Jeff

Do tell us more...........

linus,

Sorry for the delay, the site was acting weird last night, hence the double post.

Jeff

Here goes-

After getting the Washer into the Laundry room I leveled it and locked the adjustment screws. I then proceed to removed both the front shipping bracket and two rear shipping bolts. While removing the lower front panel it was a good chance to check out the innards, impressive... a heavy duty cast iron balancing weight wraps around the drum. Both inner as well as the outer drum are made of Stainless steel. This Washer is definitely Commercial rated.

I wiped down the inner stainless drum with Prepsol, a wax and grease remover and then poured in two gallons of water into the tub to prime the pump which drains out all the standing water before a new laundry load starts.

I ran it through a "test" run with no clothes and wrote down exactly what was happening.

I also pulled the drain pipe out of my wall drain and into my Laundry sink which is labeled 1-8 gallons to measure how much water is used with each wash cycle. This not only helps to measure wash as well as rinse amounts but I can see how clean the rinse action is. I also used my thermometer to measure temps both in the tub as well as drain water.

Jeff

It looks just like the bottom half of my SQ laundry stack, which weighs 400 pounds, or so I was told. It has been a workhorse for 3 years now. Has some quirks, like water leaks over into the fabric dispenser, diluting it, so definitely don’t pour above the line. I wish it had an onboard heater, otherwise it’s near flawless. Everything comes out clean and water extraction is incredible. Enjoy.

Jeff congrats on the new SQ FL. I wish you a lifetime of flawless laundry. Please keep us updated as to how well your new toy preforms.

Congratulations! Do you have room and plumbing set ups for two washing machines?

OK, now that I bored you all with my prep I will get to the wash facts. After living with it for the last three weeks and writing down every option I think I have a good grasp of what Speed Queen was trying to accomplish with their front loader. I will compare it to my 2009 Bosch Nexxt for reference.

Things I learned-

The most important, this washer on it's Heavy Duty cycle (really Normal, but now Normal is labeled Normal Eco, more on that later) uses quite a bit of water! This was surprising to me as most modern front loaders are way too frugal in their water use. This is certainly not the case for this machine.

Going through my notes it used anywhere from 5-6 gallons on it's wash cycle. When washing you hear the distinct sloshing of clothes the entire cycle. My 2009 Bosch model averaged from 3 1/2-5 gallons based on load size of the wash cycle.

On it's rinse cycle it averaged 5 1/2 gallons with a high of 6 1/2 gallons. The Bosch had it beat with an average of 6 gallons to a high of 7 1/2 gallons. The SQ uses more water on the wash cycle where the Bosch uses more on it's rinse cycles. They both have 2 rinse cycles by default with the Bosch able to do 3 and the SQ able to do 5.

The SQ was able to change it's wash time cycle length by changing the "Soil Level" buttons which consist of Light/Medium/Heavy/and Max. Medium is the default setting which averages for a 14-15 minute wash time. Heavy soil level raised that wash time to 20 minutes.

Second-

The washer is quick.

A Heavy Duty cycle on Medium Soil level takes 45 minutes, raising the soil level to Heavy takes 50 minutes, and adding a third rinse is still only 58 minutes total time. My Bosch takes 60 minutes and went up to 67 minutes with a third extra rinse.

Where SQ saves time is in the rinse cycle time, it is a little too quick for my liking. After draining the wash water it takes on average about 3 minutes to fill and after it is does it only rinse spins the load for less than a minute before it drains out. My Bosch averages anywhere from 4-7 minutes rinse time so clothes are rinsed longer and in more water than the SQ.

In its defense the drain water was clear after the second rinse so I am probably nit-picking but if I could change something it would be a longer rinse cycle.

More info coming-

Jeff

Next I want to discuss Wash Temperature or more specifically Drain Temperature because on the Speed Queen you can't open the door after the cycle starts or the water will all be drained out. I could not open the door like I could on my Bosch several minutes into the wash to get a temp reading. I'm not a fan of this.

I'll start with the Warm drain temp. Looking at my notes it appears 75 degrees is the normal Warm Wash drain temp. This is the same on the Medium Soil Level or the Heavy, it stayed the same regardless of time the water stayed in the drum.

On my Bosch it was quite a bit warmer averaging from 90-93 degrees drained out.

Next was a Hot Wash and this is where I was sure that the Bosch would really top the Speed Queen as the Bosch has a Water Heater. On the Hot Cycle the Heater is engaged for over 10 minutes on it's wash time, so almost half the wash cycle. I verified this with my Kill-A-Watt meter as it stayed over 950-1150 watts for that time period.

I tested the Bosch several times on the Hot drain and I got these drain temps-

110/115/118/116

These were with different load sizes hence the temp differences.

Next was the SQ.

The drain temps I got were-

118/112/117 also different load sizes

This really surprised me as the SQ was neck and neck with my Bosch.

I know many here won't even consider a FL Speed Queen because of a lack of a Water Heater but if you are not doing a high-temp Sanitary Wash (2+ hours on most machines) the SQ was identical to a Heater model. My guess is the SQ fills only with Hot tap water with no ATC adjustment.

I wanted to try something as well- I did a Pre-Wash cycle on the SQ as I know on this model the Pre-Wash is the same water temp as the main Wash.

The Pre-wash runs a 5 minute wash cycle then drains out and refills for a 20 minute Wash cycle. This is when Heavy is chosen on the Soil Level.

The Pre-Wash drain temp was 118 degrees and the Main Wash drain was 120 degrees!

Heating up those large Stainless Steel drums seem to help hold in the heat.

Jeff

If you are washing between 110-120 you are only washing on warm. OK for most things but difficult at that temperature, f.ex. to get body oils off sheet or efficient stain removal without a great deal of product, For that you need about 140F.

Sounds like a well built basic front loader. If you got it at a bargain price you should get years of happy service. Congrats!

Rocco,

These are the drain temperature's after 15-20 minutes not the wash temperature.

Like I stated my Bosch Nexxt has a heater and the drain temp is almost identical between both model.

According to my Bosch manual a Hot Wash temp is 125-130. So a drop of 10-15 degrees after 20 minutes of wash time.I do have a Kids Care cycle on my Bosch that heats the water up to 150 degrees. Once I have the Bosch hooked back up I will measure that temp upon drain.

My Hot water heater is set @ 140 degrees and that is what is entering the Washer.

Can you check your Bosch Washer to see what you get for drain temp?

Jeff

MizLizzie,

Yep, these Speed Queen are definitely Heavy machines.

Mama,

Thanks and welcome back!

Sea Sea,

Unfortunately I have room for only one Washer. I'll have to make a decision on which one stays.

Jeff

@Jeffrey - My comments are using the Allergen 131F standard which requires that wash temp for 3 minutes to kill dust mites, pet dander etc. That's the bottom range of "hot" for most purposes accepted and agreed upon around here.

I had a Miele pair for years and prior to that Asko in our house and Bosch (no heater) in an apartment when we had 2 places. So I've done 205F -- near boiling -- washes on hot and used dumbed-down hot that was really warm.

What I found is each manufacturer has their own standards for hot and extra hot/sanitize depending on how their machines perform. The only place I was able to document real differences was with stain and odor removal.

In the Miele a 158F wash with 1 tablespoon of detergent completely removed a huge 3--day old espresso coffee stain from my husband's chinos. The same temp removed mildew from dishtowels I bought on ebay and odor from a new linen sheet bought on ebay and stored in an armoire from the smell of it. The 205F wash whitened yellowed 30 year old table linens in the Asko.

Again, around here most agree and it's also my opinion based on observation and se of 3 different compact FL brands that 140F is true hot and minimum needed to remove stains and odors.

Otherwise, IME wash temperature doesn't matter all that much and 120-125F is fine for most purposes. That was pretty much my default "warm" setting on the Miele.

My washer has a heater and I am confident that on the sanitize/extra hot settings I'm getting a wash at 140F. Bosch claims it's higher but I'm not sure.

With my current set up, in a new apartment laundry closet, the drain hoses are connected to the trap in the wall. There is no way for me to measure the drain water temperature. The new Bosch door design is a double door with a plastic front. The glass is inside that so no ability to touch the glass and gauge water temperature either. That makes the washer childproof and safer than others. However, it's a bore for laundry geeks.

My current set is a step above the previous one due to the heater. I felt confident buying it because I liked the previous set. So far, for my purposes, this current compact set is performing well enough for me not to feel deprived that I no longer have the Mieles.

I've only used SQ front loaders to do laundry at camp. They were fine. DD has a big LG pair and it does a good job as well. Sadly, life span on these are way shorter than 25 years ago. I'm thinking this new pair will last about 10 years if I'm lucky.

Hoang,

A member on automaticwasher.org does just that when he installs SQ Front Loaders for his customers that ask for a super-hot wash.

combo52 gets the credit for this:

"SQ FLer

But no water heater, If you want an extra hot wash just get a 120 volt 3-5 gallon water heater and install it with flexible hoses in the cold water inlet of the washer. Then when you want a really hot wash turn on the WH 15 minutes before you start the washer and you can easily have a hot wash temp in the washer of over 140 degrees. When you start the washer just turn off the extra WH and the cold water will continue to fill through the WH without it boosting the water temperature for the rinses.

We have installed various brands of FL washers this way over the years, the reason we install the WH on the cold water line is so you are not drawing your homes hot water into the extra WH where it will just sit and cool after the wash fill is completed."

Jeff

Another day, another SQ FL post :)

I decided to test out the Normal ECO Wash Cycle for two loads the other day. I wasn't quite sure what to expect with this cycle as I had been using (and liking) the Heavy Duty cycle with it's abundance of water used.

By default a Normal ECO cycle is a 44 minute wash which uses a Warm Wash/High Spin/Medium soil level. I was washing an 8 pound load of laundry.

The Wash cycle used 4 1/2 gallons of water and both rinse cycles used 3 1/2 gallons of water each. So, this 8 lb load used 11 1/2 gallons. Quite a water savings as the HD cycle was using anywhere from 17 1/2 to 20 gallons per wash.

Here is what I didn't like... the wash drain temp was 60 degrees. Not sure how that is considered a warm wash.

I decided to do another 9 lb load of laundry, ECO cycle as well, but this time changing the setting to a Hot/High Spin/Heavy soil setting and see the difference. The time jumped to 48 minutes, an additional 4 minutes due to Heavy soil being selected.

This cycle used 5 1/2 gallons of water for the Wash and 3 1/2 gallons for each rinse cycle. I had a couple large towels in the load so this probably accounts for the extra gallon of water in the Wash cycle. 12 1/2 gallons was the total water used.

So what was the Wash drain temp on this Hot ECO cycle? A little better but still nowhere I consider Hot-69 degrees.

Looking at my notes I had written down that there was poor rinsing on both ECO loads. Remember, I'm draining into my sink so I can judge the water and the amount of suds still remaining after each rinse. I'm sure the 3 1/2 gallons was just not enough water to properly rinse out the clothes.

My suggestion- avoid the ECO setting at all cost.

Jeff

Thanks for the reporting Jeff. I'm enjoying your measurements and observations.

The ECO cycle on my SQ top loader is to be avoided as well. I can see how people would develop skin problems using such chilly wash temps along with the lackluster rinsing. For some reason, I expected the ECO cycle on the FL to be not as poor as on the TL models. ...Hot ECO wash checking in at 69 degrees is terrible. There's nothing hot about that. Now you know to skip that cycle! How would the average person know this though? Imagine a parent washing dirty school clothes or gym/workout clothes on ECO thinking they are doing a hot wash...shakes head.

It will be interesting to see which washing machine you end up keeping; the Bosch or the Speed Queen.

Sea Sea,

Thanks for the compliment. I'm enjoying these tests myself and am learning new things. I always liked the reviews when looking at appliances and hopefully mine will help others as well,

I walked into this thinking nothing will ever replace my old Bosch but this SQ is making a strong case for itself.

Jeff

If I remember correctly your kids play sports, although perhaps not much playing is going on outside this winter. Try doing a few loads of your kids very dirty clothes with ground in dirt and see what happens. Also how does this washer handle stains.,, I am thinking stains like ketchup, mayonnaise, chocolate, dirty white socks, body soils, those kind of things. I would need a washer that could handle those kinds of stains very well.

Jerrod,

You're right about my kids being in sports, as a matter of fact we are in Phiadelphia this weekend for my Daughter's Ball Hockey Tournament. No dirt though, just bad BO ;)

You just might get your Ketchup test though...

Eugene from Lorain Furniture is doing several tests very soon.

Check out one of his SQ FL videos here-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZsGQGRYdzs

Jeff

Just got back from Philadelphia at 2 AM this morning. It was worth the 5 hour trip as my Daughter's team beat Ottawa to capture the Championship. Great job Stef!

This ones for you Jerrod.

I had to park in a muddy parking lot so I had a bit of mud on my khakis as seen here-

While my Daughter did not get dirty she was dripping with sweat after each game. She had 7 games on Saturday alone as she was playing in two different divisions so her clothing reeked.

I did several loads of Laundry this morning and as you can see from the wash drain water it was filthy.

I did a warm wash with Sears Ultra Plus, no pretreating, and the small mud stains came out just fine, Stef's Hockey clothing was smelling fresh again. I did chose the option of an extra rinse cycle as I felt with this amount of dirty wash water it certainly wouldn't hurt.

I'd say the Speed Queen did just fine on the Heavy Duty cycle and I use this particular cycle for all my washes.

Jeff

Jeff, you are making me want to go track down a SQ FL! I could never get Mr. Sea Sea to climb on board with me having a perfectly A-OK washer in the house though. I'll have to live vicariously through you with these tantalizing reports and photos.

:^)

I'm very happy for you that it seems to be working so well for you with the new washing machine.

Keep on washin'

ditto SEA SEA. Nice to see the good results. And plenty hot!

This is such great info! Thank you for sharing it. We have been running our SQ exclusively on Whites but just told hubby to bump ‘er up to Heavy Duty. We do keep our water heater on 140 and I run the laundry sink to full hot before cutting on the machine. But I do like that mini-heater piggyback solution to boost temps. That said, since getting our SQ, our laundry has vastly improved. This front loader has almost never failed me, and our linens are blinding and odor free.

Here's a cycle I've tried a couple times and seems to work well-

The Quick Wash cycle.

Example: When it's just me and the Wife's clothes that really are not dirty, but just could use a refresh.

It runs about 26 minutes total time and consist of a quick wash, typically a 4 minute Wash time (after a 2-3 fill time), followed by only 1 rinse cycle. The two times I have tried this it used 10 1/2 & 11 1/4 gallons total so it still uses a good amount of water.

Most Washers on the Quick Wash are rather stingy in this cycle.

Now, I wouldn't use this cycle for the Kids clothing or even if your clothes are showing signs of dirt as I don't think it offers enough wash time. Also, without the second rinse I feel it would not flush away enough detergent/contaminants.

So- for an office worker or if you don't get particularly dirty and need your clothes quickly this option might be a viable one for you.

Jeff

I personally wouldn't use such a short cycle. There is no way even lightly soiled laundry would get clean in a four minute wash. I don't even think that's enough time for detergent to dissolve.

Looks like the mud covered pants came out very clean. I've been watching the Loraine furniture vids for a while now and he does a good job with each washer he tests, although he usually doesn't test using a heavy soil level option due to the time it takes to complete a cycle, you can get a good idea of the cleaning ability of a machine. Does your model Speed Queen fl use a bit more water than the one he is using?

I might not use a 4 minute wash even with office worker clothes since that often involves ring around the shirt collar, and body odor, but I think it might work well for very small loads with no visible stains or odors. Nice to have the option though.

Jerrod,

My machine is the same model that Eugene @ Loraine Furniture is using. I am using the Heavy Duty cycle and that does use more water than the Normal/Eco cycle.

Compare the SQ to the LG 3770 he is currently reviewing and you can see the difference in wash water use. While the LG has the recirculating pump spraying the load it barely has any water in the tub. Given the choice I would want more water, especially for dirt covered laundry.

Jeff

Decided to put the Bosch back into the Laundry Room today as I wanted to directly compare it to the Speed Queen as I have a pretty good idea what it is about.

Before I moved the SQ out I decided to do a Tub cleaning using an Affresh tablet on Max soil level which it a 20 minute wash. This is 10 minutes into the "cleaning".

This is the drain temp after 22 and 1/2 minutes.

Jeff

Jeff, thank you so much for sharing the results of your tests. They are very interesting and helpful! I just bought a SQ laundry center today at a clearance sale (50% off!) and can’t wait to try it next weekend when it’s delivered. I’ve picked up some great tips from your posts - one key takeaway for me is to use the heavy soil option. Much appreciated!

I’ve been much more effective at using my SQ laundry center since reading Jeff’s analysis. Fascination, and I hope you keep adding to it. Thanks. cyc2001, you have scored a very nice machine, I suspect, especially if you got the older model. On mine, I find the fabric softener a very small disappointment. Very small. On the whole, it’s a flawless workhorse.

Hi MizLizzie, I think mine is an older model because the control panel is white. i was so excited when I saw it in the clearance tent. It was a crazy sale where people lined up hours in advance and everything was sold in 20 minutes - quite an adventure! I’m glad I had read enough on GW to know a good deal when I saw it. I’ll continue reading Jeff’s fantastic updates and will let you all know how we do with our SQ once it’s here.

Thanks!

This thread by Jeff is one of my favs on the laundry room forum. You've done an exceptional job of relating your experiences with the SQ FL. Thank you.

Is there a coin/lint trap filter up front where it's easy to access and clean?

cyc2001/MizLizzie/ SEA SEA,

Thanks for the compliments. I like to do these tests as the more I know about a product, the better I can get the results I need from it.

Knowing that it is helping others is icing on the cake.

Wish I had more to report on the Speed Queen but it is currently sitting boxed up in the cellar as the Bosch Nexxt is still going strong to this day.

Jeff

Sea Sea,

Regarding the coil trap filter-

Once you remove two small screws the front bottom panel is easily removed. From there, you can access the Drain Trap as well as check out the four Heavy Duty shocks and cast iron weight used. Definitely Commercial quality.

Jeff

Thank you Jeff! That was nice of you. It's too bad SQ isn't making these for home use anymore.

Jeff, did the Bosch stay connected nd replaced the SQ or what???

boba1,

Nice to see all the talk about FL Speed Queens these last several months, Speed Queen was wise to bring it back and not discontinue it as it's a quality machine.

Regarding your question...The Speed Queen is sitting packed up in it's original box in the cellar for the last three years as the Bosch is still running as new after the bearing replacement. I have no inclination to sell it.

Edit: Just noticed this was exactly three years to the date I originally posted this thread, time flies.

Jeff

What a coincidence. We have a 15 year old Bosch NEXXT washer that is making that noise, and also leaking from the front. When I looked into replacing it with another, I learned that Bosch doesn't sell the full size NEXXT anymore in the US, so we ordered and are waiting for a Speed Queen front loader to arrive (2 more weeks!). Wondering if we should try to repair the NEXXT- we are pretty handy. And I loved that Bosch NEXXT- what a great machine. Any advice Jeff?

lerkat,

If you are handy and don't mind spending the $100 or so dollars for the bearings and the seals (and maybe a couple large washers and threaded rod), I say go for it.

I really like my Bosch and it has done a fantastic job these last 12 years.

When you say leaking from the front are you referring to the boot area or somewhere underneath the washer?

Jeff

It appears to be leaking from each side of the door. You can see a bead of water rolling down the front from the bottom of the window towards the end of the cycle. There also is a leak a few inches underneath- that's why I think it is the other side of the door. That plus the thumping noise.

Just learned today that the Speed Queen is delayed a 3 more weeks, so now I'm gonna look closer at your repair thread for more reference!