Any suggestions about door paint colors, given the existing other colors? I think a black door can look super elegant in many cases, but maybe wouldn't work as well with my shutters which are dark brown. Interesting about not installing new plants when a house is on market. My thought was that filling in a blank space (within reason) might look better. My market is probably first time home buyers. Younger people who aren't yet gardeners may not see the value/ potential of a blank slate. Indoors, my realtor and a friend have said my minimalist furnishings are cold looking and need some strategic items to make rooms more inviting. Considering that, I was thinking a couple bigger plants would make the outdoors -- by magic! -- more inviting. I take your points about the addition of permanent plants not being 100 percent called for in home selling. I'm probably dreaming outside of my budget anyway. To answer publickman, storm doors insulate the primary door against winter cold air/ summer hot air, and protect the primary door from driving rain. Maybe storm doors were first developed for entrances that don't have a porch or other roof. Also many storm doors have screens for summer use. Thanks again everyone.

Yes, a small above ground pond would more than likely freeze. Where I'm at, it gets cold (below freezing), then it'll warm up to about 35/40, rain, then drop below freezing again so then we end up with ice everywhere.... This last winter was super mild and quite pleasant, but we go in cycles. We have mild winters then we have cold rainy ones, then cold snowy ones, then cold rainy ones, then mild...and the cycle continues. The nice thing about the location I've picked is that it will be somewhat protected from wind (which is what really gets us up here when it comes to things freezing!), it is somewhat protected from the rain, one side of the pond would be up against the house and the other side up against our porch which would be a bit of a heat source...I know not much but, but enough to help. We have some plants here that if you plant them out in the yard, even if you mulch them, they don't always return, but if you plant them up against the house, they get just enough eat to survive. Sooooo, I am thinking, considering it'd be fairly protected from the elements, if I toss a heater in, I might be able to keep it just above freezing. Plants I don't mind if I have to take them in, I can put them in my fish tank during the winter if there aren't too many. But I would not have room in my tank for pond fish and unless I build a separate mini indoor pond to use in the winter, I won't be able to bring pond fish in. I did consider the bathtub idea. I found one for $30 on craigslist, but the sides of it extend out a bit further than what I want so it would take up too much room on the cement. I'll keep my eye out though for something that might work. I did find a cast iron one but the guy sold it already :( Hubby wasn't excited about that anyways because he doesn't want a heavy tub to move to the backyard, hehe. Keep the ideas rolling! Once I get it done, I'll post up pictures, but it'll probably be awhile. I have summer classes starting in a week and a competition to prep for so I plan on spending the next month or two just keeping my eye out for super cheap items I can use, then after my competition I will see what items I have gathered and hopefully be able to put in the time to build it all.

Regarding the beginning of your thread - peak oil. I presume this means you are concerned about possible disruptions in the commercial food supply. If so, you are right to be. I have been experimenting with low-input food production here on the east coast for aboput eight years now. I would term it permaculture because the best food plants are self-perpetuating, and if not one should learn to save seed. Some things I've learned: the most important food for human survival is grain. Grain is also the most problematic to produce in a sustainable and survivalist fashion, that is, without fossil-fuel or animal power or their derived fertilizers. It's no accident that civilizations developed on grain and that they took a long time to do so. I don't have personal experience of socal ag, but over here the small grains are easier to raise (far fewer pest problems and more drought tolerant) and are more nutritous than maize, but much more difficult to harvest. In a necessity situation, I would plan to raise small grains in garden-type beds, fertilized with urine in rain water. Harvest will be extremely time-consuming, but would know this and be prepared to allot the time. It is also work that children could do. Potatoes and squash would be key starch crops that will produce fairly reliably with small effort and low-input. They walking onion is a perrenial that will grow almost anywhere without help. A very important survival crop, as a reliable source of vitamin C and some greenery. Some other greens such as kale, chard, and lettuce take little space and are fairly easy though irrigation is generally necessary and saving seed for chard and beets can be problematic. Legumes are critical also, of course. Lucky for you, the soil out there is genrally balanced. 6.5 soil with fairly low organic matter will produce some legume food without any amendment. Here I have to make sure to have dosed well with wood-ash in the fall and winter before planting. The large seed size is tolerant of fresh twiggy, leafy ground. The most important thing for any of us anywhere, IMO, is to know what grains are most sustainable for one's region, and to keep a good supply always on hand. A least a year's eating supply, plus two seasons of planting stock (which doesn't amount to lot, actually). 50-100 lbs per adult should do it. The first season's growth will be doing well just to provide a good planting stock for the next season, I figure. Keep some maize on hand, because it has the advantage of doing better in coarse, just cleared and amended ground. The large seeds will germinate better than small grains in forest litter. The east coast indians did it that way for centuries, although they didn't have the pest problems that exist now.

there is a plant propogation book i have wherein the author describes his own mist system. that author has a large black coil of hose in the roof of his greenhouse so that water can be heated before reaching the mist nozzles. that's at least one vote for using warm water and keeping the cuttings reasonably warm as they root. just thought i would toss that in! lol. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: mosaic z8 LA (My Page) on Sun, May 11, 03 at 11:59 With such a setup you could probably root roses under mist all winter here in Louisiana. And then as an added bonus, you could save on your power bills all summer by using it to steam your veggies :) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: tammyinwv z6/WV (My Page) on Sun, May 11, 03 at 16:05 i have been unable to find the mist heads even within an hr from my home.Someone mentioned here they found them for .50 each.would anyone be willing to get me a couple and mail them? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: wild_garden virginia z6b (My Page) on Sun, May 11, 03 at 16:32 at my lowes store the mist heads where in the indoor gardening area next to the register, i doubt the people at lowes would have even know what to look for. it was with the drip irrigation supplies, as i said in the indoor gardening area next to the big outdoor area where they sell trees and things. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mist heads supply source Posted by: RoseHawke 7b AL (My Page) on Mon, May 12, 03 at 10:37 For you folks that haven't been able to find the heads locally, try going to this site: Dripworks or here's a direct link to one of the pages with some heads:Misters . I just a couple of weeks ago ordered some irrigation supplies from them and received them quite quickly. About 4 days if I remember correctly. Haven't had a chance to put it together yet, which is probably just as well as the flood we had last week would've probably washed everything down the creek ;-). I also have the Melnor timer, and it does seem a bit confusing about its ability to do a mist cycle, but what you're doing is programing it to do one cycle (on in the am; off in the pm) and punching in a choice of watering pattern, in this case the off for 10" on for 2" pattern. I believe the idea behind the pattern was/is actually to help prevent water run-off when doing overhead watering by allowing the water to soak in between the on phases. I bought this particular timer though because when I looked at it my mind said "Ah! Mist!" (heh), even though the reason I bought it at the time was to keep a new patch of zoysia sod watered until it rooted in. My batteries did last all season last year, but it was only opening that valve 4x a day for 3 weeks, and then 1x every 4 days for a couple of months. I can see where a misting pattern of opening and closing that valve many times during the day may eat batteries, but as ShamanSherpa pointed out, it's still cheaper than a $100+ misting timer! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: patclem z7 (or 6) TN (My Page) on Fri, May 23, 03 at 8:32 Regardless of how much water it wastes, etc, I decided to experiment with misting. I am TERRIBLE at rooting cuttings. I've tried baggies. I've tried jars. I've tried special cutting trays with plastic domes. I've had one rooted cutting out of probably 50. I had the same problem finding true super-fine mist systems in the south. None at Lowe's, none at HD. They're not popular here because they don't have the same evaporating effect they have in less humid areas of the country - they make you wet here. Here's where I found mist heads. They didn't charge me anything for shipping. They were super-good to deal with online. Web Page - Phone/Fax 888-693-0578 Local/Fax (719) 495-2266 Qty: 4; Sku: 6W401; Product: Monarch Misting Nozzles M-1; Amount: $7.40 Qty: 4; Sku: 6W519; Product: Reducing Tee for Monarch Misting Nozzles; Amount: $4.40 You have to go to Lowe's or local hardware store and get a hose adapter, timers, 1/2" PVC, PVC caps, etc. I have mine set up with 2 mist heads, and about a 6' diameter section of my grass is soaked! I don't have mine on a timer yet. Results? I don't have any yet, except none of my cuttings have turned black yet. PS - I AM NOT AFFILIATED WITH THIS BUSINESS IN ANY WAY! Here is a link that might be useful: Mist Heads -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: fuselighter 7/WA (My Page) on Thu, May 29, 03 at 21:41 I am so excited about the misting bed. I went out and bought all the supplies today. Total cost was about $15 (my husband had PVC and elbows left over from installing the sprinkler system). I would like to go to an intermittent system eventually, but for now I am going with continuous. The water bill is not an issue because we have an irrigation system (there is an annual fee but it is not based on usage). I set the whole thing up in about an hour. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: debbinard Z4CO (My Page) on Sun, Jun 1, 03 at 10:54 Shamansherpa -- I could not open your picture! I live in Colorado, it gets very warm middle of June (up to upper 90's) and stays low humidity. We are on outsidewater restrictions 2xweek, so I'm not sure this method would fly. Am wondering how visible this is, or if inside is an option under lights. At any rate, I would like to propigate some rose cuttings now (is this a good time?) My daughter in law is moving and would love some plants from a rose with sentimental value. Is the rooting hormone used just the usual or special for roses? Thanks Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: mytrid Zone8b Florida (My Page) on Sun, Jun 1, 03 at 13:48 Deb, Maybe you could call your water extention office and see if you can get special permission, exsplain to them how little water it uses. Yes you use rooting hormone, there are many available. Dip and grow I here is supposed to be really good. I got some of the more exspensive stuff from a friend whom bought it threw rose imporium on line. But you can always use something like dip and grow. Deanna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: rose_enthusiast z7 TX. (My Page) on Sun, Jun 1, 03 at 15:47 Hi there Deanna! It seems to me you've managed to help a lot of people with your invaluable info. And I would like to thank you for inspiring me to start a misting bed to root my cuttings. I have one question to add to the many others you've been getting though... What rose company is it that you get your rooting hormone from? Is it Rose Emporium or the Antique Rose Emporium? I would like to purchase this product as well, since you and this company are using this to successfully root your cuttings. Thanks Again, Carlos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: mytrid Zone8b Florida (My Page) on Tue, Jun 3, 03 at 1:31 Carlos, Thank you but we should all thank AngieAnders, she is the one who did all the research and work to discover this method and then post it here for us last year! She truly diserves all the credit. I just wanted to keep any new people aware that have just started rooting this year. Best of luck all and don't forget to post your sucess! Deanna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: epiphany z5b PA (My Page) on Tue, Jun 3, 03 at 9:28 I found the Arizona Mist system which is by Orbit as mentioned at Wal-Mart. It has 12' of tubing, end cap, six misting heads and hose adapter for $14.95. Of course, it is once again cold and wet here,......all of a balmy 56°. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: auntnana 6 TN (My Page) on Thu, Jun 5, 03 at 13:06 I ordered the misting heads mentioned above from Dripworks last year and they don't put out a fine mist as much as they do a fine spray/droplets. And even though I had a pressure regulator on there, I kept having a problem with the heads blowing off! (Their drippers work perfectly by the way so it's nothing against the company) I ordered foggers from Misty Mate this year and they put out a super fine fog. Perfect for propagation. They are a litte more expensive than the ones from Dripworks but worth it. And if you ask they will ship the misting heads for $1.50. I went to HD and bought a 10-24 tap and drill set (3.00) and drilled holes in my 1/2" cvpvc and the heads just screwed right in! I bought a Melnor timer at HD for $39 and it has 1 minute spray options so I've got it set for 1 minute every 10 minutes. Can't remember the model number but it's not the one on the HD website. I hope to finish my new propagation box soon. I built one on a stand this year so I can move it around easily. Wouldn't you know, HD has plastic sheeting made just for greenhouses that I used! It's not the real thick heavy stuff either. It's only 4mil and is crystal clear see-thru! Hopefully I'll be finished this week!