Can cabinets be installed right on a concrete slab?

6 years ago

I hope this question makes sense. We are putting in new cabinets in the kitchen. Right now the flooring is a sheet of vinyl linoleum. We want to put in locking waterproof vinyl planks, and extend them into the dining room (which has carpet right now). To keep the floor level, I think we need to take up both the linoleum in the kitchen and the carpet in the dining room, and install the new floor on the concrete in both rooms.

However, since we are using a "floating" floor, the dealer said that it shouldn't be installed under the cabinets, so it can move slightly to adjust to temperature/seasonal changes. So, can we demolish everything down to the concrete slab, then put in the cabinets, then put the interlocking floor around the cabinets? Or do the cabinets need to have something on top of the concrete, to cushion them?

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User

6 years ago

You should install an insulating underlayment product that is the same height as the finished flooring. If you install wood product directly on concrete, the moisture in the concrete will wick up into the cabinets and ruin the parts in contact with the concrete.

The other reason is when installing under the counter appliances, the floor in the appliance space needs to be the same level as the flooring.

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Comments (12)

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MSDG
6 years ago
https://woodworkinstitute.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Sec10_2ndEdAWS_SmBkMrkd_141001-3.pdf\

I ALWAYS USE WOODWORKING STANDARDS IN CASEWORK take a look at the attached PDF.

Usually if this is a rolled vinyl product I suppose the case work could be placed on the concrete slab... but if this is island casework ... I would maybe build it up on a 3-6" curb to avoid soaking of the wood with liquids and spills in the future...

again determine your assembly and detail it accordingly ie: casework base / trim and toe kicks

Good Luck !!

www.msdg.design

Mario
Elizabeth B
6 years ago
Remove all flooring and cabinets and make sure floors are pretty level before proceeding. What kind of cabinets are you using?
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Why not put the flooring under the cabinets? You make the cabinets shorter if you don't. You also can have issues in the future if you want to reconfigure. Fortunately, we had hardwoods under our island when we demoed our kitchen, as we were reconfiguring the island. That saved some money. You should also have hardwoods under your dishwasher. Can you post a photo of your current situation?
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I prefer 90 days, but try telling a builder that. Naturally with higher end or homes with more square footage they'll get past that 90 days easily. There's a calcium chloride (CaCl) test that somebody mentioned here recently, but I don't see it used very often, although it should be. Can be expensive. I've talked to adhesive reps that mention using a concrete moisture meter, then if there are signs of questionable moisture levels, bring in the CaCl test. A few of the concrete moisture testing leaders. Not inexpensive either, but any good installer should have at least one. https://www.tramexmeters.com/store/moisture-meters-flooring/Tramex-Concrete-Encounter-CME4-Moisture-meter-for-concrete http://www.wagnermeters.com/shop/rapidrh4/c575-analog-concrete-moisture-meter/ "he's mentioned a plywood subfloor" Is there a reason here since you mentioned engineered? Perhaps the engineered has to be brought up to meet a different level? Vapor barrier. Yup, more than likely under the slab.
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How old is the slab? How flat is the slab? What's sitting on it right now? Let's start with the basics. Old slabs (built before 1990's) can have moisture issues. Without the right adhesives (and you would be surprised at how many adhesives that say they are 'unlimited' have rather sad limitations for moisture) you can get massive failures very very quickly. I'm always surprised at the 'glue down' the plywood and then nail down the hardwood. Why not just glue down the hardwood? It requires the same adhesive...so why not go ahead and do the hardwood that way...and skip the plywood. A floating hardwood floor (with proper moisture barrier underneath) is the one least likely to fail (due to moisture). A properly prepared slab (all the grinding/filling/leveling) is going to produce a lovely floating hardwood. And if you want a 'solid' feel underneath, go ahead and use a lovely 1/4" cork underlayment underneath the hardwood (but over top the moisture barrier). It is a really nice combination.
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PRO
Joseph Corlett, LLC
6 years ago
Shim the cabinets the thickness of the finished floor please, or you may experience appliance installation problems.
T H
Original Author
6 years ago
The wood cabinets are being custom made by a small local manufacturer and then the manufacturer will install the cabinets in my home. They recommended a contractor to do the demo and prep and some electrical changes I want in the kitchen. I think I need to talk to the manufacturer/installer a bit more about these things, rather than relying on the demo/prep contractor to handle it.

Maybe we should leave the linoleum that is currently under the cabinets in place under the new cabinets (although it may not be the same thickness as the new flooring, so that might not be the right solution either)...

HandyMac - Do you suggest any particular insulating underlayment product? Is this something that I'd buy from a flooring company, or even just from a Home Depot?

Everyone's comments are really helpful and make a lot of sense - thanks!

MSDG Mario - The link you gave me didn't work. I think this is a similar link: https://woodworkinstitute.com/publications/architectural-woodwork-standards/. This is a LOT of information that is kind of over my head, but it's good to know that it's out there!
PRO
MSDG
6 years ago
SAME LINK SECTION 10 FOR CASEWORK
SJ McCarthy
6 years ago
Is this a home on slab on grade (the concrete is touching the earth) or is this a condo with a suspended slab (eg. fifth floor condo with concrete floor/ceiling assembly)? If this is slab on grade, how old is the house?

So much depends on your answer.
PRO
Patricia Colwell Consulting
6 years ago
I ave never had a problem installing floating floor under cabinets I do it with lamonate often and IMO give a much cleaner look for install
PRO
Joseph Corlett, LLC
6 years ago
I agree with Patricia. You just can't screw the cabinets through the floor. As long as the floor can float under the cabinets, there should be no problems.
T H
Original Author
6 years ago
This is all interesting - I hadn't thought about the cabinets being slightly "suspended" rather than resting on the floor... thanks, everybody!

SJ - this is a single-story condo that is about 40 years old.
weedyacres
6 years ago
The cabinets aren't suspended; they're resting on the floor. But they are screwed into the wall studs, not screwed to the floor. So the floor can shift a little back and forth under the cabinets without moving them.
SJ McCarthy
6 years ago
I worry that there is moisture that will move up from the ground, into the slab and then soak any wood product toughing it. There will have to be some sort of barrier between the concrete and the wood base of the cabinets. I would discuss this with your cabinet installer.

And I'm not a fan of a floating floor being run underneath cabinets. It is an excellent way to void any warranty the flooring manufacturer may offer. LVT (Luxury Vinyl Tiles/Planks) move more than most people think possible. The best way to find out if this is allowed is to read the installation instructions that come with the floor.

Can cabinets be installed right on a concrete slab?

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Can cabinets be installed right on a concrete slab?

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