Rick, I have a similar and yet opposite problem to yours in that I need to choose roses that survive here in my uniquely hot microclimate. I'm in inland San Diego County at about 1800 feet in land that's a sort of semicircle, with another 500 feet of hot, boulder-strewn slope behind us. It traps a lot of heat, and roses like hybrid musks that do well elsewhere have had to be shovel pruned, with the honorable exception of Lavender Dream. Modern purple roses fry to a crisp so they're all gone. I've discarded at least 80 roses, which is a lot since I now have 90 at most. There's a learning curve and others' advice is only partially helpful because my case is somewhat unique. The good news is that you begin to get smarter as you go along (such as your need to know a rose's genetic background as a basis for selection). Armed with the right knowledge you can have a beautiful garden almost anywhere. Abraham Darby failed miserably here too, for obviously different reasons, but I'm having good success with smaller Austins that are own-root. The bigger monsters take up too much space anyway so this works well for me. Climate extremes force you to garden more intelligently, and I think it's a challenge that we can take on and even enjoy.

Ingrid

This is the hardest part of gardening to my way to thinking, deciding to grow what suits you climate as opposed to what suits your heart. We can afford a few compromises for those plants we love best, but an entire garden full of unhappy plants is not, alas, a thing of beauty.

Rosefolly

Wise advice from Ingrid and Rosefolly. I still consider myself a novice, having been at this for less than 10 years. I discovered old roses and fell in love with the Bourbons, Albas, Gallicas and Moss roses - all which are pathetic and do not bloom in my area with a notable exception in Felicite Parmentier.

I discovered the Teas and Noisettes, and they're great here, and then had to look and try though many different Austins before I hit on ones that are happy here. It's odd too...as my soil improves from mulching and composting, I am able to make more Austins happy - which is nice, because I love them.

I also find myself coming the full circle in some ways, planting more moderns in areas I can use as a cutting garden of sorts. We have lots more rose bushes and flowers at the abbey than ever before but (ironically) less roses for the vase! I bought quite a few Hybrid Teas and Grandifloras for a newly reconfigured area this past week because I want flowers to pick for the church.

Sorry for going on too long. I also wondered if your grafted plants go "own-root" by burying the graft underground? I wonder if that would lengthen the life/hardiness of the plant.

Hello Ingrid, it is interesting to hear similar musings from the other ( hot ) side of the climate zone spectrum. I was reading another thread the other day where someone was asking if you can have too many roses? I think growing roses in a challenging climate helps to nip the abandonment with which I acquire roses in the bud to a great extent. You can spend a lot of money and kill a lot of plants in a "rose challenge zone" if you aren't careful. I don't kill very many anymore, but I do remove some every year if they don't perform and replace them with ones I've researched.

Jerome, I have never seen any of my grafted roses turn own root, though I bury the grafts quite deep here. I suspect that they spend all of their engergy just coming back from winter die back every year. The own root roses I grow are generally smaller than the grafted ones and take three to four years to mature and catch up. I have found that the challenge of growing roses in this cold climate is a bit of motivator for me anyway. When I first moved here ten years ago I didn't even know if any varieties other than Explorers, Rugosas and Spinosissima's would grow here. They will, but it takes dedication and perseverence.

Cheers,

Rideau Rose Lad

Rosefolly, I've heard those happy plants referred to by Kelly Norris as "thrivers, not just survivors"....from his "Zoneworthy" talk.

Here is a link that might be useful: Garden Musings blog on Kelly Norris.

The idea of shovel pruning roses seems so weird to me. I still remember when I first started shopping for own root roses and the woman at the nursery confided in me that the correct answer to "when is the best time to plant roses" is "20 years ago". Since even my oldest roses are only in the ground now for about 15 years, I figure we are still working out our accommodations. I can't quite get my mind around the idea that there are roses whose value can't be mined if they are given the correct attention and care. I suppose for some the roses are only to make them look good so only good looking roses are of value, but I haven't gotten to that point yet. Maybe in another 5 years when my oldest roses have actually been here for 20 years, but....I'd guess by then they will have made peace with each other.....

Good article Professor and a very useful concept to keep in mind when pushing zonal barriers with roses. Survival is one thing, thriving is something completely different. So I shall keep the term "zonal thrivers" in my mind from now on when I trial my roses. I already have a personal list.

Cheers, Rick