Lowering pH with vinegar, again

14 years ago

I've been notified that my initial message was "mis- directed" due to a server change. I will re-post.

The majority of my plants prefer a pH of 5.5., so I included ~1-2 t. of vinegar per gallon when giving them water and fertilizer. I'd prefer to water/fert all of my plants out of the same mix. My question is whether the vinegar will have an adverse effect on my other plants. I've read that, in general, plants prefer a reduction in pH and alkalinity from city water. I have done a general test (from a similar test kit that JAG recommended) and found that my water is high in pH and fairly high in alkalinity. Do you think the vinegar will be a problem for my other plants that do not have specific pH needs?

Thank you,

Gail

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Comments (3)

aliceinvirginia
14 years ago
Don't know if this is a suitable follow-on question - if you want to fertilize with lime, without increasing pH, how much vinegar would it take to do it?

Other question would be whether that is appropriate for a quick Blossom End Rot fix.

I asked a friend with a Ph.D in Chemistry about that last year. Her response was that getting test strips would be the easiest.
monet_g
Original Author
14 years ago
Hi Alice,
I did use test strips and the pH was high, as well as the alkalinity. My main goal is to lower both for the majority of my plants. My concern is for the other plants that will get the same mix. I guess, in other words, do any plants require a high pH?
Gail
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Kolaha, you have no e-mail address so can't be contacted directly, so I will hi-jack this post to suggest 1) you post in the Citrus Forum as they will have more experience than most of us with your trees, and 2) household vinegar is a very weak acid at 3-5%, and is used in cooking all the time, so I do not understand why you don't want to use it, diluted, in the water for your citrus. If you still have questions, why not ask in a separate post of your own? Hope I was some help. Ccox, I would agree with those who suggest you get a soil test doen, either from you county extension agent's office or from a reputable lab - don't rely on a home test, as they are notoriously unreliable. It isn't only the pH of the soil, but what minerals are present, in what forms and concentrations, that determine how well your plants will grow. Get your water tested also, although there, I think you can get the pH test strips from a drug store anad use them - if they are good enough for medical use then they are probably accurate enough for garden use. If your soil turns out to be really off, then I think growing in containers will be a lot easier than changing the soil's pH over a large area. If it is only a little off, then using sulfur compounds as suggested, and maybe adding vinegar to your well water, at least in the beginning, as the compounds will take time to react/act with the soil, will make enough difference to make tomatoes happy. Most plants can grow in a pH range, none that I know of demand exactly one pH level. I wouldn't add peat moss to your soil, as it is very slow to break down, adds little organic matter to the soil, and the latest findings seem to say that it does little to change pH anyway. You say you have been adding things for 3 years to add to the OM, so keep doing that.
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Sulfur is probably your best choice. It works slowly but will lower your pH. Ferrous sulfate and/or aluminum sulfate also work well, and very quickly. Vinegar, citrus juices and peels, etc., and other sources of organic acids are not good soil acidifiers except in the very short-term (days). As they biodegrade, their effect is lost. What you've done may be ok. You'd get a more uniform result by spreading the sulfur over the entire area under the drip line (and out a foot or two beyond it) and raking it in, or dissolving the FeSO4 or Al2(SO4)3 in water and sprinkling it over that entire same area. I do wonder why your pH remains that high -- are there chunks of old construction concrete in your soil, or is your soil fill dirt containing a lot of shell? Or are you in an area where the limestone bedrock is near the surface? Or has the tree been heavily limed in the past? Most Florida soils are naturally quite acidic until or unless you bring the pH up.
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That's a good point Joe, I use it to lower the ph of the tap water prior to adding dry soluble nutes. I believe this may assist in preventing any of the mineral elements from locking out while dissolving. It's quite likely that once dissolved, the elements provide additional buffering capacity to the solution. My ph does begin to slowly rise after about 1+1/2 weeks at which time I begin making small bi-weekly adjustments to keep it down. I usually go 3 weeks between change outs, at which point the ph is quite jumpy and can go either way almost overnight. Keep in mind that many plants can adjust to out of range ph over time but large & sudden ph changes are likely to shock plants into displaying a host of deficiency/toxicity symptoms. In any event it works for me, so I'll stick with it until I can afford those Ion exchange resins posted a while back. However I would still adjust ph before mixing nutes. Ken
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tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
14 years ago
Plants in containers do best at about a full pH point lower than plants grown out, but container media has low bulk-density and low buffering capacity in relation to mineral soils, which makes the pH of the soil solution the more important consideration.

Yes, some plants that have difficulty limiting uptake of Fe, Mn and a couple of other minor elements might prefer a media pH or soil solution pH that is higher than 6.0, but if you make the nutrients available in the soil solution, you needn't be so worried about media pH. It's been years since I've given any consideration to trying to maintain any particular media pH ..... just don't worry about it - and I have posted a ton of pictures of perfectly healthy happy plants .... and my irrigation water has a pH that hovers around 8.5. After you determine what your media pH is, how do you intend to manage it? It changes by the hour. ;o)

I know the pH of the 5:1:1 mix with lime will come in around 6.0, and the gritty mix with gypsum about the same. Beyond that, it is what it is because I'm not going to hover over every container & micromanage. I wouldn't have any time to spend here!

If you're worried, figure out how much vinegar it takes to bring a gallon of your irrigation water down to around 6.0. Add that amount to your water every time you water and forget about it. I sometimes do that in the winter when plants show some chlorosis (a pH induced FE deficiency), but the vinegar clears it up in short order.

Alice - if you want to fertilize with lime without increasing pH, fertilize with gypsum. That supplies the Ca that lime supplies w/o a pH increase. You'll then need to add a small amount of Epsom salts to your fertilizer solution each time you fertilize to keep the Ca:Mg ratio favorable. THAT is an effective safeguard against BER caused by an ACTUAL nutritional deficiency, but adding nutrients to the soil can't correct BER caused by deficiencies due to cultural issues (high humidity and cloudy cool days, excess water/lack or aeration in the soil, excess P or Mg are some of the other potential causes of BER).

Al

Lowering pH with vinegar, again

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aliceinvirginia

monet_g
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Lowering pH with vinegar, again

Comments (3)

aliceinvirginia

monet_gOriginal Author

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tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)

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monet_g
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