Thank you so much, Aaron. That was great of you to type it all out. I got Cressida and St. Cecilia from them and am very happy with them.

I like myrrh smell and would like to know which one has the strongest fragrance of myrrh. Any suggestion?

@Feiy (PNWZ8b/9a) it looks like Wife of Bath has a myrrh fragrance. If you scroll up to the list I posted, you can click on the name and then click the "description" tab at the top, and it should describe the scent in the writing below.

@Aaron Rosarian Zone 5b Thank you very much. I'm considering Pretty Jessica, Queen Nefertiti, and English Garden, and now I can add Wife of Bath as well. Despite I have 22 roses to come this spring, I still ordered another 2 in DA website this afternoon. I have no clue where to put them all!

Feiy Lo, I think both Cressida and St. Cecilia have strong myrrh fragrance.

Those are gorgeous! I went crazy this year also. Like...roses are the new pokemon cards/beanie babies for me. You can always keep them as houseplants? But there are also roses I really am wondering what I was thinking when I bought them....I guess there's always the Rose Propagation and Exchange board!

Also, @cyndita (west coast zone 9) did you see that they have the Prince? Not sure if you found it but I saw elsewhere that you were looking for it.

@Sheila z8a Rogue Valley OR I do like St. Cecilia, but it's so popular that I don't think I can get up at 6AM to order it since I live in Seattle. LOL

BTW, Cressida seems not to be very healthy. I'm afraid it doesn't do well in my BS+PM hell. So sad.

, Aaron, that was really sweet of you to link all of the Roses. A lot of work but we really appreciate it.

you guys have helped me find roses I really wanted countless times--least I could do!!

I got Potter and Moore, Cymbeline and Cressida, they were pretty quiet in the garden last year. I’m hoping I’ve learned some key info from Straw re alkaline clay soil and they really pop this year.

This time around I’m hoping to get Pretty Jessica and Radio Times like I mentioned and also St Cecelia, Clair Rose and Lilac Rose.

I received the list from Palatine also, and there are around 53 varieties listed on their email, so not all of the 62 varieties that I sent cuttings of to Palatine Roses, are on this list. So I believe that the ones that appear on Aaron's list that are italicized, such as Cressida, may not be available this season. Thanks to Aaron for adding this additional information.

@Aaron Rosarian Zone 5b Lordly Oberon is on the list at Long Ago Roses

Aaron - good memory - I have been looking for The Prince! Thanks for posting all the info & links.

Thanks Aaron for updating the list! I confirmed with Rachel that there is a limit of one per variety again this year.

Thanks everyone! Anyone know what the price point is?

I sent an email to Rene Schmitz at Palatine, offering to send him cuttings of over 20 other vintage Austin roses (new to my collection) in fall that are not already in his collection, to add more varieties to his Austin program.

He responded that he has reduced the number of varieties that he propagated in his Fall 2019 production for sale in the current sales season, as some of the varieties offered last year, did not sell out. Those that did not sell out, are being offered as potted plants. Further, he explained that the Covid-19 Pandemic has adversely affected his ability to produce grafted rose plants in Fall 2020. He could not get the number of rootstock plants that he desired; some of his staff could had to isolate and not able to come in to work; and the professional 'budder' from the UK could not come to do his job. Therefore, he could not produce any plants of the for the vintage Austin program in Fall 2020 for sale in the 2021/22 sale season. So during this next sale season, he can only offer for sale the plants that did not sell in this season.

Still, he is committed to this project and plans to maintain his collection of these 62 Austin varieties (3 plants of each one in his 'preservation garden') to use for propagation of plants for sale in future seasons; however, he can only propagate plants in response to the demand of his customers: he cannot propagate varieties for which there is not sufficient demand. And he needs to work this project in with his regular program, using his finite resources. For this we should all be very grateful.

Hi @john_ca!

Again, I really appreciate the work you've been doing with them. I know you mentioned Hummingbird Roses as another source for discontinued Austins, have you considered also reaching out to some of the other rose sellers that don't have a contract with DA? I know Linda from Long Ago roses fits that description, and maybe Burling from Burlington Roses would consider given that she doesn't appear to sell any Austin varieties. It seems a right shame that you're willing to add to the collection at Palatine (and I assure you there's demand--I want The Dove yesterday!) and they won't bite. Thank you so much for being willing to do all this! I know bottom lines matter, but it seems silly when there's demand for things that have no willing supplier despite the existence of the raw materials.

Also can I ask about what you mean by this and next sale season? On Monday, should we expect dregs, or was that more for the next time these roses are offered?

Thanks again!

Hi Aaron,

I am interested in doing my bit to help preserve some of the earlier Austin collection from extinction. I have been providing cuttings to Hummingbird Roses and Palatine Roses in pursuit of this objective.

I am going to offer cuttings of more vintage Austin varieties to Mindy at Hummingbird Roses, especially some in the group that I did not have at the time that I offered cuttings to Rene at Palatine Roses several years ago. Among these are: Jayne Austin, Evelyn, Bredon, Shropshire Lass, The Alexandra Rose, Buttercup, Lilian Austin, Sir walter Raleigh, Country Living, Dove, Emily, The Reeve, Belle Story, Redoute, Blythe Spirit, Sweet Juliet, and a few others.

I have offered cuttings to Burling ( who is just a 2 hour drive from me) a number of years ago, but she said that she had all the ones that she wanted to propagate at that time.

I used to live near Long Ago Roses around 20 years ago, and they did not seem to be interested in adding to their product line. They sold a few of the older Austin years ago. Perhaps I can contact them.

Aaron, do you root roses? If so, perhaps we could trade cuttings If not, perhaps you should learn how. Dove roots easily. If interested, you can send me an email at this site.

John thank you for doing this! So many people want the older DAs that are so hard to get anymore. I wonder which ones Rene had left over that didn't sell. I hope I can snag some tomorrow. I missed a couple I wanted last yr because I kept going back and forth thinking "do I want this one too??" LOL Nice to know you have THE REEVE, REDOUTE and BREDON. I lost those to the Camp Fire in 2018, and haven't seen them anywhere, altho Hortico did have them a couple yrs ago. Do you happen to have ELLEN? Now that's an extremely rare one! I had her some yrs ago, but she struggled. Was too small when I planted her in the ground (own root). Another one I'm looking for is EMANUEL. I don't suppose you have it? I have a few older rarer DAs. THE YEOMAN, ADMIRED MIRANDA, PEGASUS, PERDITA. And my DOVE survived the fire thankfully!! I also lost my beloved SUMMER SONG in the fire, but got cuttings last yr from a lady, and only one rooted... just barely. I'm hoping it's going to take off this yr! I'd certainly be willing to trade cuttings with you or pay you for cuttings?

Don't Forget-

Ordering for Palatine on the Open Food Network begins today at 9am EST!

How exciting!

Steven

Did anyone have any luck? For me, it forced me to create a log in, then confirm my log-in, and by the time I was able to do all that, all of the ones I wanted were gone from my cart, one by one. Hoping they'll have some lower grade roses, but I won't hold my breath. Not sure about anyone else, but I found the website to be frustratingly slow.

I found the same thing. It wouldnt even load products for quite some time so I quickly called and got Rachel who took my order, but I only got 6 that I wanted. Considering, I felt lucky to get that. I have never had to log in.......I just go right to the Palatine site and order what I want. At that, she had trouble getting the order placed as she couldnt log in to my account. Dont know why they go to this other site and not just be able to go on the Palatine site and order like we do in the fall. Wonder if anyone else had problems?

My goodness what a frenzy! My experience at the site was laggy- probably due to all that traffic of us, rose nuts all, scrambling to get what we can. Some that we've had before, longed to try, or just wished to experience and learn from it.
Due to the lag, I missed out on Prospero (AUSpero), The Prince (AUSvelvet), and Chaucer (AUScer).
I love my dark reds/crimsons. I wanted to check out Chaucer's scent and I presume it should be decently hardy with its parentage.
(The book is my first about roses that I acquired in 6th or 7th grade. Most of the pictures in it are just terrible. I still love it even though it's definitely not a book of reference for my climate (it's an adaptation from an Australian original)).
I had Golden Celebration (AUSgold) once over a decade ago plus a few wink, and I remember big, rich blooms, good growth, amazing dry tea scent changing to sweet lemon, and black spot. The lemony aspect is the way lemon PEZ candies taste if you know what I mean.
For me it's a very special variety because it's one my grandparents got for me going somewhere through Texas as they RV'd across the Deep South (as well as the North East and parts of Canada like Nova Scotia, Quebec, and I forget all where else) in their retirement. It will always be an extraordinarily special variety to me because of this. I'm thankful I can still go visit Grandpa... it's a long drive to Florida even if the panhandle.

What did YOU get? Enthusiastically curious minds are yearning to know!

Steven

My experience is the same. The website couldn't handle too many people ordering at once. When I checked out, two roses in my cart were out: AUSjess (Pretty Jessica) and AUSvelvet (The Prince). Pretty Jessica is the one I really want but there is always next time. Here are the roses I got this time:

AUSpot (Potter and Moore)

AUSlight (Claire Rose)

AUSmit (St. Cecilia)

AUSdir (Tradescant)

I have my credit card on file but they didn't let me use it so I had to call PalatineRoses to provide the info. The lady at PalatineRoses said it's a different system and that's why I had to call them to provide the info. Helen

Congratulations on your new old Austins. I guess that I slept right through the excitement.

I hope you all got at least one or two that you wanted

I was also too late for some of the roses I wanted, but at least I got St. Cecilia and Radio Times! Alameda, from what I heard they prefer to use this website as they have very few of these roses available, and this site contrary to the normal Palatine site provides real-time control of the inventory. I like it, because I'm sure I won't get the usual message "sorry, but we are sold out of Augusta Luise" ;)

@MiGreenThumb (Z5b S.Michigan/Sunset 41) Elevation: 1091 feet You can get AUSpero (Prospero) own root from RoseUnlimited if you still want it. I got mine from them. The rose is very healthy in my garden and the blooms are gorgeous. The bloom petals have a very unique look to them. Helen

Magda, I too got St. Cecelia and Radio Times. Also got English Garden, Lucetta, Queen Nefertiti and Cymbaline [amazed I got this one!]. I have very small plants that I am babying of Lucetta, Radio Times and a tiny one of Queen Nefertiti so now I can have backups on these and bigger plants. There were a few more I would have liked, but last year only got 3. [Steven, you will love Trandescant - got that last year]. I was expecting the site to pop up and I could order......there was such a lag time bringing up the products that I didnt think it would work so I called. Rachel was so nice to help me......I know they are bombarded with orders. Had looked at the site last nite and also ordered a new Jalbert rose called Goldflame. Just happy I got what I did and am glad people are anxious to buy these roses! Many thanks to John for providing the budwood to Palatine, and to Palatine for providing rose lovers with this opportunity!

Judith

@bayarea_girl_z9ca really! Why, thank you. I must have missed that one while viewing their site!
I've been meaning to try several roses from them and I love their plants.

Steven

I got 8 roses: Radio Times, Happy Child, William Morris, Lilac Rose, English Garden, Chaucer, Symphony and Perdita. I missed Pretty Jessica and Leander. The website crashed when I tried to check out 😂 Happy Monday everyone!

Alameda, I love English Garden, it is the rose in my avatar! And I also sent an email to Rachel that I would like Goldflame (I'm almost sure it wasn't available in September!) I wanted Queen Nefretiti and Cymbeline, but was too late for those. Next time I guess :)

Judith, I'm really glad to hear that! I know you're much hotter than I am, but it's good to hear a positive coming from East of the Rockies. He's been one of those roses where I tell myself "I should have then!" because he's been hard to obtain.
Some of the pictures I've seen are incredible.

I also feel like I'd be lying if I didn't say this with my declarations of thrill with Tradescant on his way: I do technically have one, but he's on Huey from David Austin 2016 (backordered from 2015 when I got The Ingenious Mr. Fairchild instead) and currently a one cane wonder.
I adore those blooms though. In autumn they were incredibly dark. The stereotypical nearly black in the bud. I find the fragrance to be elusive, but when it was there, I found it to be rich, warm and comforting in its true, mature rose essence. Ah!

I don't expect miracles from a different rootstock, but plants of multiflora grow better in my soil compared to Dr. Huey. I have seen "nice" (as in big, sprawly, and covered in fresh bloom) plants of Huey in other people's gardens. I've had the scions of two body bag roses die out and Huey come up, but he's tiny and tooth pick like. Multiflora does well so I hope that will help it!

Steven

Hi Beth,

I believe you used to be beth_norcal or something like that? Yes, I would love to trade with you. I have enjoyed your posts for many years of all those very rare and unusual roses that you have. I read about the loss of a good number of your collection in the Camp Fire 2 years (?) ago and was very saddened. Please send me an email at this site if you can and we can arrange some very large trades.

I grew ELLEN many years ago and liked it. It was a sprawling rather weak plant with pale orange blossoms. Not sure its one of the vintage Austins that I would want to grow today. I did grow Emanual 2 houses ago. I am growing plants of 30 Austin roses that have been lost at the San Jose Heritage Rose Garden, and Jill Perry has allowed me to take cuttings from their collection. I took cuttings of EMANUAL and may have this one rooted already; I am waiting to see the flowers. If not, I will ask if I can take additional cutting of the ones that failed to root. Some of those that didn't root are: ENGLISH ELEGANCE, JOHN CLARE, THE HERBALIST, SwAN, YELLOw BUTTTONS, and perhaps a few others. I hope to get THE YEOMAN from a trader in Canada in the next year; have never grown ADMIRED MIRANDA; I do have PEGASUS, DOVE, AND SUMMER SONG. More new, rare, recent acquisitions: COUNTRY LIVING (a rather weak, sprawling, disease-ridden shy bloomer, so far), and SIR wALTER RALEIGH. I used to live very close to the SJHRG, and SwR has been getting smaller with each passing year. This one is perhaps the rarest of one of all and am hopeful to get it in the hands of a propagator. Rene Schmitz at Palatine can not take more, as he was not able to produce a full crop of roses in fall 2020 for sale in the 2021/2022 sales season. I am going to get some cuttings to Mindy at Hummingbird Roses.

This was very disappointing and now I need to go shopping to soothe the pain of getting nothing as one by one the computer kept telling me they were sold out and had to be removed from the cart which wasted time and caused me to lose others after I had filled out my info .

Pretty bummed out .

Yes Jennifer, better go shopping to ease the pain of defeat

What were you hoping to get ?

BY the time I got up and looked the only 3 that I would have liked were gone

Thanks kristine. My husband is so kind to pretend to be sympathetic like I am when he loses a fantasy football game . So that helped . He let me vent for a bit lol

I wanted pretty Jessica , Chaucer, brother cadfael and Geoff Hamilton and I had some backups in my cart too. I think today lll email Peter at freedom gardens and see what he has or could have .

I saw these cute “pillows” of flowers on proven winners I think I’ll treat myself to.

https://www.provenwinners.com/category/store/plants/annuals/flower-pillow

You plant them in hanging baskets so they look like the premade ones you see at stores. I like the idea bc I find the ones at the nursery are at peak and it always goes downhill from there so maybe I’ll get to enjoy them more ?

@Lilyfinch z9a Murrieta Ca To cheer you up, I can root Brother Cadfael and Geoff Hamilton and send them to you unless you have your heart set on grafted David Austins.

By the way, David Austin website currently has Brother Cadfael in stock https://www.davidaustinroses.com/products/brother-cadfael . Grafted DA grow well and faster in my California garden. Helen

Helen , may I private message you on Instagram.. :)

@Lilyfinch z9a Murrieta Ca you're not the only one. Retail therapy is always a great way to help with the feels, I personally just got back from eating my feelings. I hope the palatine folks come to realize there's actual demand for these old roses and do what they can to propagate them. $30 a pop is pretty good money for a rose you don't have to pay royalties on.

Oh John I hope that EMANUEL makes it!! And sad to hear that ELLEN is gone and not a good one anyway. Mine never did amount to anything before it died. Ah I forgot about SWAN. That's another very rare one! I have ENGLISH ELEGANCE. It's been struggling since the fire. I will definitely email you and we'll see what kind of fun we can stir up!! LOL

As for this order... I actually managed to get everything I ordered for once!! Got LILAC ROSE, CHAS RENNIE MAC, AMBRIDGE ROSE, PROSPERO and CROWN PRINCESS MARGARETA. I have a funny feeling one of my surviving roses that I haven't been able to ID might be AR, altho it doesn't have the right scent. So I'm glad to get it replaced. I know Peter Schneider carries a lot of these older roses too. I got BIBI MAIZOON and JAYNE AUSTIN from him this fall. But his plants are sooo tiny!! They're doing well, tho thankfully.

I don't know if any of you have looked at High Country Roses' website. Last yr I picked up HERITAGE, TAMORA, QUEEN NEFERTITI and WISE PORTIA from them. This season they added a few more. They carry WENLOCK, CHIANTI, TESS OF THE D'URBERVILLES, CONSTANCE SPRY and LILLIAN AUSTIN as well. The only ones currently sold out are TAMORA and WISE PORTIA.

Another source for own root DAs is Rogue Valley Roses. I just ordered LD BRAITHWAITE and FALSTAFF. They have quite a few others. Most are currently out of stock tho.

Beth, I just wanted to point out that this year's roses from Freedom Gardens were much smaller than they have been in past years. I think it was the Deep Freeze that was experienced in May after many were all brought out of the greenhouse. He lost many . As a result I think he is grafting some 2 multi Flora rootstock if that's a help . It is a crapshoot though how big they'll be. As a result I put off getting Augusta Louise until next year letting him grow it up. If you are interested in his roses I might get in touch with him sooner rather than later. I worry he will stop doing mail-order.

Did you notice AUSpike listed for sale - Isn’t that James L Austin? I didn’t see it on the original list. Maybe it was a typo.

Aaron I hope you realize the costs that Palatine incurs to raise, propagate, and sell these rare roses. $30 a pop ain’t that great 😜. They had to grow the mother plants out from cuttings that Jon generously provided, and continue to maintain and grow them. I believe their grafting specialists come in from Europe to do all their grafting. These roses take up valuable real estate that I’m sure could be used to propagate more recently hybridized varieties - which are probably more disease resistant and less challenging to grow. I’m sure they’d sell more if they had them, some are just more difficult - who’s looking for PomPon Veranda lol? I see numerous posts from people wanting Delbards, etc., I guess you can’t please everyone! I’m thankful that they are willing to make the investment on their end so that crazy Rose people like me can continue to buy some heritage roses as well as newer ones.

@Dingo2001 - Z5 Chicagoland thank you so much for your empathic and considerate response to my (and others') disappointment over todays' technical issues and the extremely limited availability of these roses. I hope the strangers you encounter in life are just as compassionate and thoughtful whenever you're frustrated.

Aaron I missed out on several I wanted as well. I took exception to your comment that $30 a pop is good money for a rose they don’t have to pay royalties on. The folks at Palatine don’t have to do this, and I don’t feel like they are price gouging. That’s all I’m saying.

$30 is more than most other places charge for discontinued DAs, but I didn't say they're price gouging--in fact, they could have gone a lot higher with the costs. My entire point is that there is clearly demand for these roses and it's frustrating that they don't respond to demand by setting prices accordingly or expanding their program, given how much money they stand to make. I'm sure there are disease resistance issues, but I find it hard to imagine that the older roses are in such poor health that Palatine is making a big (or any!) sacrifice. Whatever their losses are, they can adjust the prices accordingly and still sell out within a day.

I also think the software they use is probably preventing them from making informed decisions around the rose varieties people want or don't want given that it counts down and then delists the plant. In an online market, you want to be able to identify and anticipate demand in the click-through measures, and adjust accordingly. Yes tastes can change, but even having an "email me when this is back in stock" can allow for better accommodation of consumer demand.

I just wish they could find a software that could handle the orders better. I was ready to order, had my list ready, promptly at 8am, I clicked on to order - and got "loading" which went on and on. I quickly phoned and luckily got Rachel who helped me order, but in the time that passed waiting for the items to load, and having to call, I missed out on some I wanted. I had decided that whatever I got would be great, and am happy I got 6, but the process was frustrating. I think its Regan's site that tells you how many roses are left or if sold out, says out of stock. That being said........I applaud Palatine for their dedication to bringing these out of commerce roses to us, I feel the prices are totally fair and I know they go to alot of trouble to do this and hope they make a good profit. They are the nicest people and always respond promptly and their plants grow so very well for me - I just love doing business with them! Kudos to John from California too for providing the cuttings and making this possible. Maybe as years go by and they continue this, they will improve the software and ordering will be easier. At least these lovely roses that Austin Roses have discarded are being passed around and hopefully others will take cuttings, grow them, and they will continue to be made available. I look forward to hearing what everyone got.........

I completely agree, alameda. I’m with you all - it was frustrating to experience the freezing and my cart deleted multiple times. I abandoned my phone and was able to finally place my order using my laptop somehow. I was able to order Brother Cadfeal, Claire Rose, Symphony, and The Squire.

I recognize this site was used to better count down the limited number of varieties available and had worked in the past - I’m not sure if they could anticipate that this would happen. However frustrating this was, I hope we can be respectful to them and to each other. Palatine did take a risk to do this and I hope they find it makes sense for their business to continue this in the future.

I wonder which of the roses don't sell out, as John mentioned. It's totally understandable that they'd scale back production on those varieties, to focus their efforts on the varieties for which there is a greater demand. I have to wonder though if they'd be more likely to sell all of the roses if there wasn't the 1 rose per variety restriction, or if the website was more user friendly.

That's a great point Chris Even if they kept to the restriction for the first days of the sale and then opened it up to multiple purchases of the same rose for those varieties that are selling out slower, especially if folks could add them to prior orders I don't think $30 is bad for large grafted roses when DA themselves are charging that amount Those nurseries charging less seem to be for smaller OR plants that take a bit of coddling to various degrees.