Dan, LOL! you have a wonderful way of putting things! Exactly my point. If I can get away with not using peat all why not go the route of conservation. Why use peat moss potting soil when one can use composting instead. Composting is the most cheap and environmentally friendly way! And yes, we are struggling to dissect information, hence the arguments and the search for definitives, but Life isn't about that! There are tons of layers to sort through and no matter what, each person makes up their own answers from the information they are willing to gather and dig around with. Some may purposefully ignore key facts; it could go either way. Justaguy, everyone! is guilty of subjectivity, you, me, everyone is subjective and opinionated in one form or another. For example, I deliberately ignore that .02% ratiio because I'm just not comfortable using a product which isn't needed in my garden. My subjective opinion is that the weed you say is useless, is essential for supporting rare and endangered plant species and butterflies and insects that cannot be found anywhere else in the world. Their lives depend on that peat and spaghnum moss. And the wading birds too are nourished by that water that peat moss farms completely destroy and drain away. Spaghnum moss by the way is not invasive because it requires strict conditions in order to live, it cannot extend beyond its origins. You say go ahead there's plenty more bogs to uproot. Well, I still say if it's not necessary to use those peat products then one might as well try to seek that alternative. I just like to leave that tiny space for the living birds and multiflora to enjoy. My fat inert roses can find something else to feed on, LOL! and yes, if it means "sitting my behind" on the computer googling for coir supplies for peat substitutes, then so be it! Wes, hope you don't feel ignored, LOL! we are on a roll right now with the peat moss. Wes, sometimes locale can make a difference in how something is produced. An example is blood diamonds. Very difficult to control and regulate! Diamonds in certain regions are bad, bad news. Certain countries use bad conservation methods as well. Issues like that. Spaghnum moss is another example. Orchid people purposefully purchase only New Zealand moss because they have the best conservation practices with spaghnum peat moss. New Zealand Spaghnum moss is very, very expensive. On the other hand some products are purposefully purchased because they have higher quality products. A made-in-China shoe is gonna break very quickly whereas an Italian shoe lasts forever! it seems.

In the spirit of solitary gardening and intake, that is my experience, and for me it is a preferred experience. Might be really interesting to pyschologically analyze this, but I don't like seeing my garden through another's eyes. On the rare occasion I've had company in the gardens, I've had two kinds of experiences. One - blindly wild about the garden. The other, a critical eye. Both bothered me. My garden isn't perfect, and I don't want it that way. On the other hand, I'm not too interested in what others think it could or should be. For me my garden is my personal, theraputic space. It's an extension of me. I can be muted, or wildly colorful, experimental, prudent, anything I want, anywhere I want, whenever I want. Now, strangely enough - I do love to share it via sharing bouquets and photos. Just, not the physical space itself. WoooOOOoooo. Perhaps this thread really rubbed off on me more than I thought! I'm feeling a little coo coo now...

kquat, Horticultural oil is the broad term to include oils that are sprayed on plants and trees no matter what time of year it's used. There is a difference in the sprays that are used after the bud begins to emerge in the spring and the oil sprays that are used when a tree goes dormant. The insect has to be covered with the oil to do any good, and the oil does not remain on the tree as a protectant. I believe that a label would precaution using an oil on a tree if freezing temperatures are a possibilty. You know not to spray oil on your trees if the temperatures will get to 80 degrees F. I mixed canola oil with water and soap on some trees (including citrus)and even though it was in the cool of the morning, the temperatures went up and one of my citrus ended up loosing all its leaves. I only sprayed the one that had Cottony Cushion scale on it. The leaves grew back and the tree was prettier than ever. Maybe I should do that to all my trees -- think? At least the Leafminers would take off. Neem oil is not the same at all. Brass

Yes, I also agree. This is a typical oil injury. You must be very careful when using oils on plants, although I they are the ultimate answer when dealing with pesticide resistant insects. The damage should not spread and the plant's future should not be impacted from this. The labels on summer weight oils usually warn users against various heat/humidity conditions when applying hort oils and also warn that it can cause foliar damage on some plants. You have to follow that label closely and also weigh whether temporary cosmetic damage is worth eradicating some pests. I save the oils in my arsenal for just such situations. It was a life-saver when a large planting of euonymous ground cover got scale one year. I whacked the plants back to within inches of the ground, raked up and burnt the foliage and then hit it with oil. Total and complete eradication of the pests and they never returned. This was fifteen years ago.