"The ducts are relatively old, but none of the sales/tech guys called out replacing them."

You don't necessarily replace them (unless they're accessible flex duct with leaks. More typical with hard metal ducts is to seal joints (between pieces) and connection and with flex ducts, reseal connections. And check leaks in metal plenums.

If you have a leak test done, there are techniques for finding leaks that are in accessible areas that can be easily fixed. When I replaced my equipment, I proactively asked that time be spent to seal my hard metal ducts in a crawl space that were 30 years old. It took 5 man days to do so (big house). The difference has been astonishing.

I just bought the home last year. I had a tech look at the AC via the home warranty They tested for R-22 and deemed it to be in good condition and didn't conduct any repairs. It works...it just can't keep on days when it reaches 95F outside even if we set the thermostat at 72F at 10AM in the morning it coasts up to 78 until sunset.

The 4-5 HVAC companies I got quotes from did inspect the duct work in the attic, but didn't specifically call out replacing the duct work. If it needed to be replaced, I'm sure at least one of them would've tried to sell me on it...but didn't.

I'm in the Bay Area so electricity is expensive. Ranging from $0.19-$0.39/kWh depending on peak timing. On average our 80% 80K BTU furnace uses about ~75 Therms/month ($1.59-$2.11/Therm).

So if my math is right...1 therm = 29.3kWh then I'd need (75*29.3)=~2200kWh of solar production to heat the house per month. I only have a 5.25kW DC system rated to produce roughly 7000kWh AC per year. We used roughly

Either my math is wrong or my solar definitely undersized if I want to save money via a heat pump — what do you think? Also....aren't maintenance and repair costs for a heat pump going to be much higher than a traditional 80% furnace and single stage condenser?

"You don't necessarily replace them (unless they're accessible flex duct with leaks."

The HVAC sales people didn't check for leaks. The existing ducting is insulated flex duct in the attic. Which I'd eventually to get replaced with metal ducting, but not sure how to prioritize this relative to new equipment.

The leak testing is done after the new equipment is installed. And is, I believe, a requirement in California when a permit for the work is pulled.

I would encourage you to get a permit anyway because when you sell your home, there's a disclosure about whether you are aware of any work being done that required a permit for which no permit was obtained. You don't want to have to disclose that shortcoming. It may add $1000 to the bill, your quotes should indicate whether or not permits were included.

Here are the costs to produce 100K BTU of heat with your gas and electric rates.

Furnace (80% AFUE):

$1.59/therm = $1.99

$2.11/therm = $2.64

Heat Pump (COP 3.0)

$0.19/KWh = $1.86

$0.39/KWh = $3.81

I picked a COP of 3.0 for the heat pump, if it is higher or lower the numbers scale linearly. The COP value drops as the outdoor temperature decreases. You can see the rate at the time of usage will determine which is cheaper to operate.

You are correct running the heat pump in the winter will create more wear and tear and shorten it's life. How much extra you may have to pay in maintenance is difficult to estimate. You have 5 years of labor and parts coverage.

@mike_home Ultimately, have to either install more solar or eat up existing solar generation budget for a heat pump which is currently planned for an EV. Sure I do insulate myself from rate increases, but I doubt we will stop pumping and burning dead dinosaurs for natural gas. Assuming the marginal cost of a heat pump is only 5-10% I'd consider it just for the comfort benefits.

@Elmer J Fudd Yes, we do plan on having the contractor pull permits. Thanks for the insight on the leak testing at inspection. Not sure how that's changed with COVID.

I can't help you with Covid procedures but these companies keep working and I suspect do so as safely as possible. I had a maintenance visit for AC and furnaces done in September - the tech wore a mask and gloves when indoors and I kept windows open. If indoor work or passage is needed (like to get to the attic if you have equipment there), of course you can do the same during and for awhile after the visit so long as not a rainy day. Let your family go visit friends or family for that period.

I had my installation work done a few years ago. I have two separate systems. The testing is done by a third party, not the installing HVAC contractor. It's mostly automated after certain outlets are sealed and, as I recall, didn't take much more than one hour. Fixing leaks, if necessary, would be a separate step and done by the HVAC contractor.

I personally don't really care for Bryant or Carrier either one. It's not that it's bad equipment, but more so dealing with the distributors for parts and servicing. A lot of foolish rhetoric and stupidity when it comes to Carrier in this regard... Bryant is attached to them at the hip... so that brand goes along for the ride.

Most of this problem or situation is predicated on 'moving equipment' or sell, sell, sell if you will. In other words if you use a dealer that moves alot of this brand of equipment there may not be much of a problem.

BUT, and this is a big one... if that relationship between your HVAC company & the Carrier distributor ever goes south... well this is where the cost difference now... will most likely turn into something you won't like.

HVAC company's --- many of them have changed brands over the years this is nothing new. Once you stop moving a brand like Carrier or Bryant for that matter... well the distributor chops us off at the knees. Nearly to the point it's not worth servicing Carrier / Bryant owners. Another big problem... for you if you own one of these and your company changes for one reason or another.

Not that I don't work on Carrier or Bryant. It's HVAC equipment... brands don't really mean much... other than where you may need to go to get parts. Those parts come at a premium... especially if you're not one of these 'dealers' that sell alot of equipment. Like 100K or more per year.

That said: Carrier is not the only brand to partake in stupidity when it comes to part prices, warranty stipulations and so on.

The problem with moving equipment... IS? You have to keep doing it. You think you gonna sell a new piece of equipment every 10 years? 11 years?

People catch on to this charade pretty quick.

It wasn't always this way with Carrier distributors. SO maybe they read this and change their foolish ways? Time will tell.

This is all insider information from someone who actually RUNS & SERVICES HVAC equipment. As of the time of this post... it is accurate. Time can and does change things sometimes.

________________ I Service the Katy, Texas area _ ALL BRANDS_________

In terms of Heat pumps having more maintenance, not lasting as long... it's a myth. It's still a 15 year appliance, same as air conditioning. The 15 year thing come from an average age of equipment when it's replaced. In heavier use more extreme climates sometimes it's less than 15 years. But not always. I occasionally come across equipment older than 20 years, not the norm for a hot climate I live in... but it does happen.

Anuj,

If you can sell your excess electricity to the electric utility at $0.39/KWh, and buy your natural gas at $1.59/therm you would pocket the difference in heating costs. Installing a heat pump may not give you the lowest heating cost if you are able to trade your energy for a better price.

Anuj,

If you can sell your excess electricity to the electric utility at $0.39/KWh, and buy your natural gas at $1.59/therm you would pocket the difference in heating costs. Installing a heat pump may not give you the lowest heating cost if you are able to trade your energy for a better price.

HA, HA, HA, Mike_home... seriously? You think the power companies are going to let you start producing power to sell it to them at high mark ups? SERIOUSLY?

UH, no. Nice try.

Anuj, have the contractor break down the bid price by equipment cost and labor cost. The retail value of what your looking to install is about $5 grand at the top side so if you're fine paying $7500 for labor for one days work go for it. They'll inflate the retail price on the equipment but you can shame them and negotiate on labor costs and knock down the price a grand or two, it depends on how desperate or busy they are at the time.

Your math is correct. If your existing panels are old the efficiency may have dropped to a point of replacement. Panels made 12 to 20 years ago lost about 2% in efficiency per year so you may want to check before adding better new panels to a bunch of old obsolete junk. Compatibility may be a factor with the change in technology which may also limit adding to the existing PV system.

I also must agree with Ray from Austin air, hahaha, selling it back to PGE is a joke. On that note storage makes better sense than selling it, it will just just take a lot of deep cycle batteries or a flywheel energy storage. flywheel storage Problem with flywheel storage to date is I've been unable to find any company that builds and sells them for residential applications.

I don't know who sold you on the "SuperQuiet" thing on your proposed A/C unit but it emits 68 db, which is about the volume of a vacuum cleaner and and not exactly quiet.

How home solar production fed back into the grid is handled, how much is paid or not paid, is usually beyond the control of the local utility. In this case, PG&E does what the California PUC mandates be done for all non-municipal systems in the state. Everywhere is different. I have a relative living in a jurisdiction where usage vs production is figured on an hour by hour basis. So that even in the summer time, it's inevitable that clear weather production will often be slightly excessive in the daytime and result in a low-priced reimbursement, while the nighttime of that same day, power must be purchased from the grid. Here in California, the settling-up covers 12 month periods so that a home's excessive production in the summer is banked (based on kwh, not money) to offset winter use.

Because of how it works here, people I know have found that the solar contractors are careful not to install more production capacity than needed based on past usage. Including any increase for electric vehicles or heat pumps, which are not common here otherwise. OP says he has excess production but that was done in anticipation of an electric vehicle.

mike_home's comment started with an If. This person is a knowledgeable contributor to this forum and offers practical advice. It's something all of us (Austin included) should aspire to.

@kevin9408 I have the option between a 14 SEER for -$700 less than a 16 SEER Super Quiet unit. A 2-stage Unit is another $700 more expensive than the 16 SEER option.

The installer I'm going with is the lowest in price of all the 5 I got quotes from...they seem like a fair family owned business who has been good about helping me explore the heat pump option. Ultimately saving $500 bucks on the install is not going to be meaningful for me. And around here good HVAC installers are so busy now that people are at home and can jack up prices as they see fit.

@mike_home unfortunately it's not economical to sell energy back to the utility. But eventually I plan on getting an EV and adding a battery, so 120% of consumption is not ideal but made sense to do it given labor costs are high here and making changes to the system will be expensive.

The cost of a heat pump alone was quoted at $9600, and given that it'll be more expensive to run I'm now inclined to go with a relatively simple Furnace + AC unit both for maintenance reasons as well as pure economics.

Hi Ray,

I was trying to explain to the original author how to compare prices for energy and the possibility of selling one form of energy and use the proceeds for to buy another. I don't know what the rules are for Solar Energy Credits for California. In New Jersey it is possible to do what I proposed.

Here is a link which you may find useful: SRECs: understanding solar renewable energy credits

Under the NJ clean energy program, homeowners who own a solar system can collect SRECs are they produce electricity. An SREC is equal to 1000 KWh. The SCREs are sold on an open market. The homeowner can choose when he wants to sell his credits. The latest average price for an SREC was $217 or $0.217 per KWh. Here is the showing the NJ SREC prices. Believe it not this is higher than my current electric rate of $0.167 per KWh.

My latest gas bill from PSE&G has a price of about $0.79 per therm. I have a 95% AFUE gas furnace should I use the free electricity and install an air sourced heat pump, or use my SREC credits to buy natural gas?

Costs to produce 100K BTU of heat with my gas and electric rates.

Furnace (95% AFUE):

$0.79/therm = $0.83

Heat Pump (COP 3.0)

$0.167/KWh = $1.63 (purchased electric rate)

You can see with my current rates it costs about twice as much to heat with a heat pump (this varies with outside temperature) than using a gas furnace. The electric rate would need to drop by 50% before it would be competitive. So instead of using the free electricity with a heat pump, in my case it makes sense to sell the electricity and use the money to buy natural gas. This is how it currently works in NJ. It will be different in other states.

Well Mike that's why I provided what I provided. This is what you would do when you are offering advice for an AREA that is ENTIRELY different from your own. You don't have nothing better to do than comment... so the least you should do is research the information you are posting.

ISN'T THAT WHAT I DID?

I live in Texas, but yet I was able to find this information within seconds for California.

HVAC concerns are different from one area to another, power use & or selling back to the grid is completely different as well.

Why would the power companies pay back so little? It's no big secret that California has undergone a lot of SOLAR installations over the years.

The problem with solar as everyone knows is that the sun is required to produce power. So you either have to be connected to a battery bank, or the grid or a combination of the two.

So what happens to the power company under such a scheme as more and more people install solar?

The power companies make less and less money selling you and others power.

Oh good then the price of power goes down? OK, how then are the utility companies going to pay back the loans and all the cost of maintaining the grid and power production facilities? Build new power plants?

The power companies all fail if enough people do as Mike does. Once the power companies start seeing what Mike is doing... well the power industry is very strong in California as well as Texas. AND for good reason. Won't take long for New Jersey to follow, the same as others.

My utility contract lasts usually around a year, sometimes longer if the price is low enough I might consider a multi year contract. Terms change all the time by the year.

The MORAL of the story.... if you're going to step up and offer advice, research it for the area in which you are offering it for. ALL of this can be avoided. (Think, before you yack. That's it... simple really)

Ray,

I don't think I gave the original author bad advice by suggesting he investigate selling his excess electricity to the utility. You may disagree, but I don't thunk this was a case where extensive research had to be done in order to suggest an idea.

I was able to educate you and the thousands reading my post that in some areas of the US it may be possible to economically trade one form of energy for another. It is not known how long this will be economical to do this trade. However the advantage of a dual fuel heating system is the energy source can be changed as the prices of energy and the rules change.

"The MORAL of the story.... if you're going to step up and offer advice, research it for the area in which you are offering it for.........Think, before you yack."

Follow your own advice. You missed the forest for the trees. Your description of the situation is mostly wrong. Don't try again.

My opinion vs your opinion.

Nothing new here folks. Home owners with too much time on their hands. Going on over 4 years now on this board... the difference is this is what I do for a living. You decide what information you want to listen to. I merely point.

Your Choice.

I service the Katy, Texas area.

You're entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts. Facts are facts. I found your descriptions of California's power system and its regulation to reflect misunderstandings and factual errors, all the more ironic with your later comment suggesting people should stick to what they know.

Facts are facts... but yet you provide none, Mr. Fudd. Why is that? You hold my feet to the fire so why would I not hold others to the same threshold you apply to me?

Where are your facts you live in California if anyone should know it should be you of all people.

Anyone can say anything... what I posted was from Google, not from me. I am in Texas and little ole me found info and provided it. Neither of you have done anything but spout off after I called you out.

You provide no proof because I am right. You just hate to admit it. It just burns you up.

You can better inform yourself, I have no need or interest to do so.

New Jersey SRC's new registrations are being discontinued in changing to a new incentive program for New Jersey.

The new incentive is based on a fixed price, of which you'll be hard pressed to find.

New Jersey's SRC program closing

See what I tell you folks? This is why just because it's on the internet doesn't make it true. Consider your sources.

You can better inform yourself, I have no need or interest to do so.

Yeah because there is no enjoyment in being forced to tell the truth. I rest my case.

PSE&G in NJ uses net metering. Each month the amount your system generates is subtracted from the amount you use. You are being credited at the monthly usage rate. Once a year if you have accumulated excess credits over the past twelve months, you can sell them to PSE&G at the wholesale electricity rate. This is all explained on the PSE&G web site.

Mike, there is no disagreement in the use of net metering. The disagreement is what you are paid.

New Jersey is in the midst of resetting things... the pdf lays it out. Here is a snippet of a small part of it. Much more complex than what you are saying.

This is way solar tends you getchya. They tempt you with lucrative things to get you to spend money, then claw back. Nothing new here folks. I've been doing this for over 26 years, I've seen every gotchya in the book.

Note the "Comprised Fixed-price" This sounds to me... that if it's good for California and Texas to do it... it's good enough for New Jersey too. Time... you'll be there before you know it, if you're not there already and don't realize it.

I see the SRCP in New Jersey was a incentive program that will end. To all who Ray has crushed with facts please accept it, learn and move on, and don't argue a losing position. That said you all have productive input but when wrong and corrected just say "golly I was wrong, thanks for pointing that out". Good day.

Hi Kevin9408,

Can you point out where in my post I had incorrect information? I would like to edit and make the appropriate corrections.

I think if you edit it out Mike, it would simply create confusion. I think everyone can agree that Houzz should be a place of viable information, not a place of opinions or one offs with no facts to support them.

There is no doubt that a grid tied solar farm that supplies power modestly to the grid and provides power to a home to offset the cost of power consumption can be a good thing if someone wants to go down the road of heavy investment, risk of that investment being no better than had they just bought power from a power company.

The whole reason you won't make retail rates is that the power companies would eventually go broke. In Texas as well as I'm sure elsewhere, a power company is required to be licensed among many other things to be able to sell power as a 'Business'.

They have a billing department, run the fun exercise of connecting and disconnecting power to their customers. They have access to the whole sale price of electricity as they should. They then mark this rate up and sell it to a customer. How they get that customer is thru advertising.

Then Mr. Home owner comes along thinks all he has to do is create a bunch of power dump it on the grid thru net metering to get a check from a 'single customer' his power company of choice. They gonna pay him retail rate of power, just because he's got net metering thru a solar farm on his property.

As pointed out earlier in the thread as of the time of this post, wholesale price of electricity is $0.02 to $0.04 per kwh in California. Due to regulations, and a myriad of other liberal gotchyas the price you pay in California is no where near the wholesale price.

I can tell you the wholesale price of electricity in Texas is no worse than $0.04 per kwh. The retail price is currently more than double that amount (depending on a wide variety of factors, that change from year to year.)

The power companies have been deregulated. So competition exists, but not to the point in which they are going to pay a homeowner regular retail price when they have access to the whole sale price. (OR the price of creation if you will)

It has to be this way because?

Solar only works when the sun is out. You will always need some grid tied source unless you go the route of maintaining a battery array for when your solar system is not producing.

It's the same with me and NYSEG, in northern NY. That's why it's foolish to install enough solar panels to supply more than 100% of your annual consumption. I'm at about 80% (I know, now, as my system went on line on January 2, 2020).

I think if you edit it out Mike, it would simply create confusion.

I don't see how correcting an error in a previous post would cause confusion.

Haha, and ray moves in with the reality knock out punch! Kaboom!!

The California kooks create more problems than they could ever solve and are even taking away the option for gas service. 25 jurisdictions have codes limiting Nat gas in newly built homes and there are loonies who want to ban natural gas in any new home through the entire state, all in the name of global warming. Yep, can't make this up and everything must be electric, but people living in reality know where most of the electric comes from. The electric companies in California must buy electric from other out of state companies to meet demand now, can't maintain a reliable grid system, and forced to comply with fantasies of the loons, and would never be able to build a new power plant, but the loons want everything electric in the state, rich.

Even the policies that cause electricity to be so expensive in California add to the poverty rate in California, which is the highest in the country at over 18%. Based on reality the OP is screwed by design living in Calif., he can move like the millions that already have or vote the right way. suggesting duel fuel options in a state where Nat. gas is on the way out isn't a good answer for the poor guy dealing with crazy people policies, It wouldn't take much for a vote to ban all new Nat. Gas HVAC installs in that once great state, not anymore.

Little water, no gas, limited electric and huge taxes. By the way in California there is a surcharge on electric of 45% if you use more than the average of 3 homes. Sounds crazy but by design it will force you to install solar panels. It's so simple, as the average usage drops with more solar installations the total average drops to a point you have no choice but to install solar or pay an extra 45% for grid supplied electricity. Personally I don't think there is enough silver in the country to build enough solar panels to meet California's goal.....or they could force people to give up their sterling silver sets and jewelry, wait for it.

Things aren't perfect here but the vast majority of Californians support the continuing technological, commercial and political innovations that start here and eventually spread to the rest of the country. Not everyone supporting everything but most support most.

I'm sure you don't realize it but your life would be very different without these decades of American and global leadership and influence that originate in California. .

You and austin are similarly situated, more vitriol than accurate information. No need to come here - stay where you are, we'll be coming your way as always.

Well Elmer it's time for a SMUG ALERT!

I think if you edit it out Mike, it would simply create confusion.

I don't see how correcting an error in a previous post would cause confusion.

Because of where we are at in the conversation. People do come back and read these threads Mike. They think wow what was all the furor for?

If you don't want to fall into a ditch as many of these posts often do, from misinformation posted by you and others... it's mostly from a lack of thinking before you speak. How many other posts like this would you need to go back and edit?

When all you really need to do... stop research what you are about to post, BEFORE you post it.

I know I make this sound so simple. But imagine how much better the internet would be if people put this into practice right now. Make it a New Year's Resolution.

Even the policies that cause electricity to be so expensive in California add to the poverty rate in California, which is the highest in the country at over 18%. Based on reality the OP is screwed by design living in Calif., he can move like the millions that already have or vote the right way.

Many are moving to Texas and we accept them with open arms, but if you come here and keep voting for the same failed liberal policies from where you came I can't imagine Texas ever becoming like that... but, California wasn't always like it is now. A liberal disaster area.

People / businesses moving out. Space X a big one. That migration isn't going back. California is so much at the brink I don't know that even voting right could save it at this point.

Given the price of Real Estate in California... the only reason it's that high is due to the number of people that live there. But if you're losing a couple of 100K people a year, not to mention high profile businesses... well? The numbers don't lie, do they?

I'm sure you don't realize it but your life would be very different without these decades of American and global leadership and influence that originate in California. .

Yeah for one, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now. LOL.

People do come back and read these threads Mike. They think wow what was all the furor for?

Ray that is a good question. What is all the furor if I didn't state something that is incorrect.

Don't you see, you even misunderstand your own "information" Take a look at that chart, do some simple division, and you'll learn that the annual net migration is less than half of one percent. Put another way, on a net basis, the population level is 99.6% + unaffected by migration.

An old saying, with an unknown source,

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt".

Mike_home all the more reason to stop posting things that are not true. Especially when you can't even find your own post. Step away from the keyboard, find a new hobby.

______________________________________________________________________

Put another way, on a net basis, the population level is 99.6% + unaffected by migration.

Liberal thinking to make everyone feel safe and sound. A loss is not a true loss... we're not effected by losses.... just look at our states books, price of electricity, tax cost to live here. Yes, we are completely unaffected by migration. I'm sure when the tax rate to live there is 110% you'll keep saying that you're unaffected by loss. Now I know why you call yourself Mr. Fudd.

Keep shedding your jobs, Texas will gladly take them from you. (Space X, Oracle among others)

C'mon man.

Mike_home all the more reason to stop posting things that are not true. Especially when you can't even find your own post. Step away from the keyboard, find a new hobby.

Ray (Austin Air Companie),

I can my find all my posts. I know what I said but I was giving you an opportunity to give a reply so we could have a constructive discussion. You have chosen not to do so. Instead you have ignored the word "if" in my sentence and say my post has incorrect information. I think the original author and everyone reading my post understood the point I was trying to make.

Are you suggesting my posts are so reckless with incorrect information I should stop posting in the HVAC forum? I don't think I am ready to give up my hobby of providing readers of this forum free advice to help resolve and make decisions about their HVAC issues.

I read an article from the LA times stating California's net population growth for 2020 was 21,000 for 2020, the lowest growth rate since 1900. From what I've seen is the makers in California are being replaced with the takers, kooks and criminals. Unfortunately I couldn't find any year over year charts on the welfare rolls but it may mirror the increase in new arrivals.

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt".

I read some of your comments in "The kitchen table" and you've proven this to be true. The best of the worst was the thousand + word essay on what makes you great, but fools do need a king.

If it were an independent country, California would be the fifth largest economy in the world. The economy is as diverse as is the population and not subject to the same degree of periodic booms and busts that happen in other states. The state is doing just fine in all respects except the pandemic, which it is continuing to struggle with (while doing better than other states) but working its way out of.

There is the "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt". thing again. Your state's budget for 2021 is 202 billion and it also gets federal aid to the tune of 44 billion each year. California, with it the highest poverty rate in America would become a third world banana republic toilet (the streets and sidewalks already are) and we'd need to build another wall. You really don't think about much about the things you post do you.

LOL, yeah the word "if" is so important in relation to the $0.39 cents per KWH that you claim some home owner is going to earn by simply dumping excess power back on the grid. Like anyone is going to really pay attention to the word "if" versus the more specific price that you quoted as if you were going to pay them out of your own pocket.

I've already shown how important the word "if" is. I've shown your misleading statements about your own state New Jersey and how the program that you suggested was so great... was in fact being discontinued for something of a more 'fixed price'.

The word "if" doesn't make your statements true. Doesn't negate what you said, how you said it as it was implied that someone could make $0.39 cents a KWH by selling back to the energy provider of choice.

It doesn't work that way.... "if" you like it. "if" you don't. No matter, what I posted sets the record straight... with no "if's" / "and's" / or "but's" about it.

The Truth, does not masquerade behind "if".

____________________________________________________

On the subject of California....

If California had no serious problems with debt, taxes, regulations, homelessness, lock downs, terrible traffic, prices paid for electricity at more than double the rate of many states...

Why did Space X leave for Texas? Why have many others left? Why are net outflows larger than inflows?

Here's another visual that tells a story...

"Why did Space X leave for Texas?"

Perhaps for minor corporate tax reasons, but more so because Elon Musk is a narcissistic twit with no class and no filters who likes to see himself in the media. His bigger and more important business interest, Tesla, makes all of its cars right up the road from me and always has. Might that change? Sure, for the same reason and with the same ho-hum consequences. Space X is not a big player employment wise.

Texas and Texans have long had an inferiority complex about California and for many good reasons. It manifests with criticisms, taunting, and stereotypes. All vacuous.

Texas and Texans have long had an inferiority complex about California and for many good reasons. It manifests with criticisms, taunting, and stereotypes. All vacuous.

Well it's not just Texas and Texans... here's a popular Youtuber that relocated from California to Las Vegas buying a home for $0 by? Reducing California taxes. So essentially the California taxes paid for the new home.

Imagine if all high net worth / high earning individuals did this in California? Who would be left to pay? (why socialism doesn't work)

As I said before further up the thread... the numbers don't lie.

Here's the video...

In the near future I see a few cities in California ending up just like Detroit. When industry moves out the wealth moves with it and all who stay are wards of the state.

What a ridiculous comment, no more sensible than others.

Don't hold your breath while you wait. More nonsense, taunting and jealousy. Bye.

I appreciate passionate discourse alongside folks trying to be helpful. Looks like a 2-stage heat pump costs about $5K more than a standard condenser, which is only marginally more than a standard 2-stage AC.

Some basic back of the napkin math leads me to believe that I can expect a 6-7 year payback period. Maybe sooner if our utility keeps on raising natural gas prices (8%+ this year alone).

Thank you all.

Looks like a 2-stage heat pump costs about $5K more than a standard condenser.

For that much more I think you should look into the inverter option. (Bosch Inverter)

Especially if you're paying $0.39 per KWH. An inverter heat pump will run circles around a 2 stage unit, for considerably less operational cost. (essentially half most months of the year)