Call a lawyer because you will need one. If you have your own address and pay property taxes and don’t know if you legally own the property. Assume the land was subdivided. Are you aware of the details of the legal agreement you made with your in-laws when you moved onto the property? Are you paying a mortgage or are you renting but paying property taxes and home improvements?

As said above contact an attorney but before doing that find out if you are paying Property Taxes or what are called here Personal Property Taxes. People do confuse the two.

Agree with the comment above. I don’t know how you could possibly be paying property tax (which is a tax on LAND and permanent structures built on that land) if someone else owns the land.

We were young and incredibly naive. At that time, we had a verbal agreement in place stating that we would eventually purchase the entire property from them. But we couldn't get a mortgage for the amount needed at that time. Since then, we've built it into a decent sized house. But now my sister-in-law (who also has a trailer on the property) wants to stake a claim. I'll admit, it's a mess. I'm honestly not sure which type of property taxes we pay. It's around $400/year for everything. We pay township taxes, school taxes, the basic stuff? We are in Pennsylvania also I might add. Thank you all for your advice. Greatly appreciate it 🙏!

Edit: we do not pay rent or mortgage. We own our home free and clear. We pay our fair share in other ways. I won't get into the boring details of that, however.

Only an attorney can give you legal advice about this but it sounds like this may be in an estate. Verbal agreements are only worth the paper they are written on. To find out what type of property taxes look at your tax statement if you have one or go to your county office here it would be the Assessor's Office or County Collector and look it up. You should be able to do it on line.

I hate to pile on but the posters above are right. The very first thing to do is to contact a real estate attorney to consult with you about your current status. From the few facts you describe so far, it doesn't sound like you have any ownership interest to sell. But we don't have all the facts and you don't have all the information to provide. Do your research and bring everything you have to a trusted real estate attorney that is not affiliated with the family. You have legal questions and they need to be answered by someone with local expertise.

You need an attorney to sort this out. There are a lot of "If's" that determine the answer.

Manufactured homes/mobile homes/trailers are considered to be personalty like an automobile rather than realty or land because they are moveable. Personalty and realty are two different types of legal ownership governed by different laws.

There is a way to convert a manufactured home ownership status from personalty to realty, but it sounds from your post that you did not go through this process. That means that you probably own the part of the manufactured home that you placed on the property, but you don't own any of the improvements or the land underneath. You could transport the original part of the manufactured home that is on the frame to another site. You could not do this with the improvements. The improvements must remain on the land. From a practical standpoint, it won't make much sense to even try to do this.

While you may have been paying a portion of the taxes for the larger property and it's improvements, that will not qualify you for ownership. There is also something known as adverse possession that might have come into the picture, but you haven't made any claim to the land for a long enough period of time. That period of time will vary by state.

Essentially, you trusted your relatives to do the right thing. Your attorney might advise you to try to have the owner give you a portion of the land where your home is located. You would pay a nominal fee to do this plus attorney's fees to process the transaction. That is the best solution to the problem. It would require the good will of the owner. If a sibling is thinking of moving onto the land, now would be a good time to get everyone on the same page from a legal standpoint. You, meaning everyone involved, can pay now or pay later.

It appears that you have been paying rent all these years. These sorts of arrangements are a nightmare. This is why you need an attorney to explain your options, most of them not good. But, there are some solutions if you get an attorney involved to explain everything to everyone.

Amber-

I suggest you look up the county's property tax billing as part of due diligence in preparation for seeing an attorney. The amount you quote of $400 per year seems incredibly small in relation to what the total bill might be. I know property taxes vary wildly around the country, but, for perspective. I live in a high property tax area, and $400 is the equivalent of 1-2 weeks of property taxes here.

go to your property appraiser’s website and search your address. The legal owner should show up in your search.

We will definitely consult an attorney to see what our options are. Thank you all for your advice and input.

To answer a few more questions-

The 3 additions that we built on are not footed into the ground, therefore they are movable. My husband had the foresight to think that his sisters would probably try to stake a claim to the property in the future, so he made sure nothing was permanently affixed.

As far as the taxes, I'm honestly not sure. I would have to call the assessors office to find out. Typically, they mail me a bill and I pay it online.

I have uncovered a few more details though since yesterday. The mortgage on the property states that it cannot be subdivided, and that we cannot have a business on the property. I think it's similar to a "clean & green" type of thing. I was hopeful that we might be able to purchase the property on which our home sits, but that seems unlikely.

We are in the middle of an all out family fued, and the reason is absolutely ridiculous. Embarrassing actually 🤦‍♀️. We have been advised that we are no longer allowed to have company. No reasoning behind it whatsoever. We have never been loud or inconsiderate, and neither have any of our guests. My friend came over a few days ago to help me clean out my office and we were told that it cannot happen again. My in-laws put signs at the end of the driveway prohibiting anyone from entering the property. It's just a giant mess. At this point, we just want to find property that isn't too far away and move. We let ourselves get stuck in this bad situation and now we are paying the price. I want my kids to grow up in a good environment where they can have friends come over, have sleepovers, etc. This bickering back and forth over senseless things is not what we want.

Again, we greatly appreciate the advice from everyone and thank you all for being kind ❤. God Bless!

If nothing if fixed to the ground it can be moved? You could then sell it as a trailer to be moved by the buyer. But a trailer is not real property (like a house) but personal property. Interest rates are higher as they depreciate in value.

When you say the sister in law is trying to "stake a claim" what does this mean?

I would move as far away as possible or the crazy behavior will just follow you if you move somewhere that isn't too far away ...

Sorry your family is having to deal with this.

Are you paying any kind of rent? If you are you are entitled to “quiet enjoyment“ of your dwelling. Maybe an attorney can figure out if the taxes you pay and any other bills count.

If the city or county assessor is mailing you a bill with your name on it, it seems that they think you own something. It should only take a phone call or a quick trip to the courthouse to find out, and it won't cost you anything. It could be tax on the land, or it might just be taxes on the mobile home. Rules are different from state to state.

Bruce

See an attorney.

First, it is your residence and they can't keep you from inviting people to your residence. What his parents are doing is probably an illegal eviction.

Next, real estate and verbal agreements are messy. Typically, an oral agreement is not acceptable for real estate but can be made acceptable by the subsequent actions of the parties. Like allowing you to continue building structures, etc.

See an attorney, I suspect this is a giant mess for everyone involved. It is almost impossible to sort this out remotely.

I’m guessing the property tax bill is for the personal property- the mobile home. They are often taxed separately from land to the owner of the mobile home.

This sounds like a horrible situation and like you’re dealing with some mentally unstable folks where no logic or what is legal will matter at all. Moving further away seems like a really good idea.

Counties in PA do not send real estate tax bills to “renters” for their portion of the real estate tax bill of an entire parcel. As someone mentioned, you may be getting a tax bill for the mobile home only. And as someone else mentioned, you may be paying your occupation assessment or per capita personal taxes that are completely separate from real estate taxes.

“The mortgage on the property states that it cannot be subdivided, and that we cannot have a business on the property. I think it's similar to a "clean & green" type of thing”

A mortgage doesn’t govern/restrict uses of a property, local zoning or deed restrictions do and this is something worth investigating permitted uses asap before you go any further. If you can’t operate a business on the land, do you even want to own it if that ever becomes an option? Local zoning can also restrict subdivision of parcels.

You mention “clean and green”. Placing land in “clean and green” is a way to reduce real estate taxes on the land and it is not a barrier to subdivision or development of a property. Removing a parcel from clean and green requires back payment of the difference in regular vs clean and green taxes.

You are in a tough spot and have been given good advice from other posters, even if it might be hard to hear. In a prior career, I often dealt with similar situations - messy real estate/family dynamics. Best of luck.

We seem to be in the same situation trying to get it all figured out, put a trailer on my dads land last july am paying the mortgage every month and all the bills on the property, we dont like who he has over at his house for company they come over here and fight with us and cause problems, so he told us move our trailer out of here in the sprinv amd i dont think he can do that when we been payin everything here and have 2 young kids and we dont have anywhere else to move it too.

This is a legal question. Consult with an experienced real estate attorney in your state to review the land lease/rental agreement you have with your dad, his legal right to evict you from the land (if any), etc.

I would move. Even if you end up being allowed to stay, your legal bills will be big and you will be miserable.

Find a place to move to. He wants you gone and you’re not happy there.

You say it’s your dad’s land, but you are paying the mortgage - that makes no sense. What is mortgaged? Your dad’s LAND or your TRAILER? And the bills you are paying - what bills exactly? Light bill, water bill, etc? Those bills have nothing to do with ownership of land.

You should not move before consulting with an attorney. Odds are the attorney can negotiate a compromise without a massive legal bill. It doesn't really matter that it is on his land, his actions are an exception to the statute of frauds if he allows you spend money to improve that land. So you likely have a contract to use that land, whether or not he likes it.

The original agreement matters. If he said that you could live on his land indefinitely and based on that agreement you spent money to buy and place a trailer on that land, he would likely be responsible for any costs to you for revocation of that commitment.

The land is mortgaged we been paying dads mortgage so we dont lose the property so he let us put a trailer on it, and yea we pay 450 for that a month, plus the whole light bill of 225 cause we both share the same lights, its hooked up all together. So the agreement was we pay the 4 grand he was behind on mortgage, which we paid a thousand a month since last july, got that paud then 450 and we r paying it all. And then im suppose to get the 10.5 acres of land when he dies, but now he tells us i want you out in the spring, dont think he can do that , we came here to help him so we dont lose the family land, our trailer is a 1974 so i dont think we can move it again and why should we leave

First, he is not allowed to kick you out of your home. Even if you were living in the trailer for free without any commitment from him, he can't just demand you leave. There is a process in all fifty states for removing people from their home and in none of those is demanding you are "out in the spring" one of them.

Next, what you are describing is a contract for acquiring the land. All real estate contracts are required by the statute of frauds to be in writing. However, there is an exception to the statute of frauds for action of the parties. In other words, people can't make an agreement, allow you to spend money towards that agreement and then revoke it because it was not in writing.

The smart move at this point is to get him to acknowledge the agreement via text or email. E.g. "When we paid the $4,000 you were behind in your mortgage and then took over your mortgage, you said we could live here and then inherit 10.5 acres of land. So you can't change your mind now and decide you don't want us out. We already agreed."

If your father admits to that agreement, even if he just says something like, "that was before you...." then that is the ball game. You win. He will likely not be able to evict you without paying a significant amount of money and the judge is unlikely to issue the detainer before trying some sort of mediation. Even then he is likely to grant you a judgment against your father for any money you paid on his behalf (but not yours).

Finally, the question isn't really whether your dad has the right to kick you out (he probably doesn't), the question is can you make him realize it without spending a lot of money. I suspect that you can find an attorney and spend a few hundred dollars to have him write a demand letter that will back your father down. If this is happening now, it will likely happen again, so I would advise getting some legal advice now. If you can't afford it, contact your state's bar association and see if you can find someone to help you pro bono.

Good luck

This post is from 3 years ago .....

Suzieque Yes the original post is 3 years old, but six hours ago someone with a similar problem asked for advice on this thread.

Addressing the new situation posted 7 hours ago, "dad telling daughter take her trailer and leave".

In most states, dad can't deny you access to your home without a court order in a eviction filing. In most states it's a criminal act to deny access, and also criminal to cut off utilities to the dwelling.

Let him go through the legal process to evict you and have your day in court with all the bills you've paid for the old man. Have you received a certified letter giving you notice? Eviction clock doesn't start until you receive notice and usually involves allowing one period of the rental agreement. Month to month, end of a yearly lease or what ever.

But I'm sure there was no mention of a agreement on how long you could stay, so at the eviction hearing (if he ever files for one) tell the judge the old man said you could stay there until he dies.

Personally I'd stop paying a nickel on the land, and send him a certified letter demanding payment of the "loans" given to him by verbal agreement or legal action will follow. Next I'd only start paying on the land if he agrees to add you to the deed as a co-owner of the land. And finally I'd tell him he must make all the utilities payments, and everything in writing. I don't think the mortgage company would deny adding you as a co-owner because they don't want the land, only the money. As a co-owner he couldn't borrow against it because it now would take two to sign. Turn the tables and put him on the defense.

@bry911 I am a lender so know a little more about your circumstance than most but not a real estate attorney. The first thing you need to figure out is what kind of trailer you have and whether it is permanently affixed to the property and considered real estate by your county. Your legal protections will most likely be different if you have a camper parked on someone's land than if you constructed a legal dwelling unit via purchase and installation of a manufactured home on a foundation that is considered a permanent residence. I recommend reaching out to your local legal aid clinic, since you probably have a combination of applicable laws about storage of personal property if the trailer is considered as such and tenancy, and without a written lease I fear that you could be in a pickle without someone who is able to research how those two areas of the law intersect in your specific case.