This world is not even to the bad part so anything mentioned would be based on today rather than after so many more become infected and die. Later there will be two types of people. Those who live in fear of the what ifs and those that accept they will die and take chances to live their lives. Beyond that it depends on how badly society breaks down.

I don't believe I will get over a fear of going out and about due to other medical issues. I think that this issue will be felt by most 60+ people for years to come.

Also, while I have plenty of savings and anticipate collecting Social Security at 62, I am rethinking the big kitchen redo and other larger expenditures. I have several younger relatives that may need financial assistance in the future.

Therefore, I most likely will be spending less. I think this might be the case for lots of people. It's the uncertainty. Just a feeling of "you just don't know" what the future holds. I think the economy will take years to get back to where it was.

I did read that most Americans are spending way, way less even those who have not been hit by job loss. I also read that the age of the average American car is way older than it generally is--I hardly drive at all now. So what you said FinallyHome makes a lot of sense.

I'm definitely paying down debt and not spending on wants right now. I have not had a job loss but who knows what the future will bring? I have a healthy emergency fund.

Like Finally Home, I am very apprehensive about getting back into the mix. Right now I work from home and hope that continues forever, but part of my job involves going into nursing homes. I would never forgive myself if I inadvertently carried Covid into a facility.

For the most part, I think we have a short memory like we have a short attention span. So if you're asking in 10 years, the social aspect of our culture will probably be very similar.

I think as far as business is concerned, Covid pushed many retailers that were in trouble before to their eventual reality little faster. We'll see more of those file bankruptcy and many of them close for good.

I think that we will see more people move out of the city, remember it wasn't that long ago that people (many of them millennials) were moving back into cities. With high rents and work-from-home, there is less incentive to stay.

I think that in another six to nine months, business will start to assess productivity of work from home and realize that many of their employees do better in the office. Then they will have to resolve Covid/workers comp liability with employee safety and productivity. The solution will be a combination of bringing people back in and adding more remote tracking tools. The tradeoff for employees will have to be weighed.

I also am concerned about small business in general, small retailers & restaurants specifically. I'm very concerned about the social welfare of those retail/restaurant/service workers who will undoubtedly lose everything if the government doesn't step up. And many of us who are in our later years of working could have big challenges working to retirement (this keeps me up at night personally because of my own situation).

But ultimately what will happen really depends on how our government decides to assist and protect us while researchers look for a treatment, then how that treatment is administered/accepted.

The economy story is a false positive right now because we keep talking about a market performance like it's the entirety of the situation. I think the impact on the economy - inflation, debt (personal/business/government) and savings is the sleeping giant in all this. It's not going to be solved easily. Remember that inflation eases debt burdens. That's scary as heck.

It's waaay too soon to guess IMHO. Right now we have more fear of what could be than what really is. Yes we have lost plenty of people--people who were ill before covid and or closer to death than many more years. Not that anyone ever is expendable but until this starts actually killing the general populous, it isn't directly affecting lives. I feel no FEAR, but I live according to what Science suggests is best practice. When you are doing what can be done the only thing left is to LIVE IN FAITH NOT IN FEAR. It's the over blown FEAR that will mess with psyches and affect some in the long run. That is letting evil win. 🙏🙏🙏🙏

We're retired with a pension and savings, we'll be okay and we did do a large landscape job that we contracted to have done. Our kids and their spouses are still employed although one couple is still working from home and will be for the foreseeable future. I think however, in the long term they will be more affected than we will be. Although they were alive they didn't actually "live through" the financial meltdown of 2008 and they weren't here for the 20% interest rates of the early '80's.

I think they will feel the social affects and the lack of social gatherings, the camaraderie of celebrating marriages, (they're at that age and my son got married with just family), the birth of babies, all the showers, 30th birthday parties, summer barbecues, concerts, boys nights out, girls nights out, house warmings celebrating the purchase of one's first home, etc, etc, I think they will feel the loss of that connection in the long term.

Some may poo-poo that but many of you must remember that time of your life, your late 20's and 30's as you truly ventured out on your own with a partner and set up your life and starting making life long friendships who have supported you through thick and thin. I'm not saying that it can't be done, it'll just be harder.

and then, there is the fact, this is WORLDWIDE!

Local economies all around the country are crumbling under this plague. Just wait, the worst hasn't even hit us yet. Millions are unemployed, with no jobs to be had, and those subsidies that were keeping our economy afloat have now ended. Evictions are set to resume. There's no doubt schools reopening will cause infections and deaths to shoot up.

It's not going to be the same everywhere, but things are headed off a cliff economically, barring some real changes in policy. I understand we've lost 5 years of economic gains in about 5 months. I don't see the national leadership we have right now doing anything to mitigate this disaster either. Look how well they've done so far. Doesn't the USA have something like 25% of the infections worldwide with something like 4% of the world's population?

Happy times...

All I can say is that I think the outcome of this pandemic and how people react to it long term will depend greatly on who is leading this country in 2021.

Lukki Irish, without getting too political, yup, I agree totally. Vote, everyone.

Blfenton, about the social aspects of this. The younger generation that grew up with social media has the tools, and maybe the outlook, to get through a year or two with reduced face to face contact. My example of one is my DD. She's keeping in contact with all of her friends, and with her boss and coworkers, remotely. Honestly I don't think she is feeling lonely or isolated. She has several groups that talk on-line, and they invite their friends in, so she's meeting new people 'virtually.' Weddings, graduations, etc aren't that thrilling to her group. It's the opportunities to meet new people at random in the grocery store, at the park, walking her dog, hiking, etc that are missing. But befriending random people brings its own risks, so ... everyone will have to muddle through until the risk profile changes :-(

About a dozen years ago, one of my lawyer clients told me that while it was easy to find junior associates who were good at computer-oriented work, it was becoming increasingly hard to find those who had people skills. I read that about 40% of couples met their significant other on dating apps, and interestingly, these couples have lower divorce rates than those who met IRL. I think the reality is that we are evolving into a screen-connected society. A large portion of the world wasn't even born before the internet. Certainly it's sad that kids are missing out on a lot of the school activities that were important to us when we were in school. But I think it behooves us to focus more on improving online learning platforms and online social activities, as they are definitely here to stay, whatever the public health situation.

The pandemic has been compared to a receding tide that reveals all the submerged problems.

How long has the US economy been so heavily dependent on consumer spending? Is that true in other first world nations? Has this promoted a culture of 'wretched excess', with attendant dissatisfaction...and no savings for the 'bottom rungs'? Is there a comparison to be made with the Roaring Twenties that preceded the Great Depression? Those were also the days of the robber barons, a similar situation to the current vast economic difference between the few wealthy and the many who are paying CC interest on their groceries. What republic can survive without a middle class?

Why are Americans dependent on their jobs for their physical health? Other nations have systems of public health -- systems their citizens trusted enough to heed regarding COVID, with obviously superior results to the situation in the US. Americans lost their health care along with their jobs -- a looming crisis for the whole society.

lukki irish started the discussion in the right direction. The misconduct and inaction of the federal government will hopefully decide the election and we'll have much more intelligent and capable (and certainly less narcissistic) hands on the tiller in just a few months. Things will get better.

If COVID-19 were completely wiped out like smallpox or polio, would we go back to living exactly like we did before the pandemic? Or are we now so sensitized to communicable diseases that we will remain forever vigilant? I wonder. I have a feeling, from observing behaviors now, that we would go right back to packing ourselves into theaters, restaurants, etc. The only two things that I think are gone forever are handshakes and blowing out candles on cakes.

Warning wandering tangent!

Oh my goodness I am having a cynical moment.

We are our own worst enemies so far but at least this virus proves that we do have other enemies.

If only we could all agree to fight against them. And become our best friends in the meantime. Maybe if we said the virus were aliens come down to take over our planet that would help?

I won't relate my cynicism any further.

I do really wish we had candle blowing out shields because that's a shame if we couldn't blow out candles.

Also I really wish somebody would completely convince me that we don't need to exchange viruses in order to strengthen the whole system.

I've always been taught that children need to play in the dirt or they become even more vulnerable to illness. I've also read it's important to have pets around to challenge our internal systems. I fear that germophobia will win and yet we will lose in the long run. Tell me I'm wrong. Explain to me how we can do this without viruses being in our bodies the way they've always be.

I know this virus is quite bad so maybe not with this virus. It has long-lasting morbidity according to some research. So even if you survive you may have physical ailments down the road like shingles with chickenpox but worse.

And we don't exactly get shingles from chickenpox according to this website but from the virus that carries chickenpox? So confusing for somebody like me. The way I understand it is the virus that carries chicken pox but it is also a virus unto itself as well that causes shingles. Who knows what else covid-19 carries.

https://www.nfid.org/infectious-diseases/shingles-myths-and-facts-for-consumers/

Fact: Although shingles and chickenpox are caused by the same virus, they are not the same illness. Chickenpox is usually a milder illness that affects children. Shingles results from a re-activation of the virus long after the chickenpox illness has disappeared.

Another fun fact: USA is the only wealthy nation that has no national system for child care.

This seems relevant to the push for reopening schools despite ever increasing infection & death rates.

In our interconnected world, we'd all better get used to sharing infectious agents. People, animals, plants. Covid19 wasn't the first, won't be the last, won't be the worst.

Carol we in Canada are reopening our schools as well! We do have somewhat of a child care system but we are weighing the dangers of this virus against the dangers our most vulnerable children encounter.

Those children will never regain what they've lost by not being in school according to studies. They will be even in a worse position than getting covid-19.

They are in homes that have no support or little support physically mentally or emotionally.

I feel very badly that we can't make sure every child is safe and doesn't go hungry in their own home and has the tools they need to be taught in their home. It makes me cry when I think of it.

chisue asked "Why are Americans dependent on their jobs for their physical health?"

That's a really, really good question. Something to ponder...

sephia -- I also fail to understand why employers should be financing their employees' health insurance! The insurance industry owns us all.

In most countries with universal coverage, the insurance of people with jobs is paid in whole or in part by their employers. Governments pick up the slack for those who are unemployed or disabled.

What other sources do you suggest?

Employers in many industries have been subsidizing their employees health insurance so that is nothing new. The idea that people are just beginning to realize that is mind boggling. Most health insurance offered as an employee benefit has part of it paid by the employer. Most employees especially in their first years would not be able to afford health insurance without some help.

I remember when health insurance was first offered by my employer. I was covered 100% and that lasted for many years. But then the insurance companies started with rate hikes in the double digits every year and my employer would be constantly searching for lower rates, so the carriers would change every year which meant having different doctors every year and then of course the employers started having the employees take on some of the cost of the premiums and it's been downhill ever since.

Insurance company ops, rates and profits are regulated in most states. The Affordable Care Act also had some effect on rates and profits too.

What makes rates go up, now and in the past, are all the increases in medical charges for goods and services from the providers. Drug companies, doctors, hospitals, etc., are where the cost increases come from that get passed on by the insurance companies. No business can provide goods or services that cost more to procure than they can charge for them.

Insurance rates are based on expected claim experience + net cost of operations + allowable profit element. True of insurance of all types.

Seems unfair that US employers have to pay half (whatever) when their competitors in other nations don't.

Taxes are higher in other nations and in some countries where there is national insurance, many still supplement it with private plans. There's no free lunch!

We are still pretty fresh into this, only a few months... by comparison to Great Depression, we haven't even started to hit the Dust Bowl era yet. It's probably a bit too early to guess how things will go a year or two from now, let alone ten years from now.

During the Great Depression, people could hug their loved ones, share food with their neighbors and offer space on their sofa to someone in need. But everyone having to distance makes it hard to care for our fellow man. (I'm sorry, our fellow person.) There's no place for The Waltons in this current situation.

And that's what's even worse.. during the GD and DB, people could still cling to each other physically in way they aren't able to right now either. It's really too soon to see where the psychological impact of this is going to be right now particularly in light of that aspect.

Though in some ways, gotta disagree that this is not time for the Waltons.. that family could be able to hole up for a couple to few weeks if needed during a pandemic. Without killing each other or otherwise freaking out in many ways. Domestic abuse reports have been on the uptick since many folks have had to stay at home with their families.

chisue are you talking about health insurance or Social Security taxes? There is no requirement for an employer to pay anything for health insurance in the US. They started doing it to keep good employees. Some still pay a large portion of the premium but others may provide only a token amount so that they can state that they have employee health insurance.

Polio has not be eradicated: https://www.cdc.gov/polio/what-is-polio/polio-us.html

Maifleur, in this state at least (Washington) all employers with 50 or more employees who work at least 30 hours a week must provide health insurance or pay a tax (penalty) to the government.

You may want to double check that morz because I just did a search and it is not a state law it is covered under the ACA. But there is a big difference between providing it and paying for it. Companies must only offer it nothing is stated that I found that the company must pay for any part of it.

arcy, I'm not sure why you think think it's okay for people with health problems and older people to die fro CoVid-19, as long as it isn't the general population. Those people are someone's spouse. parent.grandparent, child, or sibling, and I guarantee someone cares if that person dies. I lost my husband of nearly 49 years last month, and his having severe health problems didn't make it one bit easier. Also, people of all ages have died from this disease, so we have lost some of the general population, just not in a great amount.

Elmer, I do hope people will choose wisely in November and not be blinded and deafened by political rhetoric.

"much more intelligent and capable (and certainly less narcissistic) hands on the tiller in just a few months."

You've GOT to be kidding.

I hope so too, woodrose.

I saw a news item today that the White House had made inquiries about adding the current president's face to Mt Rushmore. Good thing I'd finished the cup of coffee that was on the table.

Perhaps only good thing that will come out of this unfortunate administration is a definitive answer to a discussion that comes up from time to time on the question - Who was the worst US president ever? In the future, the discussions won't be needed. It's a shame the timing was what it was, we needed leadership and capability for the current crisis and instead got complete ineptness.

I think life as we know it will change forever. One prominent doctor said our current conditions will last at least 36 months but the virus will always be with us. Since only less than 60% get flu shots, I'm guessing many won't get the vaccine when and if it's available. The earliest a vaccine ever came on the market was three years and that was the mumps one. Most huge venues...rock concerts , megachurches, sports events will never be the same. If we get better leadership in November , it'll help.

I have not been able to understand the thought of people being expendable. The worst are that children are considered throwaways and it is no longer important if they live or die. Until fairly recently historically women were treated that way but children even if they were ignored until they became near adults were wanted and for the most part cherished.

36 months? How awful. And the blame lies with #45.