The second is way better than the first. In the first, the only useful counter prep space you've got is on the peninsula, which is completely inconvenient given the location of your sink & range.

In your existing set up, where is your range? (also, I'm trying to make it out from your photo, but I see a peninsula & no island.) I suspect that the folks on here could come up with an even better layout.

One question: the pantry space. Are you using it to best advantage? It seems like precious floor space that may help you out with the kitchen design.

And one concern: $16,000.00 for labor only? Not being nosey, but is the value of your condo worth that kind of investment? I am a big fan of IKEA for budget kitchens. Take those plans to IKEA and see what their designer can do with it.

We are now in our downsize and decided to go the IKEA route for the kitchen. Including quartz, but not appliances, I think the bill came to about $3,500.00. A local builder put them together and installed and he charged by the hour.

I love the cabinets and I love all the things to put inside them. Corner cabinets just slide out.

Over the range microwaves are a way to save space, but they look 'cheap'. No high-end kitchens ever do them that way. Can you put the microwave on a shelf in the pantry? Or perhaps a microwave drawer below the counter?

The 2nd option gives you much more counter space and is more functional as the first option is a bit 'choppy' and lacks functional counter space.

Your sink is a bit cramped in the corner. It might be better centered under the window and do the corner cabinet where the sink is. (Or eliminate the corner cabinet as they are ergonomically a nightmare unless you invest in some expensive corner solution hardware - just do a bank of drawers and have a void corner.)

Over the range maybe do a traditional hood with open shelves - like this https://www.houzz.com/projects/2845219/wine-country-farm-house
Just do uppers on the pantry storage wall. Maybe even a small appliance garage to keep counter top clutter under control?

You may need to scoot your refrigerator down a bit so you have enough clearance to use your tall food storage cabinet.

Can the refrigerator move to the pantry?

Not fond of either. Really believe that you'll like your kitchen better if the window is above the sink.

If you put your stove (?unvented? stove hood) near where the sink is drawn, you'd have countertop space in the corner to the right of the sink and to the left of the stove.

Wherever your kitchen will end at the dining area, that's where you put your refrigerator with a vertical drawer on the dining room side of it. connected via cabinets above both the drawer and refrigerator and connected to any overhead cabinets over the countertop beside the refrigerator -- such as between the refrigerator and pantry wall or between the refrigerator and the sink (w/dishwasher between the two.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/06/c3/a2/06c3a24146dbbefdccccf74db7b369cf.jpg

Do you need a tiny sink in the pantry?

Could you add the pantry space to the kitchen by continuing your kitchen cabinets and counter space along that wall into the pantry -- then putting only shallow, floor to ceiling, shelving/cabinet on the other wall across from it?

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/2f/14/69/2f1469ed250c17224f98b03da874367c--pantry-cabinets-glass-cabinets.jpg

#2 should be modified some and it will work well. I would eliminate the pantry walls and put the fridge at that end of the counter run for easy offloading of foods to be prepped at the sink. Of course, you'll have to assure there is room to stand in front of the fridge and open the doors or pull out the freezer, but I think there is. Then put in a skinny island that ends in a table for 4 or more into the dining room area.

Here are some variations on the concept

Putting the fridge in the pantry was our initial idea too. But after talking it over with our contractor we decided the cost/benefit was just not there. The pantry is only 5ft, so we could fit the fridge but all that’s left is a dead corner. We’re not really gaining any cabinet space. We’d be spending a couple thousand dollars to remove the existing pantry and then we still have to fit a pantry cabinet somewhere else. So we decided to keep the pantry.

@carrieB the range is currently in the island/peninsula (i’ve been calling it an island since it’s not connected to any other counters, but it is against the wall so maybe that makes it a peninsula, lol)

@judyg_designs welcome to New England! We got 5 estimates for labor ranging from $16k-33k once we realized labor alone was going to cost more than we initially wanted to spend on the entire remodel, we decided to splurge on custom cabinets so they will last forever!

@ML-designs I wanted to do open shelving with a ductless hood over the range but my cabinet builder insisted I will loose too much storage without those uppers and giving up a lower cabinet for the microwave. I really don’t think we can give up a lower cabinet but I hadn’t thought of putting the microwave in the pantry. It seems like an afterthought not to have it in the kitchen? I do use it a lot.

@suezbell what you are describing is basically the first design we considered. Here are two variants

Do people like this better? In theory I do like the layout better with the sink under the window and the range on the back wall. But by keeping the sink where it is now and putting the range next to the window I actually get a much larger working counter between the range and sink. So that’s why we moved away from this design; that and it’s at least $5k more in labor to relocate the sink and open the pantry.

@decoenthusiaste I like that at a lot, but Our kitchen is only 9ft wide. We had a design with an island but you can see the walkways end up being only 30” and 34”. I think that will make it too cramped.

Can you do it without removing the pantry?

IMO the concept of #2 is good, it just needs to be tweaked and refined. At 9' wide you kitchen is way too narrow for an island.

I like #2 with some tweaks, too. Hate the microwave over the range, sorry :-/ And I would strongly recommend all drawers for the base cabs. So convenient compared to shelves.

Curious: why not incorporate trash/recycling pullouts under the sink to free up a base cab? Using a small wastebasket that gets emptied daily is worth it for the extra storage. Our average sink cabinet with pullout holds a garbage can (small) and a large size rubbermaid bin for recycling with room for the box of dishwasher tabs and a HUGE jug of dishwashing detergent. We do separate our compost which is kept out of the cupboard; if I wanted to put it in I could use a much smaller recycling bin. I admittedly produce less true garbage (neither recyclable nor compostable) but even with 9-12 of us at home we still have to empty the bag no more than twice a week. All this is to say, evaluate your true waste needs before devoting a whole cabinet to them! If you currently have cleaning products under there, re-home them to the bathroom or broom closet.

I like #2 with a couple minor tweaks.

I'm not sure why you'd need a tall food pantry cab when the walk-in pantry is right there. Design it right and it will work really hard for you. (I love my Elfa shelving system from Container Store. When we replaced our builder installed pantry shelving with Elfa, we increased the storage capacity by nearly 50%.)

The other reason I eliminated the tall pantry was to give you counter next to the walk-in pantry for landing space (a spot to set down a bag of groceries) and a drawer for silverware.

I moved the fridge away from the pantry doorway a little. Using the fridge width to judge, the aisle between fridge and sink run didn't look like it was even 36"wide. I couldn't see any reason why you'd need to crowd it towards the sink run and the pantry opening.

I added a slightly wider drawer base next to the fridge, lining it up with the cab run on the range wall. I didn't add an upper because it looks like the stairway railing would interfere with an upper here. I spec'd a MW drawer in this cab so you can get a proper hood for the range.

Ditto on the recommendation to go with all drawers for base cabs. You can store large, bulky items in the pantry.

And definitely put the trash under the sink! I did, no regrets. I can move icky, drippy meat wrappers from sink to trash without having to worry about drips.

I added two narrow pull-outs - not inexpensive, ouch! - to my kitchen and they have proven useful but if I'd had the room to go with a wider drawer in both locations, as you do, I would definitely have gone that route. You can store your spices in a drawer like this:

I have a similar set-up in my kitchen with the sink next to the corner and the (in my case ) cook top on the perpendicular run. I looked at the blind corner cabinet options because it just seemed wrong not to use the corner for storage.

However, when I test drove the various types of BCCs (I brought the items I thought I'd store in them to the showroom with me), I found that none offered much flexibility nor did they store as much as I'd hoped or expected they would. They really did not give me the best bang for the buck, storage wise. I had a walk-in pantry for large, bulky things (which don't store well in these units anyway) and what I really needed was drawer storage. I do not regret this decision one bit!

Top drawers (you can see a corner of my sink to the right)

I forgot to take photos of my bottom drawers but the right one holds dish towels, the left one holds a colander, my salad spinner and a few other tallish items I use while prepping.

As you can see, I still have some room to spare in my middle drawers but that would not have been the case if I'd opted for a BCC instead.

HTH!

I love my over the range microwave! I use it constantly as I cook on the range. If I am reading this correctly, you do not have a hood for the stove now and no way to install one. Is that correct? So if you didn't put the microwave over the stove, what would you put there? A fake hood? The only way I personally would move my microwave, would be if I could gain a much stronger vent. MY current OTR microwave does vent to the outside. I would hate a microwave hid in a pantry. I also do not like open shelving. It is hard to keep clean.

I like plan 2 the best or the one you posted in the comments second best. I don't think a microwave over the stove looks cheap, but I wouldn't care if anyone else thought that. I favor function over form. There no children in my house and the microwave still gets heavy use at almost every meal.

ETA: I also see no need for the tall pantry shown in #2 next to the walk in pantry.

The layout with the sink under the window is much nicer. Keep the pantry and put your microwave in there. Center the range on the back wall and use a recirculating hood over it. Put the refrigerator at the end aligning with the change in ceiling plane above. I could see adding shallow tall pantry cabinets along the stair wall and eliminating uppers on the window wall.

I'd choose the second layout, but try to steal a bit more space from the dining area, and center the range between the windows. Skip the narrow pullout and use wider drawers. Wider drawers can be divided on the inside, and you can purchase spice drawer organizers.

ETA, you could consider wrapping the upper corner with a cabinet, so that the reveal on each side of the window is the same, and use an EZ-Reach upper corner cabinet.

The tall cabinet to the right of the DW could double as a dish hutch. I like lisa_a's idea for the MW beside the fridge, and if the fridge is moved over a few inches, there will be more space in the DW/dish storage space.

Jumping in with a quick comment about the over-the-range-microwave. While I definitely agree that in a kitchen with lots of stove-top cooking, especially if frying food, a vented hood is definitely better at doing it's job, a microwave (especially one that vents outdoors, like mine) can do a decent job & is a space & money saver if you don't use the stove-top heavily for certain

There are plenty of solid reasons to choose a hood. I'd caution against making kitchen layout decisions based on what "looks cheap."

nspinsc, I need no welcome to New England, having lived here all my life. I know we live in a high cost area, but I still think $16,000.00 is a lot just for labor. What percentage of the total bill is he charging you? My builder (last two homes were $1.2 charges 10% of the total and he even gives us his discounts on materials.

Not challenging you; just commenting it seems like a lot of money for a small space.

Interesting perspective, sofaspud.

What I like about #2 is that because you see the fridge from the side, not straight on, it's less of a dominant feature in the kitchen. I also don't like how the fridge crowds the pantry entry in #1.

Pity that fridges can't be more like the Tardis: bigger on the inside (yep, I'm a Whovian). Then we wouldn't always have to figure out how to minimize the bulk of a large fridge.

I like your original design (3) that you just posted yesterday. I'm always on board to have the fridge close to the sink. That would be a real plus for me.

@lindsey i was told we didn’t have enough room under the sink for a disposal and a pull out trash & recycling. But see below.

@lisa_a the sink with the offset drain is genius; I didn’t know that existed! How wide is your sink cabinet? I’m going to ask my Cabinet builder to redraw it with an offset drain, disposal and trash under the sink. I agree the pantry cabinet is pointless. I’m currently debating moving the microwave there instead. Where you located the microwave drawer would be against the stair railing and I don’t think I like the idea of putting a cabinet there. (The wall itself is only 54” wide)

@Sherry_7bAL correct, I do not have any way to vent to the outside. But I could put in a recirculating hood which should be a little more powerful than a hood microwave. I think I’m going to move my microwave to the pantry now and live with it for a week see if i like it.

@mama goose i like the dish hutch ideas. Not sure about extending the kitchen Ll this the way to the window. here’s a picture of the full dining space (excuse the mess, we’re having a snow day). The piano isn’t staying there. The table is going to be 6ft instead of the 4ft we have now. I think it will be too unbalanced with the kitchen counters all the Way To the window, no?

Man under my sink is grungy...

As you can see I could devote a lot less space to the recycling, but I like this because it holds pretty much all of our recycling for the week and I can just put this bin right out at the road on recycling day. We do have a small overflow bin outside but only need to put it out about once a month, if that. The recycling is just short enough to slide under the drain pipe, and the garbage is narrow enough that there are inches of space between the pipe and garbage bin. We don't have a garbage disposal as you can see, instead we compost. Our cabinet is a standard 36" sink cab, and our sink is a 70/30 drop in farmhouse style. Full of dirty dishwater at the moment. I think I've shown enough of my grunge for today!

If it hadn't been for the Kitchen Forum, I wouldn't have known about offset drains or adding a garbage pull-out under the sink either. This forum is also the reason why I have a single bowl and not a double bowl sink. I would never, ever go with a double bowl sink again!

My sink cab is a 36". My sink is the Kohler Riverby 33" sink. Interior depth is 9", exterior is 9 5/8" (per the specs). I also looked at the Silgranite Super Single sink, which is 9 1/2" interior depth and a little deeper than my Riverby sink (can't recall exact depth) but IIRC, it would have still worked.

If you're doing an undermount sink, don't forget to add the counter's thickness to the sink's depth. Make sure you have a bit of room to spare, too. But if you don't, it's not the end of the world. One poster (badgergal, I think) trimmed the top of her cans to fit under her sink. (dang, I was going to post the link to her kitchen but the photos aren't there anymore, thanks to changes at Photobucket.)

I agree that a cabinet under your stairway railing would look odd so hopefully keeping the MW in the pantry is a good solution for you. The fridge on the stairway wall will help hide the pantry view from the DR. That's a plus IMO.

Found pics of oldbat2be's trash under her Silgranite D sink in a 30" cab in this thread, [Blanco Silgranit Sink--is there room for trash under sink?[(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/blanco-silgranit-sink-is-there-room-for-trash-under-sink-dsvw-vd~2704740?n=6)

I think she's still around so if you have questions, there's a good chance she'll answer.

You can see scoutfinch's trash pull-out under a 31 1/2" wide Elkay Crosstown sink on this thread, [Trash pullout and drawer under sink finally installed [(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/trash-pullout-and-drawer-under-sink-finally-installed-dsvw-vd~3617245?n=13)It's in a 36" wide cab but you might be able to fit it in a slightly narrower sink cab.

I'm trying to find Carrieb's thread on fitting a trash pull-out under the sink since she has a narrower sink cabinet but so far, no joy. It took her a try or two to get it right but I think that was because her KD screwed up. I'll keep looking since I think it would help you but until I find it, you should check her reveal thread, [Reveal: "The Door" South Philly Row[(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/reveal-the-door-south-philly-row-dsvw-vd~3514091?n=93).