about volume. Unless there was a huge campaign to get residents in a certain place to flush pet poop, any gradual trends on that are going to be almost unnoticeable. As opposed to hooking up a CAFO to a municipal sewer system, which would likely overload all but the largest plant immediately. Not that we shouldn't do that - some CAFOS produce more manure than a small town and yet it's not treated like human sewage because it gets an ag 'exemption'. <eyeroll>

Cleliaft, good on you for your diligent clean ups. I have lived both on a farm and now on an acreage and never had to clean up after any of our dogs, they did their thing out away from the house and yard, very thoughtful of them, lol. I know what you mean about flies, back on the farm they were gawd awful and would sit and warm themselves en masse on the side of the house and constantly pester one if you'd choose to sit outside and relax! But, here on the acreage, there's sooo few of them that only one or two might enter the house if we left the doors open all day (not that we'd do that though) and relaxing outside is a breeze, well other than the dang mosquitoes!

Whenever a fly lands on your food, consider the last place it may have visited. I'll leave the rest to your imagination.

toxcrusadr said, "I can't imagine that pet waste is so much different from human that it would be noticeable at the sewage plant, ...."

Shana said, "Just like I said, poop is poop and is indistinguishable from anything else that goes thru the sewer system."

Later there was some discussion about volume of the waste to help clarify.

Poop is not poop. Most pet owners have been frightened into administering monthly doses of insecticide to their pets as a dewormer for heartworms and other parasites. That dewormer medicine persists through digestion and remains toxic to decomposing insects long after being deposited on the ground. The poop itself is an insecticide. In my experience normal, unmedicated, pet poop will completely disappear in 12 hours or less due to the action of flies, pill bugs, and other natural dung decomposers. I have pictures (somewhere on my old phone). My pets are not medicated. When I moved out to rural Texas, I wanted to test this idea. I watched my dog drop a load and placed a wire landscape flag at the spot. Within a minute there were flies getting busy on it. Five hours later I came back and took a picture. There was nothing but a wet spot and a few pill bugs where the poop had been. In the winter it does not work this perfectly, but in the summer I never see dog poop in my yard.

Hmmm......I cannot agree with this one. My dog is also unmedicated for internal parasites - they are just not much of an issue here and he is mostly an indoor pet anyway - but no way does his poop disappear within a day. Often not even within a week!!

If I am not prompt in my poop scooping, they will be very dried turds in summer, persisting until I collect them, and winter, a rather disgusting watered down goo that hopefully will eventually melt into the soil. I don't go out onto my lawn much in winter :-)

gardengal, I must have a better organic program going on...bwahahahaha. Well I don't know why the difference. In the winter it takes about 4 days for the poop to 'melt' down through the grass and become indistinguishable with the soil. If you accidentally stepped on it on day 3, it was soft like putty, but not sticky at all. Ask me how I know that - and ask me when I started wearing shoes all the time in the garden.

I think, according to our water district (which just last week sent notices again about this with our water bills) that it is not dog poop entering the sewage system that is a problem, but when left on the ground (even at homes with large acreage) too much poop contamination enters storm sewers or streams & creeks, leading to problems with the water quality in those creeks and rivers - bad for the aquatic wildlife - and sources of drinking water for many (so more $ to make the water potable).

Our neighbor's dogs free roam the area and poop everywhere. I don't notice any smell, but it seems to last forever. They stay out of my veggie garden, so I don't complain. Our husky uses our very much smaller fenced back yard. I can't find it to clean it up. There is no smell out there at all, and no dead spots. I wonder if it is a combination of the food we use as well as our humid climate? It dissappears quickly.

when my dog poops in alabama some parasite covers the poop up with sand. What is doing that? tremendousman@aol.com

Maybe the dog? :-]

I missed the earlier posts about dewormer medications. I would have to know what medications are typically used to look up any info about their persistance. All I can say at this point is that animal drugs, as well as human drugs, are tested for their ability to break down in the environment before going on the market. Obviously they don't all break down 100% instantly, which is why you can find them in tiny amounts in the rivers downstream of cities. But this IS part of the registration process, just like with pesticides. I even did studies personally when I worked in the field, such as how fast a turkey antibiotic breaks down after being pooped out by the turkey. Also I would add that just because a drug is toxic to an intestinal parasite, does not mean it will automatically be toxic to flies, worms, bees etc. It's more complicated than that.

@dahner laurence: could be any number of insects. Ants and dung beetles (or other beetles) are candidates. Note, not necessarily parasites - detritus feeders or those that use for egglaying or breeding.

I have read that cattle people believe deworming meds kill the dung beetle in larval form. I don't have the background to say whether that applies to dog meds or even if it's true, just saying one potential explanation for the variability. (and certainly not saying one should not treat their dogs if necessary). Note also that dung beetles may not prefer some climates Esp colder.

I don't think we have them here in the Midwestern US. I've certainly seen them on TV but usually in tropical climates. No one seems to talk about them around here.

Depending what you feed, your mileage may vary. When we fed raw, dog poo turned to white powder and disappeared. "Dog food" leads to much less desirable waste.

It looks disgusting on the garden and on the bottom of your shoes 😩

The question was asked, apparently last year and I missed it, about the ingredients in the dewormer meds for pets. For dogs the med is the same as for cattle. It is ivermectin, which the rural people refer to as ivermec.

Yep. It does. As noted, organic programs on lawns lead to poo disappearing very, very quickly (even in late fall and early spring, ours seems to disappear in hours to a day from two dogs...up to five if we have visitors or are dog-sitting).

More chemical approaches can lead to poo-buildup, of course, because you'll have fewer beetles, worms, and (to a lesser extent since they're of less importance here) bacteria.

It can take some years to build things up to that level, but it benefits the lawn (and your gardens) at the same time, so...

We do use heartworm protection on our dogs because that's very, very bad in the area, and it seems to have absolutely no impact on the speed of consumption in the gardens.

Poop disappearing in hours? I wouldn't kiss those dogs if I were you.

It's from the soil life, unlike from the assumptions being made, I assure you. :-) In this case, macro insects as opposed to, for the most part, micro insects. And the dogs in question are not noted to partake themselves...

For 17 years... I have been mulch wowing into the lawn all my leaves and the neighbors leaves, most of my perennial garden cuttings get mulch mowed into the lawn as well, and fertilizing with a medley of organics (soybean meal, cracked corn, horse feeds, catfish feed, etc etc). So the soil is alive as it can be. I don't have dogs.... but when a random raccoon, opossum, or skunk leaves a gift on the lawn for me.... it will be visible for well over a week or more (without rain) before it starting to break down enough to not ID it as feces. Maybe just don't kiss you neighbor's dogs if its disappearing in hours!

It'll also depend on the consistency of how often the lawn sees exposure to feces. The creatures that feed on it won't live there in larger numbers there isn't any. We've had multiple dogs for decades plus we're in the country, so of course the populations are pretty high.

In your case, just don't poo on the lawn.

Well actually.... for the past 17 years I HAVE been pooing on the lawn as well... and it's...

Just kidding... just wanted to replay in some way.

Several articles out there similar to this one: https://patapsco.org/2019/12/05/why-is-pet-waste-different-from-wild-animal-waste/

1. Dog, cat, and human waste are a problem for our freshwater streams and lakes. Sure you can leave the poop in your yard, but the nutrients (nitrogen and phosphorus) and bacteria could leach into storm drains which lead directly to fresh water sources, whether from watering your yard or a rain event. Ever wonder about those algae blooms?

2. Wildlife poop contains the nutrients from the ecosystem and returns those nutrients back into the ecosystem. Domestic poop is too high in nitrogen and phosphorus and can create issues in those ecosystems.

3. The gut flora of wildlife is not the same as our dogs. Bacteria from domestic pets can be harmful to wildlife at all levels, insects to rodents to larger mammals.

Bottom line, domestic pet and human waste have no place in our ecosystem. And yes, you can flush your dog poop in the toilet so it can be treated appropriately, just like human waste.

More on the breakdown of ivermectin in the environment:

Breakdown in soil is very temperature dependent, and varies from a couple of weeks at summer temps, to a full year at winter temps (which obviously wouldn't actually happen in a temperate climate that has summers and winters).

https://web.stanford.edu/group/parasites/ParaSites2005/Ivermectin/environmental%20impact.htm#:~:text=Overall%2C%20due%20to%20the%20physical,down%20the%20decay%20of%20dung.

Excretion drops rapidly after a few days, i.e. most of it comes out pretty quick. This study did find a reduction in the diversity of 'dung fauna' (bacteria) in the days immediately following treatment.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00436-006-0240-x

I can see this being a problem in, say, a cattle feedlot, where there are scores of cows pooping in one spot. A back yard with a dog or two, is probably not going to change a whole lot. I should think that the difference in soil biodiversity between organically managed lawns vs. chemically managed lawns has more to do with the general lawn management practices than the ivermectin content of dog poop deposited on it.

I've just started thinking about my dog's poop and I'm stunned I didn't think about it more seriously prior. What makes it especially sensitive here is that I'm lakeside and on a steep hill. Because I have a large lot, and because the dog prefers to distance his poop from the house, I've been cavalier about picking up her manure. I think that the feces really take off in the rain, though, so I've been more diligent this past year. My dog doesn't get ivermectin or flea treatments; it's the nutrient load. I have enough to make up for just by gardening lakeside. I don't mow or manage a lawn, but I keep trading on that to the point it doesn't mean as much.

I am extremely, extremely suspicious of research showing there is any significant accumulation of pet dung in rivers, streams, lakes, and/or ponds. Why? Because organic nutrients are captured in the soil by microbes as biological decomposition happens. Soluble chemicals salts might wash through the soil unchecked, but microbes don't. Microbes have biological controls in effect to prevent much movement of nutrients. There are "first responder" insects and microbes which decompose the dung followed by microbes and insects which devour the first responder insects and microbes. The same process which takes place in compost piles takes place in the soil. One species pathogen is another species food supply, and that biological process renders the pathogen harmless. Mother Nature has been working on this for billions of years.

What happens in my lake is that nutrient loads promote algae and other plant life, which when they die add to the nutrient load. In my deep, clean, spring-fed lake, it is primarily an aesthetic concern---our formerly pebble-bottomed shores are mucky in places. In southern Maine, however, there have been algae blooms, that have killed dogs, that they attributed to dog poop run-off. I don't know if this article is visible to you: https://bangordailynews.com/2020/07/21/news/portland/dog-poop-helps-create-toxic-algae-blooms-in-south-portland-ponds/

I might retract that dead dog thing in a minute. Maybe I imagined that.

If not picked up, it can be tracked in the house unless shoes are removed.

You did not imagine the dead dog report. I don't know about Maine, but I saw references to dogs dying in "the south." Whatever. I do believe the algae can become a danger; I just disagree that the root cause of the algae bloom is due to high doses of pet waste. Algae forms in many ways. If you look at a pond as the summer progresses, you'll see the algae forming in the shallows. The reason for that is that warm water holds less oxygen than cooler water. At 80 degrees F, normal aerobic water life cannot be sustained. Microbially the life in the water becomes anaerobic, which is where the algae comes in. You can see it all around the edges of the lake later in the summer. For shallow ponds it can cover the entire pond if the water warms enough.

As for pet waste, assuming the pet dropped its load on the soil and not in the water, the nutrients from the dung will not travel much more than 2 inches away from the original location. Animal dung is a form of organic fertilizer. Here is a picture of what happens when a handful of organic fertilizer is dropped in the middle of a zoysia lawn.

What happens is the microbes which process the organic fertilizer go to work on it. The end result, after three weeks and thousands of species of microbes have done their thing, is plant food which causes the greening, growth, and densification. But note that the plant food does not seem to have leeched or washed through beyond a few inches away from the original drop zone. And who, here, is not familiar with streaking after fertilizing when the applicator did not overlap the strips when using a drop spreader? Unless there is a major wash out, say from a couple days of heavy rain, fertilizer either dissolves into the soil and gets taken up by the roots, or the microbes process it in place.

Poop ending up in lake water gets a lot of press here, but 'they' say our biggest problem is phosphorus run-off from camp road gravel and construction. We're discouraged from gardening lakeside, which I have tried to justify by not using any amendments beyond my compost, and I lie to myself that since I'm growing food, the harm is mitigated somewhat. The truth is my vegetable area is getting smaller and my non-native ornamentals are spreading. I have occasionally over the years put an ugly hay bale barrier between my garden and the lake, which I think I have just this second decided to do again this year.

I'm finding your logic compelling, though.

Our lakes here are not really on level ground. Most of them are gouged out dips from the ice age surrounded by either hills or small mountains. All of our properties on this lake run downhill.

I live very close to a kettle pond that has had overgrowth of toxic blue green algae (cyanobacteria) in recent years. It has fairly steep sloping terrain all around the pond. Many efforts have taken place to mitigate the runoff that contributes to the overgrowth of algae, such as improving trails and stairways, regrading road sides, using wattle hay, etc. Despite these efforts there was still a bit of toxic algae in the pond this past year.

This pond is regularly tested for pathogens during the summer because it's a popular swimming and fishing spot. One day I spoke with the health inspector who said there is always a spike in E. coli after a heavy rain and when I asked why she mentioned animal feces. I didn't ask for more detail though (should have).

I don't know how much pet waste contributes to the overgrowth of cyanobacteria or E. coli or something else, but almost every time I take a walk around the neighborhood I find dog poop or a dog poop bag laying around along sidewalks or trails.

Oklahawg,

I realize this is a very old post but thought I would leave a comment anyway.

I have a ”Greencone” in my backyard that I was putting all the poop from our two springer spaniels. Got pretty full after a couple of years so I was worried what I was going to do next. Checked it one day to see what was happening and found it just full of redworms.😁

Problem solved!