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black lace elderberry

17 years ago

i'm thinking of getting this shrub.

planning it for a partial shade site(sun from mid morn til mid afternoon) spot tends to be moist. with forest pansy

redbud and jane magnolia and an old rose of sharron bush. with chocolate joe-pie weed and queen of the meadow.

I really like the highly cut leaves. flowers and berries aren't a problem either.

what are your experiences with this new shrub? will it like the home i want to give it? other suggested plantings for it?

diggerb

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Comments (13)

jenny_in_se_pa
17 years ago
Since it's a relatively new release, much of the info on it has come from Canada or Europe. I am trying one for the first time this year and have it in a part-sun spot as well. I have a feeling that to keep the darkest leaves, it may need to be in a more full sun position (but I'll be watching to see what the leaves do), otherwise it may go muddy or greenish.
ornata
17 years ago
I have several growing in part sun - they keep their dark colour very well (and also grow extremely fast!)
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Interesting the very different experiences folks are having with this shrub. So I thought I would add my two cents from Toronto. I have two in my front garden (one of either side of the front walk), which is part sun and clay soil with lots of organic content. And they are excellent. I keep them relatively small with regular pinching, but I let them go a bit this Spring so I would get flowers and there are dozens on each shrub (still only about three inches across but growing everyday). They are bullet-proof and vigorous, for me, and their colour and form and highly dissected leaves are not easily replaceable. I have them with (among others) Liberty hosta, pincushion boxwood, Rozanne Geranium, Jack Frost Brunnera, Full Moon Maple, Krossa Regal and Blue Mammoth hostas, and Incrediball hydrangeas. I love the mix but it would be boring without the contrast this shrub brings, which makes everything around it pop. If I can figure out how to post pictures someday, I will.
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eshga, I think you could justifiably call Elder a small tree. If left unpruned Sambucus nigra grows a single trunk, or at least a small number of trunks and can reach 20 feet or so, easily as big as a Rowan. It's one of those in between sort of woody plants. Old Elder trees are common in the British countryside.
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I bought a decorative elderberry a couple of years ago. It very well could have been Sambuca. I remember it was fairly expensive with dark lacey foliage, and stems. I planted it by my natural pond/stream thinking it liked to be moist. Didn't do anything really, and didn't come back the next year either. Maybe too much moisture. I live by Guelph, Ont. zone 5b.
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Our landscape advisor is trying to talk me out of putting an Elderberry Black Lace at a most-prominent corner of our house, to be an anchor plant. She says they haven't had good luck with them, and suggests a Ninebark instead. The Ninebark are nice - but the Black Lace looks amazing! I'd much rather use it, if I had good hope that it would do well. I'm ~60 miles south of Minneapolis-St. Paul. So, I'd appreciate any thoughts. Has your Black Lace Elderberry achieved its mentioned full height of ~5 feet? If it dies back in winter, will it re-achieve that full height the next year? (I will likely buy a 1-gallon plant.) Is there a best time of year to plant it? Thanks in advance for any feedback! Rose
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jenny_in_se_pa
17 years ago
That's good to know ornata. Is the new growth greenish and then darkens as it matures? I'm just starting to see some new growth now and it is green.
ornata
17 years ago
New growth is slightly greenish but it darkens fairly quickly.
jenny_in_se_pa
17 years ago
Great! Thanks much! :-D
s_flann
17 years ago
I am interested in this shrub but I don't want it to get big. I've read that it can be severely pruned so as to maintain a compact form. Has anyone had luck with this?
Donna
17 years ago
I have read that Sambucus bushes tend to be "gawky" when they are young. Anyone have experience with this? I have a cut-leaf green one and it certainly has. I am always a hesitant pruner, but have cut the branches on mine back to try to make them bushier. Was this a mistake?
Just as an added note: they do seem to like a steady supply of moisture.
mimi_stpaul
17 years ago
I have the Sutherland Elderberry bush. I have been training it into a small tree. It really is a fast grower it is supposed to get about 8ft tall 6ft wide. Since it is now a tree form the 6ft wide is no problem and it really does look nice in my tiny yard. I am going to get the Black Lace and do the same with it too.
kept
17 years ago
My local nursery would not order Black Lace because she was convinced since it was an Elderberry that it would send up invasive suckers. Anyone have that problem?
Vic
felisar (z5)
17 years ago
Deer decimated my plant so if deer are an issue in your area I would suggest you cage it for protection.
Tim Wood
17 years ago
Black Lace is a form of Sambucus nigra so it does not sucker as does S. canadensis. Also - if you grow only one clone you will not get much if any fruit. It is self incompatable.

I also beleive that the species blooms on old wood. It blooms in the spring and not in mid-summer as does S. canadenis. I cut mine back each spring and pinch it often to get a real bushy plant, but I only get a few flowers and no fruit. The new growth is green but changes quickly to dark black.
kept
17 years ago
I just purchased a Black Lace. I trimmed the bottm 12 inches to train into a tree. Can anyone tell me the proper way to get it shaped into a small tree?
Thanks,
Vic
zuni53_yahoo_com
13 years ago
The plant does not sucker. It is grown primarily for foliage and flowers, but is not a fast grower in Ontario (zone 5.) Here is an excellent site about how to prune:

Here is a link that might be useful: Black Lace Elderberry

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