Teardown. Rebuild.

Thanks for your responses. I haven't gotten estimates on a complete demo and replacement, so not entirely sure that it's in my budget. If a tear down isn't possible does the jacking solution sound safe?

A badly converted porch with an inadequate foundation, inadequate insulation, not to code windows, inadequate and not to code wiring, only needs EVERYTHING. The quick and cheap route is to teardown and redo it. Anything else piecemeal only ends up more expensive and a poorer result. Jacking it doesn’t begin to fix all of the rest of the issues that a badly done porch has.

Imagine the "Jacking it up" project becomes 3x the cost of what everyone *thinks it will cost. And imagine it will take 3x the amount of time to do the work because of all the issues they find. And now imagine it still doesn't pass inspection because of the code issues that were missed trying to get it done without costing your your house.

I know this sounds like I'm trying to scare you...but I've seen it happen. Everyone who has ever worked in the building industry has seen this type of project. And 3x the initial cost is well within the ball park of possibilities (in fact its a pop up to the short stop!).

Please make sure all the leg work has been down with city hall and all the permits have been handled with all the PREVIOUS work. As soon as a contractor tries to touch something that was never approved, S/HE now owns the work. All of it.

A General Contractor with integrity will tell you this up front. And will tell you that a tear down is probably the only thing that will PASS INSPECTION and KEEP YOU on budget.

And then there are the GC's who will do what you ask them to do, no questions asked.

What climate are you in? Is underneath porch closed off, insulated, and weatherproof? I don't think the roof should be jacked up (picture?).

A porch that was a bad DIY conversion will have more issues than not being level. It was not designed or built to be interior space. That all must be remedied and a new kitchen will be the most restrictive of code requirements or inspections to bring something like that to current building code. Retrofitting it will be more costly that gutting it completely and starting over with all of the required systems.

I would:

1. Inspect the foundation and determine if it has been sinking. If there's movement, then I'd tear it out and put in something stable.

2. Measure floor to ceiling in all 4 corners. That might tell you if it was built with a slope on purpose or if it has sunk. If the ceiling is level, then they sloped the floor on purpose (or used the existing sloped porch floor).

If the foundation is stable, and the room was just built with a slope, then it would be much simpler to tear out the subfloor, shim up the joists, and re-floor it level than to jack up something sloped to make it level.

FWIW, we had a porch-converted-to-laundry-room in our 100 year old house. It was skanky and on a shaky foundation, so we tore it out, put in a new crawl space, and built a proper (and larger) room to replace it.

Thanks, everyone. I really appreciate the input. Another contractor came today and suggested leveling the floor by shimming/replacing/sistering in new joists, then adding a support beam under the joists to stabilize it. The first contractor amended his recommendation to 2 helical piers under the corners, and one beam supported by jacks. Waiting on the recommendations of a third foundation company.

Just to respond to suggestions...

1. I'm not actually sure how to tell whether the pier foundation is sinking. One contractor said he suspected that it had; another said he didn't see evidence of it.

2. Measuring from the ceiling to floor sounds like a great idea, and I will try that. All corners currently have cabinets or heavy furniture in them, and the ceiling is sloped (following the roof slope) so that complicates matters, but I'll do what I can. For my own information, I just purchased a self-leveling laser level, so I can measure the slope of the floor and squareness of everything more easily.

Am also getting estimates on tearing it out and rebuilding, which may be complicated by the fact that it's surrounded on three sides--by the original house, another (better built) addition, and a deck. Leaning toward demo and rebuild, but have to see the cost involved.

weedyacres, thanks for the link! I enjoyed reading through your process and seeing the photos!

I'm not ready to join the tear-it-out-n-start-over crowd. These things aren't black and white; they are gray. I'd need a personal visit to do an accurate cost/benefit analysis. So does everyone here.

Sorry, but measuring the floor to ceiling at four corners will tell you nothing without a datum. They could be exactly the same (unlikely,) and the whole assembly is tilted. Pay someone skilled who’s not a potential contractor to come look at it.

" Pay someone skilled who’s not a potential contractor to come look at it. "

Like a kitchen designer?

Listen to Joe (and stay off design sites until you are ready to pick your colors)....

scottie mom, that was my first thought too, and I hired a structural engineer to evaluate it. Unfortunately, he didn't tell me anything that I couldn't see myself. His only suggestions were to have my contractors check whether the piers were sinking, the condition and levelness of the joists and band board, and the connections to the house. He did say that he would evaluate the proposed solutions, though, so when I have all of them I will get his input.

Seabornman, sorry, I missed your post earlier. Mid-Atlantic climate. It is only partially closed off--main house on the east, a new addition (with a closed-off, insulated crawl space) on the north, deck to the west and inadequately covered with wooden boards on the south. There is some insulation, but not enough. The kitchen floor (currently tiled) is like ice in the winter.

I see. That’s about the smartest thing you could have done. And what I mean is a contractor who doesn’t have anything to gain by telling you to shore up something that’s not worth saving. Bringing a kitchen designer would indeed be premature ;-)

Good luck!

Yes, by all means, bring in someone who has never done this job except on paper (structural engineer) instead of a guy who has done it in real life (contractor). Cynicism doesn't pay; sarcasm does.

Joseph, so far I have heard a several different opinions and options--from contractors who have done this before in real life. Since I don't have any expertise or experience in this, and its a pretty high stakes/high dollar decision, I'm looking for a way to evaluate the options.

Sorry, but measuring the floor to ceiling at four corners will tell you
nothing without a datum. They could be exactly the same (unlikely,) and
the whole assembly is tilted.

My point was that if the floor-to-ceiling measurements are all the same, and the floor is tilted, then it's likely been sinking. If the ceiling is level and the floor slopes away (measurements on one end are longer than the other end), then chances are higher that it was built with a slope on purpose (i.e., just used original porch slope and plopped a kitchen on top of it).

Your assessment that this enclosure was done badly is based on what? A slope in floor can be dealt w in a couple ways but this has been a functioning kitchen for how long? And you are seeking a remodel. So what is your attention drawn to ....to say the enclosure was done poorly. When was this enclosed and was it signed off ? There is probably a sweet spot to make some improvements but describe why the initial work was inferior. ... you are implying that but is that accurate? In general my instinct would be to reverse the dedicated space configuration. Bring kitchen into original house footprint and use the space in question differently....but I don’t see a picture. Kitchen Reno is time to get it all the way that’s best