*Sigh*

You're correct to be skeptical. There are a number of concerning things I see, but I'm not clear what we're looking at. Is this a shower next to a tub? What's on the floor?

Yes, it’s a shower next to a tub. The floor currently has concrete.

Here’s a better picture

Well, for starters, none of the backer board, joints, etc, is properly prepped or waterproofed. Beautiful stone tile, it’s a shame it’ll need tearing out.

Instruct the tile installer to stop. Did you hire this installer directly or thru a GC/remodeler? If the former, find a new tile installer; if the latter, ask the GC why this installation is continuing without proper waterproofing.

So the durock needs waterproofing? What materials are supposed to be used (just do I know what to look for). Also, how about the seems? Shouldn’t they be sealed?

Corrections *so *seams

Yes, backerbord screws, joints, corner (inside & outside) need seal/waterproofing. Web search YouTube for RedGuard, which is one such product.

Other concerns, installer’s Durock layout is poor (too many joints, large gaps, small pieces), missing backer board at niche tops, and the tub edges have a “pocket” which is sure to collect water. Based on the viewable workmanship, confidence is low that the PVC pan liner has been installed correctly either. Fortunately, you caught it before it has gone too far, unfortunately, the next installer will likely need to start over.

So many errors it's hard to know where to start, no waterproofing, joints not reinforced with tape and thinset. But basically why have a shower right next to a tub like that, it's bizarre. Rip it out and start again. New design and new contractors.

Sorry to pile on, but I'll just confirm that yes, this needs a do over. Not a salvageable install.

Here is a picture of the durock behind the tub.

😳

For the love of God, please get rid of the electrical on the tub back wall! Presume it’s for sconces. You could kill someone. It is definitely NOT code.

The Homeowner's Guide to Hiring a Qualified Tile Installer (ceramictilefoundation.org)

Waterproofing is optional with Durock, according to the manufacturer, however, taping and mudding the seams is not which makes this job a do-over.

No licensed electrician would have wired for sconces in that area. It is a death waiting to happen. Please remove that.

Good catch rlillich.

In light of this and the other glaring errors on this installation, it makes me wonder as to how much else that isn't as obvious is wrong?

I can't imagine figuring out the end of the wall tile detail after the fact as indicated by his running the tile long. What, you're going to snap a line and cut them flush to each other? Freehand grout joints? Nice. Not. Schluter metal edge detail? To where does that go, in the gap?

Notice the difference in the color of the tile. That can work if you shuffle the tile after they're removed from their boxes and they're installed randomly, but I'm not seeing that here.

I'm betting the tile is installed too closely to the valve to allow the escutcheon installation.

The fastener schedule hasn't been followed and is woefully inadequate. And there's the missing tape and mud.

What's going to happen with the gap between the wall tile and the tub? Too big to caulk and too small to be able to clean between. Ugh.

And no, you can't just tile over those wall electrical boxes with live wires in them. The wires have to be terminated in the boxes from which they come and those boxes need to be accessible.

What use is that little bitty tub access panel please? I'd make that entire apron from a color coordinated solid surface that would be removeable and when the motor goes out in that jetted tub, your plumber would thank me. And save you thousands from replacing the tile.

The tile spacers are only installed horizintally, none vertically.

Were the tile lippage the only problem here, it would be a blessing.

C'mon, there must be a few I missed. Help me out here please.

Fire this $2 hack and hire better next time.

Thanks for all your responses. I’m seeking additional opinions in case I’ve missed something. We discontinued using this person and are looking for a replacement. I’m relieved that we caught it all early enough to make sure the bathroom is not completed incorrectly. Many steps were skipped here and this is our long term home so this is completely unacceptable. Thanks for your input.

You need to go back to the studs and make sure everything is straight and level and correctly framed. I would also go back to the drawing board on the design to make sure electrical and plumbing codes are met and you get something sensible. The set up of niches with a dual shower in front of a spa tub is really bad.

Here are the studs

No he means whomever you hire now will need to rip out all down to the studs at the very least.

"Waterproofing is optional with USG Durock."

Hope this clears up any confusion over manufacturer's instructions. Yes, I did reach out to the manufacturer Rep. to verify that I was interpreting statements correctly.

Link to instructions states. "If waterproofing is desired" Keep in mind the manufacturer has no idea where the end user intends to apply the product. In a shower it is not only desired but required in a wet area. CBU's installed on floors or vertical dry areas would not require it. You certainly can add waterproofing if you so choose.

Install it in a wet area without waterproofing /vapor barrier and there will be zero recourse when moisture migrates into the wall cavity. Due to the basic fact that industry standards (TCNA & ANSI) were not followed.

Annie J - Sorry about your situation. As others pointed out there is nothing done correctly on your project. From design to execution.

CTECT:

How does a product that does not "swell, soften, rot, warp, delaminate or disintegrate" allow moisture to migrate please?

1. "...a strong, water-durable tile base for tub and shower areas. Also an ideal underlayment for tile on floors and countertops in new construction and remodeling. Board is readily applied over wood or steel framing spaced 406 mm (16 in.) o.c. with corrosion-resistant wood screws, steel screws or hot-dipped galvanized roofing nails. After joints are treated, wall or floor tile is applied using latex- fortified mortar or Type I organic adhesive."

It sure seems to me that in the very paragraph where they specifically recommend Edgeguard for tub and shower areas they could have easily inserted "waterproofing required", however, they did not. They say it's tile-ready after the joints are treated on vertical wet walls.

"CGC Durock® Brand Cement Board with EdgeGuardTM is formed in a continuous process of aggregated portland cement slurry with polymer-coated, glass-fiber mesh completely encompassing edges, back and front surfaces. The edges are formed smooth with a patented poly-propylene fabric-wrapped edge. The ends are square cut."

I'm guessing that the glass-fiber mesh is what's eliminating the waterproofing requirement. Eliminating materials and labor gives this product a substantial competitive advantage in addition to lowering risk.

I'd like to see an email from your rep explaining this please. Maybe I'm not comprehending.

@Joseph Corlett, LLC My understanding is that CBU is warranted not to self-destruct under wet/moist conditions. You'll notice the phrase water-durable in their technical documentation. No warranty as to preventing the passing of moisture through it (it is cementitious after all).

IIRC the technical detail in the TCNA book has membrane required behind the board as a minimum.

I think you’d need a tub with a tile flange (?), too.

JC - Sorry. Could be my explaining. The edge guard wrap has nothing to do with water proofing. Edgeguard is simply the latest version of Durock CBU. It prevents the cement from blowing out while fastening. Also the edges are slightly recessed to allow for taping. (similar to drywall) Minimize build up. Notice in the instructions after "If waterproofing is desired" It follows up with multiple USG products to waterproof the board. That is the definitive answer right there. (Installation instructions section E using the link you posted)

"How does a product that does not "swell, soften, rot, warp, delaminate or disintegrate" allow moisture to migrate please?" Capillary action. Think cement sidewalk. Put a few drops of water on it and watch it spread. Yep. Even uphill.

They have not eliminated the waterproofing requirement. The CBU is merely one component of a tile assembly. The tradesman will use his/her preferred methods and products to achieve a desired outcome for a specific product.

Local codes must be met. If something like CBU is used local codes for a shower will require a polythene sheet behind it or a sheet or topical membrane on the front to protect the framing and insulation. I'm willing to bet that there were no inspections done on the OP's job. If your contractor is not serious about inspections then walk away.

Anyhoo, if that is marble tile, there should be no lippage. Unlike manmade tiles, stone is cut AFTER it's "made" and should be perfectly flat if cut properly.

(Ceramic/porcelain tiles are fired/baked after cutting/shaping so they can warp a wee bit.)

Again having a tub and shower like that is also a disaster in the making, along with all the other issues everyone pointed out.

Make sure you read the guide that Creative Tile posted.

"They have not eliminated the waterproofing requirement."

Well then what am I not understanding please? They clearly state that it's optional.

You have the option to use CBU in a wet area and waterproof or use in a non wet area without. That's all there is to it.

Opposite example - Drywall will not have a waterproofing option as it is not approved for use in wet areas by the manufacturer.

Be very careful hiring anyone new for that bad design. You need to skip the tub in the shower. It’s a 25K design that is still asking for leaks and major issues with cleaning. Even if you spend the 25K on the expert you need to put the tub in the shower, it is still a really bad design.

@User I agree. Let the space dictate the design rather than trying to impose something on it. If it's too small for a tube then don't have a tub.

"Soon this will all be a distant memory of “remember that time.”

Remember that time mom electrocuted herself in the jetted tub? Ahhh, good times.

@3onthetree -you need to add a warning before your post - e.g., “Please swallow all food/water prior to reading.”

I was taking a drink of water - and started choking when I read the second part of your post. My daughter looked at me, and was like, ”Are you going to be okay???!!?”

At least no water shot out of my nose . . .

@Annie J- I would seriously listen to the above advice re: design issues. You are receiving great advice from extremely knowledgeable professionals, as well as some very experienced non-professionals.

I am very sorry that you are going through this. Several months ago, I carefully hired the contractor for my master bathroom renovation. As I am typing this, the few remaining slate tiles are being removed from the floor - along with the underlying cement board - in order for the entire subfloor to be reinforced correctly to meet the specifications for installing natural stone tiles. This is in addition to quite a bit of expensive Italian marble tile that already had to be removed from the shower walls.

My renovation began the first week of April - then there were huge delays - followed by incorrect prep work + installation. I hired a licensed GC with a great reputation (second highest bid out of five) + had personal recommendations from two law partners who had previously used him.

It’s very unfortunate - but at least you know there are issues NOW.

Also - regardless of whether you have a written contract or not, you most likely have recourse against your former contractor. Most (if not all) states have enacted statutes that protect homeowners during renovation projects like this. Additionally, you may be able to be awarded the amount you spent re: engaging an attorney - depends upon the jurisdiction where you’re located (the consumer protection act in my state provides for this - states have a vested interest in protecting their citizens, and by allowing an award for attorney fees, they encourage people to bring suits against this type of contractor in order to try to prevent this from happening to someone else). You also could bring the suit in small claims (without an attorney) depending upon the monetary damage limits established for your particular jurisdiction.

"You have the option to use CBU in a wet area and waterproof or use in a non wet area without. That's all there is to it."

That is clearly not what the manufacturer says. It could not be more plain.

You’re bring deliberately obtuse for the sake of obstinacy.

How so?