Well, I make mine on the stove top, in my (pink) cast iron skillet. To make the patties, I put a ball of ground beef between some plastic wrap and roll it out with my rolling pin. Sounds odd I know but SO likes thinner burgers that crisp up on the outside a little better. And the method I use keeps the pressure even and doesn't compact the meat, just spreads it out while holding it together. If you shape it into a ball before doing it it will stay round. I do use the same method on mine, which is thicker than his. I season ours with garlic powder, onion powder and pepper. Salt on mine not on his. Or sometimes I will use a preblended seasoning mix on one side only,as those tend to be really salty (and i LOVE salt). SO likes his burgers well done, and I do not really care about the temperature, as long as its not rare. So I cook them for the same amount of time usually. I flip them once only. Melt the cheese on top in the pan while its finishing cooking.

I prefer when SO grills burgers, but that does not happen a lot.

I have learned, after much trial and error, that I am a bonafide burger snob. Things that have made a discernible difference is that it has to be absolutely top quality beef. I have been burned so many times by beef that looks good, and should be fine (considering the $$$) and have it be less than I want. I understand that grinding my own may be the solution, but I haven't yet made that leap. What has helped is that instead of buying a package of ground beef, I always ask the butcher, or the guy behind the counter, to give me the freshest he's got. Next is a thinner patty is better in my book. I tend to cook them with butter in my cast iron pan. The bun treatment is also very important. Grilled with butter is good, but too much trouble. Toasted is easier, but not quite there. I tend to like simplicity. Just salt and pepper, and mayo, and lettuce (maybe American cheese) In short, I want the meat to shine. I've also learned that everybody else's burgers tend to be better than mine! dang. I'm also learning that instead of trying my best to cook a burger as good as 5 guys....I just go to 5 guys. Maybe that's the answer!!

I don't know if I can claim to help with good burgers, but I'll share that we've been enjoying mini smashburgers - I take a pound of wagyu and cut into 6 pieces (I only need one, the guys can share the rest) - and I barely have to touch the raw meat - and then put the squares on the very hot griddle, after 20 or so seconds, flip and smash (a quick sear and then flipping before smashing just helps them not to stick to the spatula).... then flip and put cheese on if desired, hopefully get a good crust without overcooking.... I'm still working on it but I can't see going back to a more traditional burger . They don't turn out circular, but rolling them into balls first would at least approximate that. Anyway, that's what we do lately every couple of months !

As said above, it's all about the beef.

The fashion at the moment is to have a metal "iron" to really flatten the burger against your griddle....... haven't tried it but I'd like to LOL I'd rather have 2 thinner patties in my bun than a thick one as I like the burnt edge more than the juicy rare meat.

To the meat, just salt, pepper, a hint of garlic. No egg. And, we have a baker that lakes the BEST buns so that, too, is a game-changer. The combi of wonderful meat and great buns is so good. No fuss.

Grass fed ground beef is touchier when it comes to cooking temperature. It needs to be lower for cooking than for grain fed. It is also recommended that the burger be removed earlier--135 for medium well (it will cook some more while sitting). Med-well for grain fed is removed at about a 20 degrees higher temperature reading (wich will also continue to cook while sitting).

If you are cooking grass fed hamburgers the same as grain fed, they are being overcooked for that type of meat. I've heard the same goes for other grass-fed cuts, such as steaks. Overcooking causes pronounced degrading of flavor in grass-fed beef, according to the various experts I checked with.

Personally, I didn't like the taste of the grass fed beef i have tried. But that could well be because the cooks tend to treat it the same as grain-fed, causing the resulting flavor to become inferior. I don't have a desire to spend more for that type of meat, only to have it not taste good.

I usually make a ball, flatten with my palm onto the counter or cutting board, fix the edges a bit but no need to go crazy. Don’t overhandle is true, but I once heard someone say that as long as you know not to overhandle it, you’re at low risk of overhandling it. In other words, don’t be afraid to shape it.

As for the choice in meat, I’d probably avoid grass fed for burgers unless you specifically like the flavor. Since you’re talking about using 80/20 anyway, any health benefits will be negligible if we’re just talking about an occasional burger. Personally I buy 80/20 for burgers and use leaner bison for most other ground beef applications.

I don’t have a lot to offer as to how to cook. I use my Griswolds, but hope to buy a griddle. One side until nice crust, flip.

One tip I’ve heard is to salt last minute, as presalting can make the meat gummy. I can’t confirm this one from personal experience, I just run with it. This would seem to preclude using salt in any seasoning that’s mixed in, but I don’t do that, either.

It’s good to get a feel for doneness, as probing burgers really can make the juices run out.

2nd try!

1/4pound ground round. Make into a ball. if you do not want a charcoal grill, best!, heat a cast iron skillet on medium high.

Smash ball into a flat round. Place in skillet and cook, flip and smash with spatula. Let cook, flip and smash agsin. When it is done to what you want, remove and put on bun. Toast bun if wanted.

ETA: you can cook and add mushrooms, onions, cheese, or whatever!

Thank-you all for all the tricks and hints!

Re stuff inside, I put eggs and seasoning (and vegetables) in meatballs, but a burger isn't a meatball. I was willing to change that attitude if that were where I was going wrong, but that doesn't seem to be what y'all are saying.

Re beef quality, that perhaps has been my downfall. The best in my book is the grass fed, though I prefer bison if I can get it fresh. I don't mind the packets for something like sloppy joes or stuffed cabbage, but for meatballs or meatloaf, and I thought for burgers by analogy, I want the grass fed beef or bison, freshly ground from the butcher. Bison seems to be out of style here, though. The bison we used to get tastes like the beef from my childhood. I don't care for flavorless beef. I don't know how this fits with these grass fed warnings, but I'm not wed to a themometer. I've only had an instant read that I trust for a few years. In general, I know by looking or touching, and I'm not above the tip of the knife if I'm really unsure, though that's more for a thick steak. I don't cook enough beef to be stuck any particular times. I don't think, therefore, that the mentioned quicker cook of grass fed has been my problem. Trying not to go over with a burger is a trick, so I just pay attention, and generally get it right.

I'm going to try to put all this together and start experimenting, but for now I'm still garhering info, so if there's any more to be said, I'm listening.

Grass fed with grain added to the mix for the last few months before processing is much better tasting than strictly grass fed IMO. But then we have our own small herd of Angus/Hereford mix (called Baldies) so what do I know.

I believe you!

This is the recipe I remembered from Ina G. I tried this long ago and am pretty sure I halved the ingredients and would’ve used A1 Steak Sauce. I just didn’t think it was that good. Did not need any egg yolks IMO.

Ina Garten - Hamburgers

I cook them like FOAS. Add salt last minute. Tuck the edges in your hand before placing on the medium hot grill. Too much flame and they get too dry on the edges...medium flame is best. 80/20 beef, you need a little natural grease to get the flavor when it drips onto the flame.

Note: I don't like anything cooked over charcoal that's been lit with lighter fluid.

Agreed about the petrochemicals. I use a chimey to light charcoal, but I'm trying to make indoor burgers. :)

Some time ago, I had bison burger at Ted's Montana Grill. Very good.

Ted Turner passed away a few days ago. Mr. Turner had 50,000 heads of bison.

dcarch

Gyr can you explain why it makes a difference - grain or grass? Ithought it was a combination of the food and the race and the way it's treated that made a difference - once it's minced, how is this all affected, please?

When they eat grain, they are usually in a food lot and do nothing but eat and ???. No exercise= very tender meat with lots of fat. Grass fed has to move to eat giving less tender, leaner meat. It does have a different taste.

As LoneJack said, you can have the best of both. Let the beef roam and eat grass for most of the time, the confine and feed grain before slaughter.

You don't have to confine the animal to feed out on grain. The ones that are being fed out on grain just need to be separated from the rest of the herd but they can AND should still have access to pasture or at least a hay bale. This is what we do. Feeding cows strictly grain is not good for their rumen function and may eventually kill them. They need roughage for a healthy diet.

What they do in the CAFOs is another story. They are only interested in increasing the animal's weight and marbling the meat as fast a possible.

Not speaking from experience but from what “I gather”, it seems the advice to cook to lower temp and that there’s a shorter window, are based largely on the assumption that the grass fed beef is leaner. But in this particular case plllog is saying she’ll use 80/20 grass fed, so it’s more apples to apples.

Or perhaps gala to fuji. The fat itself has a different composition, with grass fed being higher in polyunsaturated fat, grain finished more monounsaturated fat. The poly renders faster. ”In theory” this could make a drier grass fed burger if cooked to the same degree, but the fat difference is probably too minimal to make much of a noticable difference.

To reiterate, I’m not talking from experience here. I just took some interest in the topic and this is where my internet queries have me landing.

Well, I hadn't heard of any of it until this thread, That makes sense based on my limited experience. The fat ratio is far more important to a burger than other ground beef recipes I make, I would think, but since I (and to the best of my knowledge, those whom I cook for, though so long as they don't complain, I just give 'em what I like) do not like soft meat--we have good dental work and aporeciate foods which use teeth. Smooth and fluffy mashed potatoes, yes, but smooth and fluffy meat? No. Just no. I also really dislike smooth and fluffy beans (as in blenderized) and expect texture even in meat patés. If the grass fed really is less soft, that's fine with me, but as Chloebud said, I don't think there's such a big difference when comparing like to like.

...Mr. Picky likes a very well marbled prime steak, but he doesn't eat anything made with ground beef. I don't care for all that fat and reject over-marbled steaks for myself. I have flashbacks to a very famous, high end steakhouse where my meat was served in a veritable pool of liquid fat. I mean, it had measurable depth. I refused to go back, ever. For my own druthers, I'm fine with 95/5 for most uses, but I think burgers need more fat, so thought 80/20 was a good choice (do any of you disagree on that? Some have said they use other, but haven't said "you should..."), and I like the flavor of grass fed, and the quality of what I can buy. I've heard people extol using 55/45 or similar, but I think it's for the super thick, rare, leaking juice, kind of burgers I'm not trying to make, and I've only seen it in bulk in discount stores.

I'm listening avidly to all of what y'all are saying. I'm not sure of sourcing for grain finished ground beef. I see labels for grass fed or not, and fat content. I think I've seen "grain finished" on steak. I can ask the butchers. They grind on site. But I think they'd promote it if it were grass fed and grain finished.

But, with all this valuable discussion of what the animal ate, it's the cooking of the burger that I think is the issue fo me. I'm overbooked this week, but perhaps I can start experimenting on the weekend.

“…but I think burgers need more fat, so thought 80/20 was a good choice…”

It’s definitely a good choice and probably best if you prefer a medium-well to well result.

“But I think they'd promote it if it were grass fed and grain finished.”

All beef is grass fed. The question is how it’s finished. 100% grass fed is (supposedly) grass finished, otherwise it’s grain finished.

So ”grass fed” doesn’t guarantee 100% grass fed. Nor does “pasture raised” or “naturally raised” or anything similar. Look for third party certification if it’s important to you.

Do you have a grinder? Buy the tough cuts, they have more flavor. Chuck roast or similar cuts, and trim out most of the fat. Coarse grind. Add back in what fat you want. Fat is flavor.

Handle as little as possible. Hot cast iron with a very little oil to grease. Smash burgers are just what the name says. Cook hot and fast, smash flat as you flip. Do not over cook. I do NOT salt as I cook.

I'm not into smash burgers but thanks for the tip. I do have a grinder, but I'm happy to let the butcher do it. It doesn't cost more.

Hubby likes smash burgers.

I get that! I'm always impressed by your devotion to his druthers. I only have to cook for Mr. Picky a few times per year and it takes fortitude. You're a good person. :)

LOL, easier to cook his smash burger than what I like which involves the Weber, charcoal, premiun beef, bacon, onions, and mushrooms.

I haven't had time clear to start the experiments, but I found some ground beef from the farm's farmer's market, which is delivered frozen in standard 1 lb, packets, and made sloppy joes to use it up.

Re the grass fed of it all, it says on the label, "Grass fed and grass finished." I could sense no oddities in the flavor. It has flavor, but just tastes like beef. I wonder if the grass in other parts of the country tastes weird or something. Or if people are just so used to all grain fed, feedlot beef that real grazing beef tastes odd to them, or what. I am bemused.

Compressed and frozen is fine for sloppy joes, but I still think not for burgers, at least until I get better at making them. It was 85/15 fat ratio and really too fatty. I think I'd originally intended it for something else. I'm thinking it would be a good ratio for a burger though, so if that's what's on offer, rather than 80/20, I'll try it.

My beef is grass fed and grass finished, although they do get an occasional peanut butter and jelly sandwich or powdered sugar donut from the grandkids when they visit, so certainly not strictly organic. They have 30 acres of pasture to wander about in and just do whatever cow-like thing suits them. In the winter they get hay. My beef is about 95% lean, which I like and as a bonus, makes the cardiologist happy. If I need a bit extra fat, I add some olive oil. It tastes even better if I add butter instead of olive oil. I'm somewhat of an oddity in that I dislike beef tallow, chicken skin and pork fat. (shrug)

I have to disagree with FOAS. Not all cattle get to eat grass. Some (perhaps many/most) feedlots give compressed alfalfa pellets and chopped corn silage and all manner of things that aren't grass or hay, called "formulated feed". Nutrition experts are hired to mix the feed for optimum weight gain. Cattle are meant to forage and grain based diets are unhealthy but they do make fat cattle and fat is weight and beef is sold by the pound, so follow the dollar.

I think grass fed beef tastes "beefier", if that makes sense. Commercial beef seems to be a watered down version of itself. Of course, if I had to eat commercial beef, I'd just stop eating beef, I dislike pretty much everything about the process used to raise it.

Anyway, burgers. I shape them by hand, but don't get too carried away. I make the "divot" in the middle so I don't get a UFO shaped burger that is thick in the center and thinner on the edges. I like mine pretty rare, but everyone else prefers medium to medium well so I just cook them all, it's fine. I've tried adding egg but adding a bit of olive oil works just as well for me. Butter is even better, but negates any low fat benefits from the beef, LOL. I like salt and pepper, but sometimes I use Montreal Steak Seasoning or a splash of Worchestershire or whatever is sitting around and sounds good. I've ground bacon and added it to the beef but did not see that it added any appreciable benefit. I'm also not emotionally invested in a round burger. When we have big family gatherings and need lots of burger I'll dump it all onto a sheet pan, pat it out, score it into squares and stick the pan in the refrigerator until we need them. It all works.

So there you are. The best advice I have is to not over cook the burgers and don't handle the meat mixture too much or too roughly, just enough for those burgers to stay together. Add fat as needed. I like to put a cold patty into a hot pan because I like that crust but I don't like to overcook the burger. I'd also rather have a thin patty than a thick one, use two or three if you want more instead of a thicker burger. Taste is so subjective, so the only way to find YOUR perfect burger is to keep adjusting until it's right, but you get to eat your test burgers.

Annie

Many thanks, Annie! Much of what you've said rings true to me, and I don't have the knowledge to comment on the rest. Yes to the "beefier" I love the thought of the PBJs. I didn't know cattle would like them, but they're sweet so I guess it makes sense. ;) Family friends had some cattle in a pasture on their sheep ranch when I was a kid, but that's my main exposure to beef stock. Driving past the stockyards, however, is very offputting.

I'm hoping stuff works out and I can get to the butcher soon to start trying. :)

I'm going to take away the idea of putting the meat in a sheet pan and cutting out the burgers. So easy for a lot of people!

Islay, it saves a LOT of time when making burgers for a group of people, plus it's so easy to take that metal sheet pan out to the grill and just start "shoveling" the squares on. No juggling plates of patted out burgers, which I always manage to drop a couple of while on my way. Nothing to break either!

Annie