It seems as if the land slopes away from the patio. What do you want to fill in?

Well, what I would like to do is remove the retaining wall and put grass everywhere. I would love to keep the patio. But the ledges are very scary. And they do not use their land to the full property line. I would prefer to keep the patio and somehow return the rest of the yard to an actual yard with grass. Does that make sense? We have not priced out how much it would cost. We could go view the house again and bring an engineer or landscape designer. I wouldnt know exactly what type of professional we would need. I know it sounds desperate. But we kind of are at this point. And we loved the house except for the death trap of a yard (due to the retaining wall).

The house is a John Laing house. I am not sure what brand the cabinets are. It is a very nice house.

One word - fencing.

Retaining walls are usually put in to level out a dangerous slope. For some reason, I could just get to the first page of the listing, so didn't see any specific photos of the backyard. However, it certainly looked like there was a significant slope/drop off behind the house.

From the dark ages, some ASCII art.

So you start with something like this
.\
o\
oo\

It's pretty steep, and not very useful for anything. So you spend a lot of money and change it to this
___
oo]
oo]

Filling the whole thing in isn't really an option because there is probably a reason for the steep hill in the first place, like a stream carved out a valley back there.

Fencing wouldnt work because we still wouldnt have a yard. We would have to put a fence at the top of the retaining wall so that it would be safe for kids which would obstruct the view (most likely) and still not leave any grassy area. There would still be a great deal of land not used. I guess I dont understand why they had to put a retaining wall so far back from the property line. And when you look at the land (and the property line on the county website) and the next door neighbors' land, it doesn't look like it was a dangerous slope. Oh well. I guess its just not meant to be. There is really no point in owning so much land when most of it cant be used or enjoyed.

We would like to remove the wall and put it at the edge of the property to maximize the land that can be used.

Since the property abuts a greenbelt (per the RE blurb), there may very well be restrictions about what you can do to restore the slope or move the retaining wall closer to the property line without impacting drainage and interferring with a natural area. Regardless, I believe the cost to demolish the existing wall, construct a new and significantly higher wall at a distance and fill to level would be prohibitive - far in excess of the $30K already spent.

I'm not sure exactly how you define "yard". There already exists a grassy area (albeit small) adjacent to the patio and the patio itself, which in many areas is as much "yard" as one can expect to find :-) There is also the possibility to develop the area below the retaining wall into a flatter, grassed area that could be appropriate for older kid's play, although the virtual tour didn't really display this area well. And a low iron fence at the top of the existing wall in a style similar to the gated arbor could ensure safety of small children while not obstructing views.

It'd be a heck of a lot cheaper to explore these and other alternatives before considering a new wall and fill, if these are even a possibility.

Thanks that is what I thought. The area below the retaining wall just has a path and really cant be made into a play area. The virtual tour makes the grassy area look much bigger than it is unfortunately. Although there is some lawn in the front. For colorado, it isn't a small yard. But for someone coming from another area, it is tiny. Colorado thinks people should use community parks. But I would really prefer to have my own yard as well. The front yard is a little more feasible for a child to play in than the back. As an adult, I love the patio we just dont know if it would be a good place for a little one to grow up.

I still think you should look at other options unless you ask the seller to make a very large consession on the price. It is a buyers market after all. You want a structural engineer and plan to spend at least $500. I JUST HOPE YOU ARE NOT RUSHING INTO ANYTHING WITHOUT THINKING IT OUT!

I dont see how we are rushing into anything considering we havent even made an offer. We just dont really like the houses in colorado. And this one we do like. But I wanted to see if it was even worth considering. So that is why I posted this question.

I think you already knew the answer before you even posted the question. {{gwi:7286}}

Listen to your instincts. Keep looking. Why purchase something you would always regret? Can you say, "money-pit"?

IronBelly

My niece has a somewhat comparable situation (I'm not sure how comparable because I haven't seen your pictures). She is on a corner lot; the front yard is largish, and has a considerable slope (which makes upkeep difficult). She has two very small children and wanted to capture some of that front yard into the backyard by moving the back fence closer to the property line and also leveling it to make it kid friendly. It would involve considerable engineering, with a couple of retaining walls. She and her husband knew this was an expensive project and budgeted $100,000. They have spent thousands of dollars on plans already, but I think they are going to abandon the project--it will cost more than they planned. These are California (Bay Area) prices, so they are high--but the lot is smallish by most of the country's standards.

This is a great example of a Landscape Inspection (even though by Internet proxies)! I think it is great to encourage more posts like this even though the OP can't really "take it to the bank" (in general, since no one has on-site info), because they do generate discussions that can be useful in considering whether a yard, same as a house, can be "fixed" to meet certain goals. Even if the OP "knew" the answer, or didn't, I can relate to a person's being frustrated and wanting to be sure they're not overlooking some easy solution, since usually there is no perfect house, only differences in the degree of fixing.

But, this gets back to the idea of, if terrain, or yards, that are "right" are scarce, but also "right" houses seem scarce, then sambuka might try to discern what is "wrong" about the houses and see whether it MIGHT be easier to remodel or update the house itself, vs. fix a non-yard.

what is it you like so much about the house? It looks beautiful on the outside but according to what I saw on your realtors website the inside is pretty common for houses in that price range.

Did you ever think about finding a house with a beautiful interior, a yard you like and change the outside to the craftsman style you appear to like? Think about how much the potential house costs, how much you will spend altering the yard (while taking care of a small child and newborn) and then what is the return on the house if you decide to sell. The market is slowing down quite a bit and that has to be taken into consideration.

While it is true houses are meant to live in they are also investments. I do not know anything about the area you are looking in but read up on functional obsolesence. If there is nothing in the area to compare it to there is no value in it. If you over develop your house it will only price so high meaning you spend $$$$ on a house put $$ inside and $$$ outside, you might only be able to get a very small percentage of that back on a resale (if you are lucky). Youe could lose quite a bit unless of course the market goes back up which I do not see happening. Think beyond the emotion on this one.

Good luck in whatever you decide to do. It can be a heart wrenching thing to fall in love with a house and then have to deal with the big BUT. It happens to me all the time. I found the perfect outfit but it does not fit (but I can always go on a diet but the reality is that a year later it is still hanging in the closet with tags on it and now going to Goodwill), found the perfect TV but it does not look right in the room I wanted it for (but I can always put it in a different room and then i still have to buy a tv), found the perfect car but hate the way the seats feel (but I can always replace the seats but I will be uncomfortable for now)...no matter how much I love it the "buts" come into play. With patience you will find what you want with a smaller sacrifice.

You probably did not get the answer you wanted here but you asked for advise and I assume you wanted honest opinions. I hope we made you think of a few things before making such a large commitment. You are talking about a half million investment so invest wisely!! I am done preaching cause I do want to beat a dead horse. Let us know what you decide and keep us posted. If you decide to do it anyway (and judging by your responses I think you will) start another topic to let us in on your project so we can all know what all is involved and how much it costs.
Regards
Ms Jay

Im not "in love" with the house. But I really cant stand the floor plans of most of the houses in colorado. They either have one large open space on the first floor and or a vaulted ceiling that carries all the noise (especially dishes) up to the second floor, or they have useless spaces either next to the entrance when you walk in (a sitting area typically), or they have no dining area or one that is right next to the front door or stairwell. I don't particularly like useless loft areas that peer over the living room which leaves even less privacy which is also very typical or colorado homes. It was just a very nice home and built by a good builder. And although the back yard sucks for children it is nice for relaxing and entertaining. Also, most yard in colorado are small or have several other houses peering into the yard and most do not have any trees or vegetation. So, its just very hard to find something suitable. I am not used to living in suburban sprawl. And I guess I wanted something that felt more like me. But its just very difficult. And as I get more pregnant, I am more and more anxious to find a house.

BTW I appreciate the continued posts and all the helpful information. But we had already resolved the issue in our minds since the post on December 1st. I didn't really need a critique on my taste in homes but just wanted advice on the landscaping issue. For those of you who helped out, I am very grateful.

Care to tell us how you resolved the issue?

We did not buy the house. I asked the question before we even made an offer on the house. We were just considering making an offer. After reading about how expensive the modifications to the yard would be, we decided not to buy it since the yard would be far too small for kids to actively play.

I just want to tell you that you are right about those loft areas carrying noise. some people put TV's up there and they compete with the downstairs noise. It annoyed my best friend so much that she wound up closing the area with a 3/4 height wall. It did not look bad and it cut down the noise competition considerably. Sounds weird I know but it came out pretty nice. Maybe you should think of that possibility when looking?

I am sorry for all my 2 cents but I felt like you knew the house was not right because of the yard and just wanted someone to talk you out of it. Anyway right now it is a buyers market so you might be able to find just want you want in the next price range up but reduced down to your range [or lower]. That would be exciting!!

I hope you have a wonderful holiday season and the new year brings you your dream home and a beautiful healthy baby!!

Ms Jay