I could be totally off base here, but my first thought was to treat the soil with the liquids..Bug Juice/BIM/etc and then start piling on the organic matter.

Maybe you could do a dedicated lasagna bed in a small portion in order to get the veggies in this year, if only a few of them?

Or, look at len's gardening pages and see how he built beds with haybales and filled them with food wastes, mushroom compost, and other goodies and planted in them pretty quick.

You could do something like that but then douse each layer with the potent liquids, not just water. Then for fun, seed them with some earthworms like RJ is doing.

I'm doing the same sort of thing but had started them before I got my bug juice mixed up or had made a batch of BIM.

One of my beds was done almost identically, though I didn't have mushroom compost. I used some chopped up leaves and then some fresh grass clippings as well as some leaves/grass mixed. Watered well between the layers. That bed was HOT the next day. Since they were done before I got the BJ done, I'm going to do some drenching of those.

I'd compost the manure with any extra good composting stuff before putting it in the beds re: the recent manure discussions.

I guess what I'm doing is a hybrid Len/Lasagna/Ruth stout method. I sure as heck don't want to ever rototill my dirt again...with a big one or my little Mantis, mainly because we have hard red clay that is too hard to deal with.

BTW...I was filling in some additional haybale raised beds on Saturday with good layers of chopped leaves and leaves/grass mixed, wetting between each layer. Check them this morning and there was steam coming from within. YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS. I haven't even started the Bug Juice on them.

Here is a link that might be useful: Len's strawbales garden

Thanks for all your ideas Penny.

There has been so much info lately on this forum that I'm not sure what the best way is to use all these good ideas. Might get some mushroom compost. Not sure if square bales will be easy to get around here for raised beds altho I'm sure I could get a round bale or so and spread it around. I know straw is out of reach as there's so much ginseng grown in this province it's driven the price way up.

DH is of the till-the-ground school so I'll let him have a go at that, might not hurt. I'd like to till in manure but it likely won't be aged and I'm not sure of the risk even working with it in a flower bed. Any opinions on that?

You people with leaves are so lucky! We have few deciduous trees but I think I'll be begging leaves from friends and acquaintances (maybe even strangers!) in town this fall.

Maybe I'll have to do several beds using different methods, sort of a soil experimental farm!

Open to any further ideas anyone else would care to share. :-)

I'd take what you've learned from this forum and all the links in it so far and use them all. That's what I'm doing. I built raised beds that I made w/ last falls compost, I've done a soil drench w/ my avct/ct. I've got bugjuice brewing and will drench w/ that before it rains tomorrow or the next day. I'm not sure if the blackened wood I take out of the fire pit is potash or biochar but it's mixed in the compost. I do have a worm bin and will put a few handfuls in ea raised bed when planting, and like my earlier thread, I've got a few weeds that will be grown on purpose. I know I've seen water peppers local and have some poor draining areas right in front of one of my beds.

Luckygal asked:

"So if this were your situation what would you do first?"

Let me first say that I have red Georgia clay soil, it is a real bear to work with in the beginning. I too have soil like I posted (photos) in the BIM thread my cousin has, lots of rocks, extremely hard sand/clay mix. Thus your soil can be made as you desire, but it is going to take some time and work. With that being said I will share what I did to my cement like clay soil to get it in the shape it is now in.

What I would do is this:

1. Dont try to do the entire area in one year; organic soil will spread is my experience. I would mark off a plot or plots (50 x 5 feet) to get started.

2. Till in at least 2 (two) inches or more of organic matter (compost) into the soil. Tilling will insure the compost will not get washed away and will get the organic matter into the clay the fastest. It too will get the charcoal deeper into the soil.

3. I would put at least 3 (three) inches of mulch (shredded leaves) on that soil once it is tilled.

4. I would lay out my rows after moving away those leaves and spread more compost in those rows to plant into. Getting plants (vegetables) in the soil will allow the plant roots to move the organic matter deeper in the soil.

5. Once my plants are in the ground and growing, focus on using teas or other fermented juices to build fertility and microbe mass. By having a thick layer of mulch the teas will have plenty to feed on as well as move the organic matter deeper into the soil. The teas can be the best insurance for a decent crop and good deep root penetration.

6. If using charcoal, always water in a slow soaking manner. This will aid in working organic matter deeper in the soil; and too, if charcoal is used soaking slowly will not over saturate the soil (which is easy to do).

7. Always have a compost pile working. Adding compost and keeping the soil mulched will transform clay into healthy well draining soil in the shortest amount of time IMO.

Since you say getting leaves is a problem, using shredded straw is the next best mulch to use IMO. Straw will last longer if biochar is used; however it will also protect the soil well. My experience is that shredded leaves are almost as good as compost for clay soil. Yet, any mulch will keep the soil from crusting; leaves add more nutrition than other types of mulches will, and mimic compost the closest as it relates to organic soil building. Thus, the leaf would be my focus as much as making compost in importance for the clay soil IMO.

Of course there are other views that should be welcomed and offered; I only speak in terms of what I did to my clay soil. And too, there are many gaps in what I have said, trying to be brief can cause that problem. Being open to questions is one of the joys of being a member of this community; that said, it is not a problem to answer any further questions you may have, if I canÂ

Blutranes

Hi, I'm a newbie at this too.

I would like to know more about this bug tea? Never heard of it before, what is it used for? What is BIM? Biochar? I have a friend saving me some of his wood ashes, is that the same?

I'm working on revamping my small garden into a version of square foot compact gardening, and last fall I dug a bunch of leaves into the 2 sections out of 6, I still need to do 4 more. I gather from the above at bug juice would help decompose those leaves quicker? What kind of teas are you talking about? Where do I find Len's pages? I know, I have sooo many questions!

I do have a couple suggestions to add to the mix. I read somewhere that cabbage has really deep root and is good to break up hard soil deep, same with alfalfa, you might want to try the alfalfa on the area's you won't get to this year, just not sure how you'd get rid of it for next year as it's a perennial.

Good luck, I'm learning right along with you!
Karen

Hey Karen,

The link on my reply will take you to Len's garden pages. Great info there.

You can use the search function to search "bug juice" "bim", "compost tea", "biochar", etc but here's one that will get you started:

Sunflowers are one of the more accepted ''weeds'' that have deep diving roots. They will break through the hardpan layer and bring nutrients up to the surface. Consider them as a companion crop w/ pole beans.

The link on my first reply (and grammatically incorrect...) will take you to Len's pages. He really has a great website. It should have read "Len's strawbale garden".

The link "BIM 101 aka" got truncated... "BIM 101 aka "Why I love the internet" is what I was attempting to post. It is a LONG thread with lots of links and lots of info in it.

Hope that helps...

Penny

I've looked up the Bug Juice recipe and it seems like a gift to the People, the ingredients being cheap and easily obtained - except for the MaxGro. I've never liked the thought of using blood meal. Does anybody have suggestions for a high protein substitute?

MaxGro is fish meal.

A few thoughts...

If you don't plan to use the garden this year, or if it's not for food crops, I wouldn't worry about working in fresh manure. If manure is what you have access to, find a way to use it. You're going to need a lot of good organic matter to repair this soil, so take what you've got. If you have more manure that you aren't going to use in the garden right away, compost it for later use.

If your husband really wants to use that rototiller, use it to mix in some of the amendments that people have suggested.

Get *something* growing in that space. Local weeds, cover crops (clover, maybe?), or something. Getting something growing there will send roots down into the soil, help to break up the hard stuff, and improve it. Later on, till in the stuff that was growing, to use as a green manure.

I've never tried any of the teas, but they sound awfully promising. I think they'd help a lot.

You've got quite a daunting task ahead of you. Be sure to keep us informed!

If I understand what I've just read, baker's yeast is about 50% protein. There's a large container of it getting old in the fridge. So I think I'll try that instead of the fish meal, which is not only expensive (with shipping and handling), but a hard-to-justify expense here, where we're virtually surrounded by fishing villages (though nobody makes fish meal). I'll just have to keep an eye out for profligate bubbling.

Thanks for posting about the bug juice and good luck with your project, that ground sounds tough.

Thanks to everyone for all the comments. I know it sounds like a really huge undertaking but we're retired so have nothing to do but play! LOL Will get this started in a couple of weeks when I can see the earth and report back later. Really looking forward to seeing how it will work.

Hello

I see above that bluetranes mentioned safety when dealing with Bug Juice and compost teas. Can anyone explain the safety issues further?

I'm planning on making a batch of Bug Juice. Here in eastern Colorado the temperatures are averaging 55F daytime and 30F nighttime. But it can certainly be anywhere from 10F to 75F. Is that too cold for making a batch outdoors?

Gjcore said:

"I see above that Blutranes mentioned safety when dealing with Bug Juice and compost teas. Can anyone explain the safety issues further?"

Yes, I would be happy to expound further on the safety issues. When making Bug Juice or any other type of compost tea we always want to use compost that is fully composted to avoid making a batch of unsafe bacteria/fungi. Compost that is not "finished" may contain toxins created during the composting process. Still better, compost that has matured for a length of time is even better and will contain added benefits of vitamins, auxins, humic, and fulvic acids that will greatly aid in the growth of our plants. Especially important is not using any animal manure that has not completely composted and aged to avoid breeding digestive bacteria (E. Coli and others) while growing our brew. For this reason well aged (at least 1 (one) year) manure that has been completely composted should be used, if at all. If one is not sure of the maturity of their compost, or are using compost purchased (or made by someone else) it may be safest to not use that compost until one is sure that the compost is completely finished. Surely, compost that doesnt contain manure can be matured/cured before being used in any compost tea.

Please keep in mind that what we are calling the soil food web, lil beasties, the micro herd, or any other (pet) name we choose to call them, to everyone else they are known as GERMS. Germs can do us great harm. We are not here to cause or experience any type of harm; we are here IMO to grow good, healthy, and safe soil, food, and flowers. As long as we accept the responsibility for using the tools (organic) we are utilizing, all will be well and we can share in the harvest of our labor. Trust me, I have gotten very ill from obtaining organic materials (inhaling wood, manure, and leaf dust); the risk is real and it is unforgiving. It is for this reason I will always present any suggestion I make with a strong safety caveat. Saying we can use raw manure, half-baked compost, or other "time cutting" techniques is asking for trouble IMO. It is much easier and safer to do the deed right, invest in a little "time costing" behavior, and reap the reward for a job well done than to pay a price one may not be prepared to pay.

Give pleasure to remember we are dealing with a very powerful part of nature, it is nothing to take lightly or use carelessly. Yes, people in our community have been doing things for many years and had nothing happen to them; however I am one member of this community that did something one time and almost lost my life. The decision rests with the individual in any case, but if you listen to Blutranes every now and then, listen now and listen well: Be safe, garden safe, compost safe, protect yourself and the ones you love; I promise you, you will never regret heeding my words

Blutranes

BTW, 60°F or above is a good temperature to brew compost tea, with 80°F being ideal from what I have learned. The cooler the temperature the longer the brewing time IMO. And too, the higher the temperature (above 80°F) the shorter the time is my understanding...

bluetranes thanks for the info.

One thing that I would like to add the Bug Juice recipe, from my home brewing experience, is that when you pitch the yeast it should be fairly close in temperature to the medium into which you're putting it into. I've found that holding the packet in between my hands for 5-10 minutes is a gentle way of raising it's temperature.

Gjcore,

What does it mean to "pitch the yeast"? And why is it important to make sure the yeast is at the proper temperature? As you can see I only brew compost; however, I am getting good at fermenting I must admit. Thanks for taking time to explain...

Blutranes

Pitching yeast simply means adding them, in homebrew terms, to the wort. Yeast are alive even if dormant. Large changes in temperature shock them.

Okie dokie, got it...

Blutranes

The problem with "brews" is possible contamination of it with botulism. Botulism is one of most strong poison in nature. One gram of it can kill all the people on the Earth.
I would escape experiments with unaerobic fermentation of anything. Results can be as unpredictable as eating fungus (if you dont know them).

Valerie ru,

Again, thanks for the warning...

Blutranes

I assume that stirring Bug Juice a few times a day to keep it aerobic. Maybe getting a fish tank air pump and aerator would be better.

I was just reading Wikipedia about botulism and there was a link to fermented fish containing the following -

"Fermented fish is prepared by first digging a hole about two feet in the ground. The preparer places a freshly caught fish in the hole, covers it with earth, and lets it stay buried for a couple weeks to a month or longer. After the fish reaches a desired level of fermentation, the preparer unearths it and immediately freezes it until someone is ready to eat it. Fermented fish tastes best raw and frozen"

MMMM MMMM sounds good ;-)

Before worrying about any OM, biochar, juice or whatever, I'd determine what type of clay it is. If it's expansive, I'd just go raised beds. If it's not (kinda like the red Georgia clay blutranes was talking about, but it doesn't have to be red to be nonexpansive), then by all means begin amending and use all the advice you've been learning here.

Piedmontnc said:

"Before worrying about any OM, biochar, juice or whatever, I'd determine what type of clay it is. If it's expansive, I'd just go raised beds."

Piedmontnc,

Can you explain what "expansive clay" is? Why is it so hard to amend this type of clay? Are there other alternatives besides raised beds to garden in this clay? If one used raised beds to work with this clay, will the clay ever become workable? Thanks for you insight and sharing

Blutranes

Expanisve clays have a 2:1 meineralogy. They shrink and swell considerable based on moisture content. They're a type of clay that is unsuitable for septic systems and if you build on them, you need to have a structural engineer carefully design teh foundations or else the clay will crack it rather easily.

They're mostly massive in structure,as opposed to the blocky structure you see in your Georgia red clay, think of something like pottery or modeling clay, very firm or harder in their moist consistence, and exhibit very sticky and very plastic tendencies when wet (very plastic is defined as being able to roll a 2mm diameter, 4 cm long cylinder of clay that supports itself when picked up). They usually have a reduced matrix color and/or significant gleying or other redoximorphic coloring.

IOW, the lack of structure and reduced matrix colorings usually means the soil has very poor air exchange and from what I've read (I only practice soil science in regards to septic systems not soil fertility)only a few crops do really well in it such as cotton, wheat and rice. And if you think your Georgia clay hardens up when dry, well expansive clays are damn near reinforced concrete when dry.

I'm sure they can be amended but just knowing about their physical properties, I'd say it would take considerable more effort than other clays and raised beds would be a lot less hassle.

Piedmontnc,

Thank you very much for your clear and through explanation of expanded clay. One of the benefits of being a member of this society is the wealth of knowledge we as members are able to share with each other in the spirit of community (most times). Now that we have a better understanding of what we are dealing with, we can better seek out a solution that could end up being little or no "hassle"; again, thanks for your time.

Gjcore said:

"I assume that stirring Bug Juice a few times a day to keep it aerobic. Maybe getting a fish tank air pump and aerator would be better."

That is what I do Gj; however I use a modified version of the "Bruce Deuleys Little Texas Tea Maker". IMO, it is one of the best (if not the best) compost tea makers a person can make in their own home for little cost. The resulting tea has been rated among one of the highest in quality compost tea at that time. Unfortunately the web site with the instructions is down; however, I did find a site that reprinted the instructions in full. One can use the link below to get to that page. I trust this helps in some way

Blutranes

"I assume that stirring Bug Juice a few times a day to keep it aerobic. Maybe getting a fish tank air pump and aerator would be better."

Lactobacteria (LB) in Bug Juce is anaerobic bacteria. It will not survive in aerobic conditions. Thus Bug Juce is incompatible with the air pump.
It is impossible to unite aerobic and unaerobic bacteria.

"Thus Bug Juce is incompatible with the air pump."

It may serve you well Valerie RU, to read the links provided before making comments that do not put you in a very favorable light. If you take that suggestion your comments may generate more than what you have been getting here lately.

Let us trust that if you intend to be a part of this (or any other) discussion that you respect our efforts to improve our gardening skills. Bug Juice is aerobic, there is no LB in Bug Juice, we are not creating botulism, nor are we going to aid in disrespecting the creator of "Bug Juice". If you insist on behaving as a Social Worker, do me a favor and handle somebody elses' case...

Blutranes

Blutranes, do not take my comments personally, please. I am far away from treating (or medical treating) somebody.
About Bug Juice Formula:

One 5 gallon bucket.
Corn starch
Bread yeast
MaxGro our fishmeal product, or another source of protein. Blood meal will work.
Ripe fruit, such as plums, apples, apricots, peaches, watermelons, peeled bananas or whatever. No citrus.

Yes, there is no LB there. But there are Yeasts. Yeasts are also unaerobic or slightly aerobic microotganisms. So, putting an air pump in Bug Juice will stop their activity too. It is as though yeasts were not added completly. What you will get in the end ? Everything but no Bug Juice.
I think it is possible to make Bug Juice and BIM or ALL YOU WANT without fear of botulism as long as you dont go far from initial reliable recipe.

Ill try to explain more clear on example of "wine" . Wine is very close to "Bug Juice". Air pump in wine? Nonsense.

And again about
Risks of consuming fermented foods
Alaska, despite its small population, has witnessed a steady increase of cases of botulism since 1985. It has more cases of botulism than anywhere else in the United States of America. This is caused by the traditional Eskimo practice of allowing animal products such as whole fish, fish heads, walrus, sea lion and whale flippers, beaver tails, seal oil, birds, etc., to ferment for an extended period of time before being consumed. The risk is exacerbated when a plastic container is used for this purpose instead of the old-fashioned method, a grass-lined hole, as the botulinum bacteria thrive in the anaerobic conditions created by the plastic.

I wonder how the entire population of the Orient hasn't died off yet? Koreans live largely on kimchee, fermented for 90 days in a clay pot under ground. Koreans also live largely on rice grown in patties fertilized w/ humanure that hasn't been composted. In the Philippines a delicacy is balut, eggs that have been incubated close to ready to hatch and then fermented. hmmm....

I wonder how the entire population of the Orient hasn't died off yet? Koreans live largely on kimchee, fermented for 90 days in a clay pot under ground.

Because they use salt.

Kimchee ingredients

1 large chinese (Napa) cabbage
1 medium daikon radish
3 scallions (spring onions), chopped
1 bunch mustard leaves (optional)
1 tsp minced garlic
2" ginger, peeled and grated
1/2 cup red chilli powder
3 tbsp sugar
2 cups sea salt (kosher salt)
10 cups water

They also keep pot under ground (temperature). It is important factor.

Koreans also live largely on rice grown in patties fertilized w/ humanure that hasn't been composted.

Unless the rice is stored in some form of anaerobic environment, there's no place for clostridium bot. bacteria to grow

In the Philippines a delicacy is balut, eggs that have been incubated close to ready to hatch and then fermented. hmmm....

I'm guessing since the egg itself is pretty much a sealed environment, there's little to no chance for clost. bot. to get inside

Clostridium Botulinium bacteria are present in the soil and need anaerobic conditions to thrive and produce the botulism toxin. Any plant grown in the soil and then stored/processed in an unsanitary anaerobic environment has the potential to cause the deadly toxin. Even something as simple as garlic in olive oil if not processed carefully can cause botulism. However, proper pressure canning/other temp measures, PH's lower than 4.6, or water activation levels less than 0.85 prevent botulism in food products (as well as the growth of other pathogenic organisms).

Must take time previewing:

botulinum NOT botulinium

water activity NOT water activation

Val, Thanks for clearing up the fermentation for me. I do think that recipe is short a few heads of garlic and not enough chili powder to be real kimchee though ;-)

That kimchee sounds good. Must make soon...

Clay (earthenware) is porous, unlike plastic. Think of the more frequent watering plants in clay pots require.

Valerie RU said:

"Blutranes, do not take my comments personally, please. I am far away from treating (or medical treating) somebody.

I will take it the same way I get it. Let us find out if the same can be said for you in the comfort of your own home.

Apparently some around here insist on confusing "putrefaction" with "fermentation". And too, it would appear that some plan on consuming Bug Juice, BIM, EM, and other organic solutions. However I strongly suggest that one abandon such thoughts and adopt the practice of waiting until crops are harvested before eating/drinking them, not at the beginning of the growing process. These "teas" and all other decomposed organic materials are for use in the soil, NOT at the dinner table. Everyone, please make a mental note; "Compost tea is not to be drank by humans, ever." It may smell good; may even resemble something you drank last night; however, these liquids are again for the soil ONLY. One would be wise in truth to find something else to quench their thirst and live to drink another day. If one is not emotionally strong enough, or does not possess enough self-control to not drink the compost tea, BIM, or EM may I suggest you go and get your organic food from the nearest grocery store.

" Yes, there is no LB there. But there are Yeasts. Yeasts are also unaerobic or slightly aerobic microotganisms."

It is too late to start copy/pasting now; nor will trying to clean up skewed logic with doubletalk serve any purpose. Dr. Martin clearly states to keep the bug juice brew aerobic:

" You have now mixed the ingredients, a handful of good compost and added water. Mix periodically to aerate the mix and leave the bucket in the sun. After one week, start applying the Bug Juice to the compost or table scraps you have collected, or directly to poor soil."

The difference is in the amount of time the tea is allowed to brew (12 hours). To put focus on alcoholic mentality (equating everything with getting drunk) has nothing to do with organic gardening or making compost tea. We are talking about creating an environment where clean healthy soil, with an abundance of proactive microorganisms, is correcting the imbalance found within any given soil. To start contradicting yourself at this stage of the game is fruitless, and it changes nothing.

"It is impossible to unite aerobic and unaerobic bacteria."

Prof. Dr. T. Higa has done extensive research in the field of EM, and has established a worldwide commercial distribution of his organic discovery. At a conference 1989 the good doctor stated:

"In particular, we found that zymogenic and synthetic microorganisms coexisting in soil suppressed the generation of heat and gas when fresh organic substances were plowed into the soil, and were extremely effective for the growth of crops and the increase of their yield. As I mentioned before, if fresh organic substances are plowed into soil which has putrescent microorganisms, harmful gas and heat are generated, affecting crops. However, we have observed that, if microorganisms in soil are predominantly zymogenic, organic substances plowed into soil are transformed into amino acids and saccharides, which are useful to plants, and are recycled as source of organic energy."

And too:

"The main microorganisms working in this process are synthetic microorganisms, such as photosynthetic bacteria and nitrogen fixing bacteria. Generally photosynthesis is the process in which water is decomposed into oxygen and hydrogen inside chlorophyll using sunlight energy, with oxygen being released into the air and hydrogen being used to
reduce carbon dioxide to produce saccharides (carbohydrates)."

The joining of aerobic (synthetic) and anaerobic (zymogenic/fermented) microorganisms is further explained"

" This process can be simply realized by artificially changing the microflora in soil to those of the zymogenic type through the application of zymogenic microorganisms. Although this technique has drawn attention in the area of food and feed, no one ever thought of applying it to crop cultivation simply because the phenomenon is extremely exceptional in nature."

Yet still further:

" Therefore, if soil is changed to zymogenic and synthetic soil, in which zymogenic microorganisms and synthetic ones coexist, not only can organic substances be effectively used, but also the soil fertilizes itself under proper humidity and temperature. Since such soil can synthetically or zymogenically transform harmful substances produced in natural processes into useful substances, putrescent decomposers and disease bacteria cannot infest plants. As a result, soil becomes clean and healthy, and can withstand sudden changes in its environment." (see link below "8. Potential of Zymogenic and Synthetic Soil")

Indeed it is very honorable to attempt to protect the membership with true concerns about techniques that may cause harm. However, to sling unfounded rhetoric without even bothering to review the data that is being discussed is plain foolish. Not withstanding, said procedures are now used world wide with a clear history of critical scrutiny from many areas of science firmly established speaks for itself. Finally, to vainly attempt to combine alcohol used for intoxication with fermentation techniques involving BIM, EM, or aerobic Bug Juice (compost tea) is silly to be kind, and asinine to be exact.

Aerobic and fermented microorganisms can and have been combined in soil for growing healthy, nutritious, and safe organic foods. Also, it many areas of pollution control, animal feeds, and human health have said techniques been deployed successfully. Those who disagree with the use of Bug Juice, BIM, EM, and both aerobic/anaerobic compost tea have every right to do so. However, to troll threads throughout the community twisting information that has not even been read leaves much to be desired. Let us trust that such antics will immediately come to a halt so we can go about the business of making and/or using compost, soil, and mulch

Blutranes

After Blutranes criticism I made some research and found something interesting about yeasts.

Pasteur effect
The effect was discovered in 1857 by Louis Pasteur, who showed that aerating yeasted broth causes yeast cell growth to increase, while conversely, fermentation rate decreases.

I didnt know about it.
So, it is really possible to air-pump Bug Juice, I was wrong.
Live and learn! :)

Valerie RU said:

"I didnt know about it."

I truly appreciate your finding what you needed to read in order to get the both of us on the same page. Had I known that you needed the knowledge Pasteur had discovered I would have gladly posted it, but I too didnt know what you needed to see. Learning is what I come to this forum for day after day; and each day I am never disappointed.

Again, thank you for your post; not many would have been so kind

Blutranes

I think you would want to cover the soil with some sort of organic matter or cover crop before the summer sun bakes the clay. The organic matter or cover plants will also provide food for the beneficial beasties. A lot of seed companies sell seed mixes for "clay busting".

I had no idea when I started this thread that there would be so many good posts.

I'm still not sure in which order I will do the various soil building treatments but do appreciate all the extra info and links posted. Probably depends on weather and which amendments I can get soonest.

We still have snow on the ground so it will be a few weeks before I can do anything but I'll let you all know how it goes. Various brews, cover crops, anything that will help the soil organisms and boost the OM will be tried. Going on vacation soon so I'll be ready to WORK when we return. ;-)

Sorry for the returning to this thread, too late to continue. Just a remark from (other than Teruo Higa) soil scientist. It seems that Yeasts are not so good in soil by itself.

Molasses: Sweet and Super by Malcolm Beck
5. Yeasts...... these are fungi that grow in low oxygen conditions. They look like big round to oblong balloons that some times grow in clumps, and look rather like little cactus clumps. Not good to be seeing alot of these in soil. Definite indicators of compaction and lack of oxygen. Yeasts aren't good at building structure or helping make things better in soil, at least that I have ever seen. An EM without lots of yeasts would be better than one that has lots.

This is the orginal bug juice recipe. I bubble mine now with a fish aquruim pump.

This is what you need in order to make Bug Juice.

One 5 gallon bucket.
Corn starch
Bread yeast
MaxGro our fishmeal product, or another source of protein. Blood meal will work.
Ripe fruit, such as plums, apples, apricots, peaches, watermelons, peeled bananas or whatever. No citrus.

The Bug Juice Formula

Fruit: The fruits mentioned above contain sucrose, proteins, various vitamins and other nutrients, easily digestible cellulose and pectin. They are the perfect food for soil microorganisms. Pit the fruit, and smash it so it can be more rapidly digested by microorganisms. It should be mush. Add 1 pound or so to the bucket. Decaying fruit that has fallen off a tree is the best. Just save it for making Bug Juice.

Cornstarch: Starch is present in all organic matter as a form of storage energy. Bugs need to degrade it in the soil in order to obtain a carbon source for their metabolism. Add 5 tablespoons to the bucket.

MaxGro or blood meal: MaxGro is a heat sterilized fishmeal that has a high nutrient and growth promoting value for plants and microorganisms. It is the protein source for the bugs and the source of biochemical building blocks for the auxin and cytokinin plant growth hormones. Blood meal is a poor substitute, but it is more readily available. Add 5 tablespoons to the bucket.

Yeast: Yeast is a cheap source of B vitamins. It is also a source of cytokinins and protein. Mix two teaspoons of yeast, two teaspoons of sugar and one teaspoon of bread flour to 2 cups of warm water. When the yeast stops foaming, it has consumed most of the sugar. Add 2 tablespoons of corn starch, 1 tablespoon of bread flour and allow the mixture to sit for 2 hours. You are adapting the yeast to the starch. This is important. In order to break down starch, the yeast must be induced to secrete the enzyme alpha amylase. You want to promote this reaction. Most sugars in the soil are in the form of starchnot sucrose.

You have now mixed the ingredients, a handful of good compost and added water. Mix periodically to aerate the mix and leave the bucket in the sun. After one week, start applying the Bug Juice to the compost or table scraps you have collected, or directly to poor soil. Bug Juice can be directly applied to plants, trees, grass, whatever. It is disgusting to look at, but it is a powerful organic "nutrient soup" for the soil. And you made it. You are now officially a backyard scientist.

Don't have a lot of time to post so will try to keep this short.

I do not know whether our natural clay soil is expansive or not. I had no trouble years ago when I first began gardening here with building the soil using sawdust, manure, mushroom manure, growing cover crops, and amending each year for the past 12 with compost. So with the new info from the knowledgeable people on this forum I'm sure the soil in the new garden will be improved. Not easily or quickly but *eventually*.

I now have 5 compost bins, collect produce trimmings from the grocery store, had a load of horse manure/sawdust bedding delivered, and am still depriving my lawns of the clippings. Did feed the lawn with sugar and alfalfa tea so it's looking not too bad for a weedy organic lawn and I'm not feeling too guilty about using the clippings in the compost bins. No leaves available until fall so I have to use what's available.

I've made a batch of Bug Juice and a batch of BIM with yogurt whey. Doing my usual thing with alfalfa tea but added a bit of the BIM and the noxious smell disappeared. Interesting, no? :-)

From the areas we had slash fires last fall I collected pieces of biochar and added that to the new beds when DH tilled in the horse manure/bedding.

We're not doing food crops this year except a few things in the old part of the garden so no dangers with manure.

Weather has not been cooperative and real life has changed some plans but we are keeping on, keeping on, and the old garden looks good and the new ones surviving. Keeping busy currently fencing the new gardens, then garden house to be built, and more beds created. Natural grasses and weeds growing well in some unimproved areas so the clay soil is at least somewhat fertile. They get weedwhacked so they don't go to seed. I'd like to get some cover crops planted but can't irrigate everything so may wait til fall.

I'm very grateful to have found this forum altho when I have to turn all 5 compost bins I know it was easier to only have one cold compost bin I did nothing with! LOL However 5 is definitely better long-term.

Hope everyone is on track with the benefits of growing and feeding soil organisms for improved production. A little bit of work for (I believe) large benefits.

Thanks to all who posted useful info.

I live in expansive soils and the only way to dig is to moisten first. Many homes here have cracks and the new ones use special foundations. When I started my garden 3 years ago I got a truck load of compost. I keep adding compost and chicken manure with a straw mulch and it is almost to the point were I can use a garden fork with out soaking it all first.