Clubbing baby seals? Our version of that is tilling the area to become a lawn. DON'T! So basically you need a lawn care mental make over. I'll get to that for you. It is pretty easy but it is equally easy to really do it wrong. I would suggest a grass called Shadow Turf. It is a variety of zoysia that really does grow in the shade. I'll post a picture after saying a few words about it. Shadow Turf was developed in West Texas at Texas Tech University along with Frontier Hybrids, a corn hybriding lab, in Abernathy, Texas. The owner had an interest in grasses and got two really good ones on the market before he passed away. The other one is Tech Turf, a buffalo grass hybrid. Tech Turf requires FULL sun while Shadow Turf only tolerates full sun. Shadow Turf really thrives in the shade. In the photo below, the Shadow Turf is under an English walnut tree. I had to duck to walk under the tree, so the canopy is probably down to 4-5 feet. You can see the density of the shade from the sunlight coming through the tree. The house faces west and has a huge tree across the street. Sunlight on the grass is limited to just a couple hours from noon to 3pm. That lawn was plugged on 12-inch centers about 18 months before I took the picture. The location is Abernathy, TX (obviously not a coincidence - Abernathy is a one-horse town). The reason I took that pic was to show where the grass had not quite fully filled in after 18 months. That spot is the least sunny part of the yard and probably receives no direct sunlight at all. Still the 1-inch grass plugs had spread to six inches or so in diameter. Clearly the rest of the lawn had filled in. Shadow Turf is a very dense, sod forming turf that might work for you in your application. Another variety of shade tolerant zoysia is called UC Verde. It was developed in California. It has a good reputation for the short time it has been out. I would check prices for both. Shadow Turf is not cheap. I paid about $85 for a flat of plugs. It spreads quickly, though, once it pops. I planted in May and by mid July I thought it was dead. SUDDENLY it was everywhere. It had been sending rhizomes around underground, and they all popped at once. Shadow Turf is moderately compatible with bermuda. Both can be mowed very low. Shadow Turf can also grow taller but when you do that, it is like bermuda in that when you mow the blades off the stems, it looks stemmy and brown. Getting the blades back on the ST takes a little time. It works much better mowed low and/or mowed often. Here are the basics of lawn care (lawn care mental make over). If you follow these guidelines you'll be okay even if all you have is weeds. Water deeply and infrequently. Deeply means at least an hour in every zone, all at once. Infrequently means monthly during the cool months and no more than weekly during the hottest part of summer. If your grass looks dry before the month/week is up, water longer next time. Deep watering grows deep, drought resistant roots. Infrequent watering allows the top layer of soil to dry completely which kills off many shallow rooted weeds. Mulch mow at the highest setting on your mower. Most grasses are the most dense when mowed tall. Bermuda, centipede, and bent grasses are the most dense when mowed at the lowest setting on your mower. Dense grass shades out weeds and uses less water when tall. Dense grass feeds the deep roots you're developing in 1 above. Fertilize regularly. I fertilize 4 times per year using organic fertilizer. Which fertilizer you use is much less important than numbers 1 and 2 above.

Thanks guys. Dennis was actually grilling before his surgery day, Katkin. But it gave us so much hope and pleasure to have the The grandkids here, cheering us up all the time. Dennis will be back at his grill soon!!! Lisa I throw whatever fert I have on hand at the bananas. I really like the organic mix I get to blend in with soil or even water to feed everything. (I'll tell you what it is, after I look at the sack-it is wonderful) By the way, I was thinking of you today. Did that blackberry I rooted for you ever take off? If not I have discovered another shoot starting if you want it. Tonight wass not so pleasant for Dennis. He has been having sharp pains in his side today and after a 1/2 hour of attempting to lay down in bed, he finally went back to the recliner. He is only parttially laid back and sound asleep with his head resting on his hand. Surely his neck is going to be sore tomorrow. But we go back to the Doc in the morning. So I am going to curl up next to him tonight on the sofa. You all know how much I love my him, he's my world. It pains me to see him hurting. We will get through this! Love you guys!

I've watched and read this thread with interest. My mother was the victim of horrible abuse as a very small child at the hands of her father. It was physical and emotional. The emotional abuse continued until he died. My mother left me with my grandparents as an infant and lived on the other side of the country until I was 9. As she wasn't around I was unaware of the acrimony between my mother and grandfather. When she came for a visit the battles began anew with me a pawn in their war. When she moved back to the town we lived in it was all out war most of the time. As I grew older and she lived near by, she began to abuse me. Some of it was subtle and cruel mental/emotional abuse some of it was her venting her fury on me physically with several awful beatings in my teens. Mostly I was aware that I was a symbol of unhappiness for her and she unconsciously wanted to destroy me. And my grandfather never abused me, he expressed affection in his grumpy way. My grandmother told me he felt sorry for me because my mother didn't love me. So that didn't help my relationship with my mother either as you can imagine. She had another child, my half sister. She pushed me away even more and attempted to have me sent away to a juvenile prison. She nearly succeeded. Fast forward. I am an adult with small children of my own. A year of therapy in my late 20s helped me resolve a lot of the painful and conflicted emotions about my mother. The damage exists, though, and still effects my relationships. Therapy and self examination help me to be more aware and conscious of my reactions. That doesn't always keep them from happening, however. I put on my big girl pants and make no excuses. One night when she was visiting and the kids were asleep, she started talking about my grandfather and told me the full tale of the vicious abuse she received and his alcoholism. She had an infant sister that died of leukemia. My grandfather turned his grief and anger on my mother who was three at the time. All news to me including the alcoholism. He was a teetotaler by the time I arrived. I sat there horrified and transfixed. That I knew nothing of this from my grandmother was no surprise as she didn't ever discuss unpleasant family events, ever. (I didn't even know about the infant who died until I stumbled on a family photo of two babies when I was 13 or so, one was obviously my mother, one was not but looked like family. I asked about that baby and my grandmother told me she had died.) How much was true? I will never know. I know my mother reinterprets events to suit her own needs. So I have to consider that. But she thinks it's true. Right then and there I forgave her all the pain I had suffered. Have I forgotten? No. And I keep both myself and my children shielded from her and have little but cursory and cordial contact. She plays obvious favorites with her grandchildren. My sister's kids get lots more attention and regular gifts. My kids understand that Nana J isn't a warm normal grandmother. But out of sight out of mind. Not perfect but not painful, either. I won't comment on your relationships, Tricia, as all families are unique. I'm simply sharing my own story of the multi-generational ripple effects of familial abuse.

I am a fabricator. We have been doing a 1/16" (i.e. positive overhang) for 20+ years. We do it that way, even tho it requires some additional work in the office, because, in my opinion it looks better, is easier to clean (no sink ledge) and it masks the caulk joint between the countertop material and the sink. The cutout dimensions provided by the sink manufacturer invariably exposes the sink rim, sometimes as much as 3/4". An engineer at Kohler once explained to me that an overhang can theoretically be deemed unacceptable by an inspector since the applicable building code(s) usually has some language prohibiting "hidden" areas in the food prep area so the OEM's always have a negative reveal. In thousands of jobs over more than 2 decades we've never had an issue with our cutouts.