The problem isn't so much the colors...they are only a little off from new growth, but the way the stems have chosen to grow in the first and better seen in the second picture. Duchesse doesn't grow that way with so many buds on top of each other. The leaf edges of some of the red leaves isn't quite right, either.
Do you remember reading about stem calipers? Stems are (except when the rose is grafted onto fortuniana) smaller than the stem from which they grow.
Second photo down, ...the spray of buds on the right...the combined caliper (diameters) of the stems is a lot larger than the stem they emerged from.

Tea roses make big airy sprays, and then, a bit later, some more stems appear from a few of the axils in the first spray. What has gone so RRD wrong here is that the big airy spray is short and dense, and even before the buds fold their sepals back, the replacement stems are growing vigorously. (I've seen this on HTs with RRD, now thanks to your photos, I've seen it on teas.)

I'll bet this grew really fast and almost appeared overnight...

Ann

Oooohh ... We don't see this out here.
It sort of turns your stomach, doesn't it?
It is so WRONG.

Jeri

What started this? The mites can't be a genetic introduction, maybe they were encouraged somehow, but I remember reading last year something about multiflora, maybe something introduced into the environment to kill it.

Without looking it up, wasn't multiflora introduced to beautify the countryside and make natural hedges instead of fences? Then it was found out that it was a rampant spreader, was popping up everywhere in fields, and was well nigh impossible to get rid of, maybe Roundup hadn't been invented yet. Now I'm curious and will look it up.

I'm sorry what this will mean to the OP.

Seeing that RRD turns my stomach, a hideous deformity. Like Jeri said, it is so WRONG.

I knew you'd be here, Ann. I'm just so discouraged--I don't know if you remember, I had a case of RRD last year in the front yard, and now this is in the back yard. I can't figure out any kind of similar wind patterns going on. I can't find multiflora. I had someone from Clemson come take samples last year and they didn't think it was RRD because there were no mites that he could find. I tried to explain that it was.

I do remember reading about stem calipers and was relieved to see the stems were smaller than the main stem this time---COMBINED calipers didn't occur to me. I knew something looked amiss, just couldn't articulate it. The buds are even weirder than what shows up in the picture---two buds are forming side by side on the same stem on some of those top sprays. Would it be helpful for posterity to have more pictures of this?

Since this is the only RRD stem, do you think it is worth cutting the stem below the soil line and watching? You are exactly right, Ann, I don't remember seeing this at all last week and I have been deadheading--it appeared out of nowhere.

I am just so discouraged tonight. I don't know how everybody keeps trying after RRD.

Am in process of taking out my huge 5 year old Mrs. B. R. Cant who has RRD. I had it confirmed by North Carolina State Univ. I just could not stand to remove her without a second opinion. She leaves a large hole in the garden but am hoping that is all she leaves. The Virginia web site they referred me to recommended spraying with Avid every two weeks during summer to prevent further outbreaks. Is anyone doing this? Normally I have a no-spray garden.

Here's a link to an article that mentions using Avid more often than every 2 weeks.

News of more infected roses always saddens me. What are the side effects of using Avid in the garden? But it sounds like it would be worth it if you're in an area where the risk is great.

Sherry

Here is a link that might be useful: Shenandoah Rose Society Article

Sunny -- Do you mind telling us which county in NC you garden in?

The Virginia Tech website recommends Avid because it's one of the few chemical approved for home garden spraying of mites. It may not be that effective against this particular eriophyid mite. Right now, it's all we've got.
I've got one area where almost every rose spot has a RRD replacement rose in it. I loose about a rose a year from that garden. I'm really thinking of interplanting with marigolds because they get red spider mites and (The roses there are oranges so the marigolds won't have that bad of a color war) and hope that the predator mites move in to eat the red spider mites and maybe onto the adjacent roses and keep them cleaner of the eriophyid mites.
I do have a friend who has gone heavy spray and uses AVID. She still gets some RRD, her back yard is open to a large field with a stream and winds come down that stream's valley and we think that her mite source could be half a mile up wind of her, up that valley.

Two years ago I lost two large tea roses; one had the RRD break close to the ground, like Odyssey's. If that DdB were mine (and if it weren't really large), I'd dig it up and use a wood chisel to remove the roots that are supporting that growth. My friend has done that with some success; it doesn't work all the time, but sometimes beats never.

How to keep on? I loose more roses to voles each year. But I'm stubborn and I think we can learn a lot about keeping roses growing by comparing experiences.

Ann

Here is a link that might be useful: Rose Rosette E-book

*** How to keep on? I loose more roses to voles each year.

Ann, that's an excellent perspective. With that mindset I think we'll have less panic and depression. Thanks for all your wisdom and experience.

Sherry

I'm trying to maintain a better attitude this morning. Looking at the pictures today it seems so obvious that it is RRD. I think there is an initial strange mix of paranoia and denial for me upon seeing RRD.

My backyard also adjoins a large, overgrown field, with a stream behind it and more fields behind that. I guess I'll never know the potential source for sure.

I will try to chisel out this cane and supporting roots today. It isn't a huge shrub--about 4 years old.

Ann, in your experience how advanced would you say this case of RRD is? Would the infection be likely to have happened this spring or last fall? I'm just wondering.

Thanks for the encouragement. I don't know what I'd do without you all.

Odyssey,
I think that last year we had horrible drought on both sides of our mountains. In drought years, I think the mites move off of the infected multiflora and go in search of better roses, so I expect worse numbers of sick roses after drought years. (This goes back to the year I lost 12 roses, that were all well irrigated when the RRD sick multiflora upwind was so dry that the clays had eight inch deep mud cracks in places.)
I think a mite got to your rose last fall, found a leaf axil and crawled inside. Nothing happened that fall, but this spring....you're seeing it.

It's almost been too cool this spring for the mite populations to grow yet.
(A coupld of papers where grad students counted P. fructiphilus from spring into fall for several years showed massive spikes in the mite populations come late August/September.) (I think that there is a minor spike near me when we have really hot temps the first two weeks in May, but that didn't happen this year....I'm not sure what your temps were.)

You need to check up in the trees surrounding the fields for multiflora up there, that's gotten sick. Then you need to introduce it to Mr. Round Up. In our part of the world multiflora can stay sick with RRD for five or six years.

Thanks again, Ann. We were definitely in a major drought last year too. Here we also had a hot spike in the '90's in April, but cooler in May.

I'll redouble my scouting for multiflora efforts. I know it has got to be somewhere. I'll be sure to look up too. It helps so much to have you to talk to. Honestly, you are always on the frontlines, like an RRD paramedic, and are very much appreciated.

12 roses in one year?? Gosh--there goes my right to complain. I'm bucking up.

Oh, these pictures just make my stomach churn. Odyssey, we lost about 50 in 2-3 years and I think it was all drought-related. I noticed that I had no RRD in the wet years and it was not until the droughts started coming and the storms nearby, i.e., tornadic weather in NOLA and Florida, from which we got a lot of wind and no rain. It was not until there were quite a few the second year with RRD that we found it. My husband is not as quick to recognize things like that as I am and our gardener not at all. For the last 5 years, I have sort of been relegated to the kitchen window since my doctors forbid me to work in heat and/or humidity secondary to an autoimmune condition and the consequences related to medications I take for it. So, before we knew it we had quite a few infected roses. It seemed like for a month we found a new one each day. I think it might lie dormant for a while before it shows up, but that is just my impression, as I had some lost in (for the sake of not being able to recall exact dates) October 2005 and then one very nearby would be lost in spring 2006, which I think the infection may have been there, not visible to the naked eye, and once the rose started putting on new growth the following spring, it was very obvious. Perhaps I just think that is the way it is but it seems to me that it lies there dormant occasionally before rearing its ugly head. Or either the mites were able to over-winter.

It is very helpful to connect drought years with an increase in RRD. This helps me know when to be extra vigilant. We have been having a lot of high winds this spring, with a tornado in April. I wonder what the fastes time from mite-bite to symptoms would be...

Patricia, 50--I have to say I would be sorely tempted to throw in the towel after those kinds of losses. I admire your determination. Wish we lived closer so I could do my best to help you spot more RRD. Awful.

Would it make sense to spray Avid in the fall for the mites?

Surgery on the Duchesse is done. I dug her up, sprayed the RRD stem with hairspray and hacked it off. I took off about a quarter of the main stem with its roots. We shall see. I took some better pics of the bud deformities, to help others with identification. I know how much pictures have helped me.

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I worry about other growth on the bush now too. Here is what I thought was normal new growth, but the leaf edges are not right:
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Here is new growth at the base of the bush which now looks suspect to me too. What do you think?
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I'm also scared about some other shrubs now in my garden and I'll post those pictures next.

Here are some worrisome shots of my Georgetown Tea, don't know what to think--

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Here's Jean Bach Sisley, which sits right next to the Duchesse. Normal or not? I don't know anymore.

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Here is Austin's Sharifa Asma showing some hyperthorniness and distorted leaves, as well as red with pebbly texture in the last picture. Honestly, I can find distorted, non-symmetrical leaves on many shrubs in my garden...

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Belinda's Dream is the last for tonight. Thanks for sticking with me this long. Yes, I am paranoid. I need reassurance that what I am seeing is or is not RRD. BD scares me the most because this was my first variety to get RRD. These pics are from a few different shrubs.

Again, thank you, thank you. (Especially you Ann)

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Windeaux, I live in Cumberland County in NC. There are some multiflora bushes in the county. We are in Fayetteville city limits on a lake so who knows what lurks in the still undeveloped areas. Also the wind blows like crazy off the lake.

I, too, have a Belindas's Dream next to the spot formerly occupied by my tea rose, Mrs. B. R. Cant. She has a proliferation of suspect new growth. Am about to decide that I am getting too paranoid and that she is okay. However last summer I noticed suspect growth on Mrs. B.R.C. I cut off the whole large branch. Later decided that I was wrong and had acted in haste. Then after a fantastic floral display, she put out this abnormal growth this spring.

I have decided not to replant with another large tea. She was my favorite but getting the roots out is not fun for two seniors.

Thank you for all your good suggestions. This Web Site has taught me most of what I know about disease resistant roses.

Sunny

Odyssey, when I saw your picture my heart hurt for you.

I understand RRD is starting to appear all the way in Oregon. I pray it never gets to me. What a horrible travesty.

-Greta

These pictures truly make me sick-----I am so sorry when my rosey friends see this horrible growth on their precious roses.

I just lost one of my favorite New Dawn bushed---(Hubby wrapped it in black plastic and then dug up the root)

Also lost my huge Dr Van Fleet---it was a cutting we brought home from Martha's Vineyard several years ago--

I will try to be vigilant with my roses---The area I live in is loaded with Multiflora----

Carol ---you don't live very far from me so I'm sure you have seen multiflora all over the place---

Ann thanks for all your efforts in helping all of us----Your diligence is inspiring.

Patricia---I feel so sad about your problems--You are one of the first ladies who helped me here on GW

Florence-

Odyssey 3

I don't grow teas, so I can't help much. Does JB Sisley have such long thorns in other parts of the plant? That's the only thing that looks particularly odd to me. I hope others will go look at new growth on those varieties and be able to reassure you.

I do know that healthy tea roses sometimes break 3 buds from the same site. I think if you look over the older growth, you'll find such triplets on healthy canes.

Here are a couple of principles.

1. Compare new growth with new growth on different canes of the same plant or another of the same variety. If it is all similar, then it's all OK. The whole plant could not have been suddenly infected after the first flush. The whole plant would be infected only some weeks or months after the first weird growth.

2. Watch the lowest leaves and thorns on a growing shoot to see if they are turning normal, compared with old growth on the same plant. Of course, leaves and thorns on a strong shoot may be a bit bigger than average. It occasionally happens that only the upper end of a shoot is affected, but almost always, the first infection occurs in an emerging growth bud, so it affects the whole shoot; then systemic infection may next affect other shoots on the same base cane.

3. RRD never starts on a new shoot from below ground, except in rare cases where a shoot is infected midway in its development.

Thanks everyone for all the continued support and help--it means a lot.

I know I have the paranoias right now! Michael, your thoughts are very helpful--I just checked JBS and those big thorns do appear elsewhere on the plant, they just seem biggest on all new growth on the whole shrub. I feel better about her and about G-town tea, since I can find what I thought was suspect growth all over her too. I need to remember the whole shrub is not going to appear with RRD all at once. The major thing bothering me on other shrubs is the distorted leaves I can find--some have three lobes and some appear like mittens. What else causes such distorted leaves besides RRD?

My Duchesse is looking worse for wear after surgery--she's totally wilted despite major rains and storms last night. I have the hose dripping on her now. I'm thinking I probably should have taken off more top growth given that I cut her roots almost in half (might have gone overboard in my fearful state of mind). Should I wait and see, maybe put some plastic around her to increase humidity, or start chopping?

I like Michael's first two principals. Until three years ago I would have liked the third, but I lost a huge Tea Noisette and I never saw sick growth up any cane, only coming out from a mature basal cane as if it were a new basal break. I think what happend was a bud axil had a RRD vector mite bite, that went down the very woody stem, and the first non-dormant leaf axil (one of those that were there when the cane first emerged) showed really hideous growth. That growth even spiraled as one side of the cane outgrew the other.

Re photos above.
I'd watch Belinda's for a while. I think it's ok. But I don't like the edge of that leaf in the last photo.

Have you changed ferilizers recently? Something is going on/wrong with the teas in these photos.
Background: when a spray of buds happens, the oldest bud blooms first and is easily seen, then the subsequent buds' stems continue to grow and as those buds mature, that first and spent bloom is often hidden by the subsequent blooms. It bothers me that your tea buds are being overgrown on most of these stems almost a week or two BEFORE the oldest bud opens in bloom. That's not supposed to happen.
IS there any chance you had a yard crew use some sort of special chemical mix on your yard (or on a neighbor's yard?)

Email me..we're going to be in Asheville tomorrow at the western NC Arboreteum for their rose exhibition and DH and I are giving two talks in the afternoon. There are some other things I'd like you to check on this new growth...is there pith? Or can you flatten these red stemswith gentle finger squeezes? Are the buds all there, sexually? (Some RRD sick roses lack major bloom parts.)

Ann

Odyssey, maybe you can rig some shade with a tripod of poles and a bedsheet. Clear plastic would make a solar cooker. Some people say you can let the rose wilt down and decide whether it wants to defoliate or not, but I've never had the nerve to try that. Since it's a tea, if I wanted to reduce moisture loss, I'd pull off half the leaves rather than hack the plant down.