No. Not the tape. Tape may hinder but not stop excessive structural movement. The studs were original to the 100 yr old house. When you tear everything out, you assess and shore up. Is there a stud behind the seam at the cement board? Is the cement board secured to the stud? If so, if it's taped, your problems could be beyond what you're seeing. The Redguard application in your case means nothing. Did you do any reconfiguration in the room (move walls, redistribute weight)?

Please don't say he put the cement board over the existing wall covering (plaster or drywall).

OMG! This is just so wrong...and you have photographic proof. Just watch this video -

https://www.custombuildingproducts.com/reference-library/videos/how-to-install-redgard-waterproofing-and-crack-prevention-membrane.aspx

It all has to come out...down to the studs (as it should have been done from the start). It has not been properly water-proofed. I am so sorry this happened to you.

Did he put the cement board over the existing wall covering (plaster or drywall)??? OR, did he remove the existing plaster / drywall down to the studs???

OK. Now please click on the link and watch the video (4 minutes). Note how you cannot "see" the seams (because those seams have been done properly)and how ALLthe cement board is completely covered by the RedGuard.

The old studs should have been "sistered" (Google the term) before the cement board was mounted.

It all has to be torn out and redone...sorry.

I can't even. The video referenced has nothing to do with your problem. My head's rolling. Please get a qualified contractor onsite to assess. Sorry you are dealing with this.

How about no waterproofing as the cause. More than the seams need to be covered. And by more than one coat.

Have you done any remodeling downstairs since the bathroom was remodeled (or around the same time?

Nope, Sophie, not the waterproofing in this case.

If he did the other showers the same way he did those, you have a pretty large issue that is needing addressing. Regardless of the reason that the crack appeared, the waterproofing is not done correctly. And that is enough by itself to insist on replacement. From a different contractor.

The cement board is hung vertically vs horizontally. There is nothing behind the seam to support it. It has nothing to do with tape at all its how they hung the boards. Boards are designed to fit standard 60" tub or shower hung horizontally.

There should be 2x4's between each stud with the 4 vertical giving the board sufficient support.

Besides that the look at that thinset? is it?

Lots wrong here but its how they hung the boards tell them they don't have a clue look at the rest of the job plenty more wrong here. Are those tiles lugged? If they are butt up against in corners zero caulk and no gap they can buckle.

I think Wannabath has nailed it.

A common size of cement board is 3' x 5'. If that was the size used, the installer chose to hang them vertically because it looks like the enclosure is more than 5' wide. Tub is usually 60" but this shower has a ledge plus the tub. Rather than make a couple of short cuts with staggered seams, he took the easy way out. May have even thought that the vertical install was a better idea because of having less seam vs horizontal installation in this non-standard size shower.

Like Wannabath said, there may not be/ probably isn't a stud behind the vertical seam. So just plain old seasonal movement would be enough to cause the crack.

.

This needs to be ripped out and redone at the old contractors expense and with a new contractor that actually knows what they are doing. Cement board is not waterproofing this was done all wrong from the beginning.

"Patricia, can you please explain why the waterproofing was done wrong ?"

It's not wrong, it's that there appears to be none. Cement board is not waterproof and the redguard appears to be installed only at the seams. I would also be concerned that the screw pattern was followed for the cement board in addition to the way it was hung.

In addition to the fact that there is next to no waterproofing, I wonder if there is a stud behind the seam.

Can you slide a razor blade or something thin into the crack between the boards?

If it doesn't hit anything, then there's no stud and that's a huge problem.

If it hits something, it doesn't guarantee that it's properly attached, but at least something is there.

Cement board is not effected by water but no it does not prevent water from penetrating through it. Everybody screams no waterproofing if they don't see a roll on or Shluter system but that is not true. Yes, it appears this installer is clueless and thinks it is to berated on only the seams.

Not every code requires ANY waterproofing at all. Most require a simple roofing felt or plastic sheet behind the cement board. In a traditional non steam shower it is fine. One traps the water before the board the other redirects if it gets through the board.

The entire reason for cement type boards is they do not fall apart when wet like sheetrock does. A lot of these membranes and roll ons were designed to go over sheetrock and make it waterproof.

There is NOTHING wrong with a shower that has properly taped seams and a simple roofing felt backing. Some feel this is actually a better system as it allows the wall to breathe. If you have epoxy grout and a roll on membrane if there is any water intrusion the water has nowhere to go and this is why you see mold with epoxy grout sometimes on shower pan jobs.

The biggest issue the nobody addresses is venting or draining the water pack into the pan or tub. Plastic pans used to come with drains along the shelf just for this reason. This is why caulking fails as it gets wet from behind and front and there are very few fully submersible caulks sold.

I am not 100% sure that is thinset and if it is it is not applied with the right trowel as there is almost no coverage.

NO gaps, no backing blocks and poor thinset and overtime you lean on that wall it flexes.

When I redid my leaking shower years ago (coming on 20 years?), I used roofing felt behind cement board. I built it per Fine Homebuilding. Don't know if the Schluter System or Red Guard was even around at that time. Knock on wood, so far, so good. At this point, if it fails, I don't mind. Something with less grout on the next go...

Hi, Here is what I can see from the pics. First, the hardy is 5 feet long, and if you install horizontally, there would be no seam there. Next, the premixed thinset isn't "squished" You can still see the trowel marks. When you st tile, you press it into the thinset for proper adhesion.

With that out of the way, we are left to speculate what caused the failure.I have two guesses.

My first is that the center stud had a bow in it. When he installed, he screwed the hardy to the stud, causing the hardy to bow inward. Over time, the screws tore through the hardy. As the hardy relax back straight, the tile began to pop off.

The second ( and most unlikely) Is that he simply left the thinset on the wall too long before setting the tile. ( the thinset dried) Seeing the pic of him installing I dont think thats the case.

Here is the bad part, whatever the reason, this is a failed project and the tile must be removed and the cause investigated and resolved. I am really sorry for that. Tile work is expensive. Hopefully the contractor is a stand up guy and will help you out on this. I hope you hired a licensed and insured contractor.

Please keep us updated.

Best, Frank

I see 9 fasteners in the Hardie board where I should be seeing 40 or so. No wonder it's cracking.

You probably don't see it this way, but you are actually lucky that the tile cracked to reveal the mess behind it. Contractors can get away with a nice tile job covering a myriad of horrors underneath for as long as the tile holds. For most homeowners the contractor isn't still around when this happens. Luckily for you this happened in a relatively short period of time - if this contractor does all of their bathrooms this way they won't be in business for much longer. Hopefully they are repairing this free of charge.

Hopefully, they will replace the tile and do proper repairs and wont cost you anything. I would also worry about the other bathrooms.

My concern of he didn't care enough to do it correct the first time, what will be the caveat this time? You need to know what the proper steps are and document with pictures the steps he takes. Trust but verify.............................

I agree with you 100%.

Hi everyone, I really need your help again with this same bathroom.

Now the contractor has opened one wall, but doesnt want to open the other 2 walls to remove all cement backer boards and reinstall them properly. he just wants to do the back wall and not the side walls, but I know the corners wont be connected properly. Any suggestions on how to back this up? any official literature/ instructions you could share from manufacturers/tile organizations? I looked online but could not find anything addressing the specifics of cement backer boards corner installation . I just wants this done right once and for all. thank you for your help!!!!

Read the manufacturer’s installation instructions for the products used. Not enough screws in the board. And the Red Guard is improperly installed.

http://pdf.lowes.com/installationguides/727396200226_install.pdf

https://www.custombuildingproducts.com/media/60997801/tb94-understanding-the-coverage-rate-for-redgard.pdf

There's no way I would trust his work on the remaining walls just because I haven't seen them fail yet...

I applaud you for taking so many informative pictures.

Corners are important when it comes to waterproofing and if one wall was done incorrectly then there's a strong chance that the other walls are bad too. The whole CBU job on the back wall looks a bit amateurish......not enough screws, joints not staggered, and joints not well mudded and taped. Also not waterproofing the whole enclosure seems like a cheap short cut and it begs a question. Was a vapor barrier installed behind the CBU? Leaving most of the CBU without Redguard would need a vapor barrier behind the the CBU to protect the framing and insulation...was that done?

I don’t think any water barrier was installed

/\/\/\/\ well there is your answer, it all has to come out

That's usually not good. Where do you live? In most places poly sheeting goes on the studs before the the CBU and then you use tape and thinset on the joints before you tile...or you put the CBU directly on the studs and again put tape and thinset on the joints and then you completely cover it with a waterproof layer like Kerdi sheets or Redguard. You basically want to stop water vapor condensing right on your studs and insulation.

One other question, when you removed the tile was it stuck on with sort of rubbery stuff like glue or was it hard like mortar?

You can't partially remove shower walls and re-do them. You don't "patch" a new shower. No other reputable contractor would come in and do what your contractor is suggesting. It's a sad situation. While we still would guess that the initial cracking was structuralIy related, it is, as someone mentioned, a bit of a blessing that the tile was removed and the other sub-standard prep was uncovered as this could have caused other problems down the road. I would request documentation indicating that the entire shower build is being done in accordance to industry standards as outlined in the NTCA Handbook and ANSI specifications and that you expect the work to be warrantied. And that will require a complete re-do. I'm assuming that you did not get a qualified contractor in to review the work? Sadly, we are called to consult regarding failures and when we do, we provide a written assessment and recommendation. That's your documentation as we would be providing the recommendations in accordance with industry standards. Can't argue with that. Hope you get it done right. Hire wisely HOUZZERS!

Any updates?

there's no way to get the left and right rear corner sealed without removing the entire system and starting over.
was he a licensed and insured contractor?

Ok, In Tn., In order to be a licensed contractor, we have to be bonded. This is like an insurance policy for just such an occasion. If I have a client that I mess up, and am not willing to repair to industry standards, the homeowner can go downtown to the codes dept and report.

Once codes looks at it and the contractor still won't make it right, you can "call on his bond" they will give you the amount to fix it with someone else, and he can't pull permits until he pays the bond back.

Since this is a tile/tub replacement, the contractor probably does not have a permit on it. That's ok, since it's torn out anyway, they will be able to see the water pipes. So don't let that stop you.

Please keep us updated!

Please remember folks, make sure that your contractor is licensed, bonded and insured. Mistakes happen, we are all only human. What's makes a good contractor is how they handle it when an issue does come up.

Frank you cannot make blanket statements like that as not every jurisdiction is the same. Bonding is not required everywhere. Permits are not required everywhere.

I understand, I'm sorry for what happened to you. we guarantee our showers for the life of the home excluding any structural failures of the house

celinesel,

When I look at the first set of pictures you posted I wonder what was used to attach the tiles to the cement board. It should be a modified thinset, was that used? Has any of the back wall cement board been removed yet? You need to see if there's a vapor barrier behind it...if not then there's no argument about all the walls coming down.