More fish. Different fish. Shrimps, scallops, clams etc. Smoked fish.

So good to see you posting after so long. Hope all is well and Super DD is doing well with her studies.

Never eaten chowder but glad to see you again!

Does it have to be chowder? What about cioppino?

Good to see you! It's been too long!

I would make it only omit the potatoes -- clams, butter, cream are all okay.

Try using cauliflower to replace some (or all) of your potatoes.

Good to see you! I would probably just do a clam/fish chowder and omit the potatoes,

I was going to say the same as above, use cauliflower.

OT - A friend makes the best clam chowder. Happily he makes it and shares because he does not share the recipe other than it is his grandmothers dating back to her days of cooking in logging camps.

It's not at all thick, quite brothy, very different than Ivars Seafood House style. It has that I can see - finely diced celery, onion, clams, and yes some potato but a lot of very flavorful broth with visible butter on top. Hint of bacon.

John, do you use bacon in your chowder? if not, definitely add that! :)

sherri1058 and morz8: Does the cooking time need to be adjusted when subbing in cauliflower? i.e., does cauliflower (floret?) take less/more time to cook than diced potato?

I agree with cauliflower as a sub for potato, but I'd do it in smaller than floret size so you don't really get a hit of cauliflower when you take a bite. I'd do larger than rice size pieces and cook them just long enough that they are soft, but don't disintegrate in the chowder.

Another idea is celeriac - maybe a mix of it with the cauliflower? And don't forget zucchini. Doesn't have much flavor but would give something to bite into in chowder.

In my experience any dish with cauliflower in it tastes "cabbagey"...not that it's a bad thing, just know that it will....and I don't want a creamy cabbegey clam chowder
You looking to make New England style or new York? Both have potatoes....and really nothing takes their place....but how about just using lots less potatoes?

I haven't made this, but I have seen a lot of low carb/keto recipes for clam chowder that use a leek instead of the potatoes.

I might try subbing celeriac for the potatoes. DH and I are on a low carb diet and also use cauliflower in place of potatoes for lots of things. DH doesn't even like cauliflower, but has had no complaints. Apparently, the cauliflower soaks up some of the flavors of other items in a recipe and that makes it good for him.

Also, Jerusalem artichoke might be a good sub, but I have not tried it.

Concentrate on your stock/broth, Fumet

Thanksgiving was a 'heads-up' trial run for x-mas/NewYears holiday cooking. Mom likes her ham and turkey Christmas Day but leading up and the days after is all seafood being EasterShore ChesapeakeBay area. (I'll make CodCakes x-mas morning). My brother likes to get a bushel of crabs.

Low carb, non-dairy, pescatarian, gluten-free, vegetarian... will be an interesting cooking adventure. I cover 90% of the cooking because I enjoy it and it gives Mom a break. I can handle all the sensitivities pretty well.

My sister has an interesting 'pie chart'... 80% plant based whole food, no nightshade. ...10% ancient grain, seed, nut, ...5% meat/seafood, nothing smoked,... 3% fresh fruit, ...2% cheesecake, lol

I'll take a crate of veg, (just 4 hr drive) and have already made stocks/broths the past few weeks. Fish Fumet I'll make next week. Freezes fine but never for long. I give it one month. Even properly and quickly chilled in an ice bath, then frozen, it does loose its freshness quickly.

Cauliflower, radish, daikon and watermelon radish, the white core/leaves of escarole, celery, leek, shallot, celeriac, parsnip, white sweet potato, red pepper, poblano....not all low carb but acceptable in smaller quantities for flavor.

Saute garlic, celery, shallot, cauliflower, escarole, all diced fine. Puree in high speed blender to make a veg 'gravy'. I then saute all the rest of the veg, half inch diced, including more of the 'gravy' veggies diced. (I'll add a kumato tomato to the 'gravy')

Butter, white wine. Then stock/broth, seafood of choice in a separate saute pan if mixed shrimp, scallop, salmon, cod, etc, with some butter then a ladle of broth from the big pot. Just easier to portion into bowls equally for an 8-10 crowd.

I make salt pork and prosciutto bundle 'flavor bombs' for a garnish. Half a slice of prosciutto loosely smooshed into balls, 1/2 inch diced salt pork, broiler on a sheet pan. Parsley and celery leaves garnish. I do make croutons but one will be from a sprouted grain bread.

Rouille, Aioli, warmed garlic herbed cream for Dad at the table, along with a big heap of extra mixed roasted/or sautéed veg. (if niece is still vegetarian I'll heat up a veg broth and she can add extra veg for a soup.)

All veg is prepped ahead in zip-locks and the croutons. As well as the salt pork and prosciutto. (just prepped, not roasted yet). Sauces a day ahead. I use the veg in the cod cakes, crab cakes, Bouillabaisse, Oyster stew, ...just adjust quantity. Dad likes cream in Oyster Stew, Mom does not. Corn is not low carb but minor amount in Cod-n-Corn Chowder is for flavor.

Wocestershire, fish sauce, white miso, mustards, hot sauces...great flavor boosters.

phew, I'm exhausted. But figured out my holiday at your expense, lol.

Post Thanksgiving soup had lots of similar veg chopped. Last weekends fish chowder I just used the Cuisinart for a mince, (in a hurry). I'll do a more careful dice for Christmas/NewYears.

I usually only make clam chowder if I can get them fresh. I should probably re-visit the canned goods as it is really good. Love the flavor.

Dug up root veggies are not necessarily low carb but some do pack allot of flavor like celeriac and more food value like a sweet potato over a regular potato.

I don't find cauliflower cabbagy. But I do notice if it isn't fresh I don't buy it. Same with parsnips. So much better from the farmers market. Rarely by broccoli or would never pair it with seafood. Same with Brussel sprouts. Love them but they are a side dish or roasted with other veg. Carrots and asparagus stay out of the pot as well, but excellent in meat based soups/stews/veg chowders.

Golden and white beets are good in soups/chowders in small quantities and in a side slaw.

Before Thanksgiving, my husband was in the grocery store getting my supplies for the dinner. He had 12 heads of cauliflower in his cart. A woman stopped him and asked him what he was going to do with all that cauliflower. He said, "My wife and I are going to eat it, of course". She said that we must really like cauliflower. "Yup", he said.

We made the traditional bread stuffing for the family, but also made cauliflower sausage stuffing for us low-carbers. Also made mashed potatoes and mashed cauliflower. The stuff made with cauliflower actually got eaten before the potatoes and bread things. One ate the mashed cauliflower "accidentally" and swore it was potatoes.

Hi John! There are a couple of things going on in chowder. One is the texture, the other is the thickness. I agree with leaving out potatoes as a possibility. Celeriac and rutabaga are both pleasant roots with about half the carbs as potatoes. Celeriac (celery root) can be strong, so I wouldn't use any celery (green) with it. You could replace the texture of the celery with something else crunchy, maybe jicama. Rutabaga has a different flavor from what I usually think of in calm chowder, but it could be good as a potato substitute if you like it.

The starch from the potatoes is harder to account for. I don't know what to say about that. Maybe one of the seeds that gel up (chia, flax, etc.) that are used for thickening. Maybe a powdered protein could work.

Phil’s Fish Market Cioppino: the best cioppino on the West Coast!

This is the real, true recipe from Phil himself -the man who beat
Bobby Flay in a cioppino showdown, and ships cioppino around the world.
You’ve got to try it, and if you’re ever in Moss Landing, CA – stop by
to see Phil and tell him we sent you!

Ingredients

For the Cioppino:

1 tablespoon olive oil
1 tablespoon unsalted butter
1 clove garlic, chopped
1/4 cup white wine
1 pound Little Neck clams
1/2 pound mussels, scrubbed
2 quarts Cioppino Sauce, recipe follows
2 dashes Gluten Free Worcestershire Sauce
Pinch saffron
2 to 2 1/2 pound Dungeness crab,
cooked, cleaned and cracked,
or 1 pound cooked crab meat
(preferably Dungeness)
1/2 pound medium shrimp, shell on
1/2 pound squid tubes, cut in rings
1/2 pound firm-fleshed white fish
fillets cut in 2-inch cubes
1/4 pound bay scallops

Cioppino Sauce:
1/2 cup olive oil
2 medium onions, halved and thinly sliced
6 cloves garlic, chopped
3 bay leaves
1/2 cup chopped parsley
1/4 cup chopped sweet basil
1 (28 ounce) can peeled tomatoes, crushed by hand
1 (28 ounce) can tomato puree
28 ounces water
1 tablespoon clam base without MSG, optional
1 tablespoon brown sugar
1 tablespoon celery salt
Dash Gluten Free Worcestershire sauce
Black pepper, to taste
Crushed red pepper, to taste
Dash cinnamon
Kosher salt, to taste

Directions

For the Cioppino:

1. Put the olive oil, butter, and garlic in a wide, deep pot over
   medium heat, and cook, stirring, until the garlic is fragrant, but not
   brown. Add the wine and the clams, and cover. Turn the heat up to
   medium-high and steam until the clams start to open, about 5 minutes.
   Add the mussels, cover and steam until the just start to open, about 2
   minutes.
2. Now stir in the cioppino sauce, the Worcestershire sauce and saffron
   and bring to a simmer. Add the cracked crabs, if using, and the shrimp,
   and simmer for about 5 minutes.
3. Then gently stir in the fish, squid and scallops, and simmer until
   they are all just cooked through, about 5 minutes. (If using cooked crab
   meat, stir it in very gently the last minute or so of cooking time.)

For the Cioppino Sauce:

1. Heat the olive oil in a large saucepan over medium heat. Add the
   onions and sauté until translucent. Add the garlic, bay leaves, parsley
   and basil and cook, stirring, just to warm the garlic—do not let it
   brown.
2. Stir in the crushed tomatoes, tomato puree, water, clam base, brown
   sugar, celery salt, Worcestershire sauce, black and red peppers,
   cinnamon and salt to taste. Bring to boil, reduce heat to low-medium and
   simmer uncovered for about 1 hour and 15 minutes, stirring
   occasionally, until thickened.

Recipe Credit: Phil’s Fish Market

That was Phil's recipe (we used to eat there once a week), that I copied and pasted from some website.

Donna, I can't even imagine eating mashed cauliflower and not knowing it's not potatoes. I love potatoes and don't particularly care for cauliflower, although I'll eat it. I've been served cauliflower in every way imaginable, from pizza crust to mashed "faux" potatoes, riced, covered with cheese, grilled "steaks", batter dipped and deep fried. It's still cauliflower.

Like LindaC, I think cauliflower gives the flavor of cauliflower to everything it's in, which is fine if you like cauliflower. I do like rutabaga and turnip, but they'll give that distinctive flavor, as will celeriac, and some of those could overpower your seafood.

Good luck, I don't have a suggestion, other than using a lot fewer potatoes or, as has been suggested, switching to cioppino.

Annie

annie1992: I feel the same way about subbing spaghetti squash for pasta. I finally tried the swap earlier this year, thinking, "THAT many people can't be wrong...they must be onto something." Blecch. I'll just cut back on my pasta portions and have the real thing, thank you very much. :)

Okay, the thing about subbing vegetables is not to have a magic substitution, but to have a different dish that tastes good. That's why I think celeriac would be good in chowder, which in my world has a lot of celery, and jicama might make good crunch because, like celery stalks, it holds crunch for a long time when heated, is a bit wet in its own right, and, unlike celery, doesn't have a lot of flavor.

Rutabaga does work in place of potatoes in a lot of recipes, though it does have a different flavor. It's just that what works for one, often works for the other.

Regarding zoodles/courgetti, I always put zucchini in my spaghetti sauce, but I don't like zucchini with tomato sauce when zucchini is the star. OTOH, I like zoodles both raw and grilled. They're great with just fresh lemon juice, or with any number of other sauces. But I would never call them "pasta". :) What's great about zoodles is that they don't go squishy wet in the middle the way cut squash does so easily.

Spaghetti squash is delicious, but I wouldn't put any kind of sauce on it. Maybe a little butter, or some herbs and a drizzle of EVOO. I don't know how one could mistake it for pasta. At least zoodles look a little like pasta... And it's too wet to put most sauces on nicely.

Re caulflower, I got nuttin'. It always tastes like cauliflower. It always smells like cabbage. It usually tastes cabbagy too. There's a Vegan restaurant I've gone to with friends where they make this awesome cauliflower "wings", Buffalo style. I don't care for Buffalo wings, and I think naming vegan food after animal food is weird, but I love the cauliflower wings. They're firm (not heavily cooked), do taste like cauliflower but don't taste cabbagy. I don't know if it's the frying or the sauce or if they do something special to prep it, but that sulphrous cabbagy thing isn't there. Sometimes it goes away when I roast it too. The way some people make mashed potatoes, kind of liquidy with cream, I can imagine perhaps mistaking non-cabbagy cauliflower for. Lots of other things on the plate to confound the palate, and the cream and seasoning flavors expected from potatoes. That's pure speculation, though.

I don't know if it's true, but I read that small potatoes have fewer carbohydrates than larger, baking potatoes. Kind of makes sense. They haven't been on the vine long enough to develop the starches fully.

Forgot about zucchini and nice little Persian cucumbers. I don't 'zoodle'. Thought about it a few times but it doesn't fool me. One more crazy plastic appliance. I do 'get it' if I needed to, ...looking for low carb etc, but we eat minor pasta/noodles as it is and good homemade bread but not every meal. Probably twice a month.

My sister has the hip-pocket tiny zoodler one she travels with. She also likes cucumber chopped in her soups. I do all that in a 6-24 hour pickle and have that in slaw or over a noodle bowl meal. Avocado is another good chowder/soup topper at the table.

Add your tender/firm veg just before serving and not simmered in your broth for an hour/hours like a cheap diner. Use high end restaurant tricks where veg and broth and fish/meat rice/noodles are added together at the last minute all cooked al-dente, before serving, so the flavors are just meeting and no over-simmered veg can get squirrely,/cabbagey./mushy/ overcooked. Takes some thought/planning but so worth it.

Just yesterday I was wondering whatever happened to John Liu! And today, you're back!! Glad to see you. Have missed your posts, John.

I make zoodles with my V-slicer. Works like a charm.

I actually prefer zoodles instead of pasta in 'Pasta with Italian Sausage, Tomatoes and Cream. I make the dish w/ pasta for the rest of the family but hold some sauce back for me. Nuke the zoodles briefly and then sauce.

But I don't think I would care for zucchini as a substitute for potatoes in chowder. Zucchini is too water-y, IMO, for it to work as a suitable sub. I think I would much prefer cauliflower. I do love cauliflower, though. Anyway you want to serve it from raw in salad to cauliflower soup.

Glad to see you back John and, I would add more fish or go full out cioppino.

I hate this cauliflower craze. The black bean brownie.

javiwa, I feel the same way about spaghetti squash. I like it, it's squash. But it most certainly is not pasta and don't cover it with red sauce and try to tell me it's "just like eating spaghetti". It isn't. The thing about vegetables is that I like them, a lot, but I eat them for what they are, not for what they are pretending to be. A veggie burger is good, but not a hamburger. If I eat it knowing it'll taste like a veggie burger it's fine, I like that. If I'm expecting a hamburger, though, I'm going to be sadly disappointed.

No zoodles, thanks. We have one of those "machines" and we've used it. Twice. Back into the backroom with the rest of the junk we'll never use again. I can cut softer vegetables on it, like cucumbers and zucchini, although I fail to see the point, I could just as easily cut them into planks or julienne. Anything harder, like potato, my fingers are not long enough to push the vegetable, turn the crank and still keep the thing from being pushed across the counter. Eh. Elery can make it work and he did potatoes. Once. We baked them in the oven and he said it was just like french fries. (shrug)

Anyway, I don't think there's a good substitute for the potatoes, anything else is going to add their own flavor and may compromise more delicate seafood.

Oh, and welcome back, John, I've missed you and your posts!

Annie

From reading all the posts, I'd have a proper chowder and eat zoodles for the next meal to compensate lol

Whew. I've been trying to reply and thank you all for the ideas and the welcome back, but I apparently forgot how to work the Houzz forum reply on my phone. After a day of trying over and over and watching long typed posts vanish, I finally figured it out. "Request desktop site" then "Reload site without content blocker". Okay. Thank you. Thank you. I'm too tired to post more now!

My favorite chowder is Rhode Island clan chowder, made with clam broth instead of cream. It uses potatoes, too, but you could lessen the amount. (I've made it once, and that's what I did.)

Hello John! Welcome back! Miss you here. How's the family, and your very talented son?

Don't make chowder. You call it chowder, people will expect chowder. Call it seafood soup.

Use toasted flavored bread cubes instead of potatoes. Less carbs, more flavor.

dcarch

HI JOHN! Glad to see you here again and looking forward to catching up!

I have two recipes that I use. As for potatoes, I'm now using rutabagas in stew like dishes. Even my husband can't tell the difference! I don't think cauliflower would cut it for us either, and we like cauliflower!

Here's one recipe for Manhattan-type chowder:

Seafood Stew

Posted by DanaIN (My Page) on Mon, Nov 14,
05 at 18:11

Although I love a rich creamy New England Clam Chowder I
prefer this recipe for Manhattan Clam Chowder (with bacon) so I turned it
into Seafood Stew. It was awesome. Made just the perfect amount for Paul and
I for dinner with a salad and wine.

Manhattan
Clam Chowder

3 slices bacon cut into 1/2 -inch pieces
1 medium onion; diced
1 small, sweet bell pepper; diced
2 cloves garlic; minced
1 (10 oz.) can baby clams (or 1 bag fresh)
1 (8 oz.) bottle clam juice
1 (14.5 oz) Italian seasoned tomatoes
1 medium/large red or Yukon gold potato; cut into small cubes
1/4 teaspoon dried thyme
kosher salt to taste
fresh ground pepper to taste
1 tablespoon flat leaf parsley

In a large saucepan, fry bacon over medium heat until crisp. Remove bacon
from pan and set aside leaving drippings. Sauté onion and bell pepper in
bacon drippings until softened. Add garlic and continue to cook for 1 minute.
Stir in clam juice from bottle. Drain clams reserving liquid and add to pot
setting clams aside. Stir in tomatoes along with their liquid, add potatoes
and thyme. Season with salt and pepper and simmer until the potatoes are
tender.

Stir in clams and heat through. (If using fresh clams, continue to simmer
covering pot until clam shells open, discarding all that do not.) Do not
overcook after adding the seafood. Ladle the chowder into bowls and sprinkle
with parsley and reserved bacon to serve.

*You can also find clams in the freezer section near the seafood counter
at larger grocery stores.

Turn this into a Seafood
Stew: Stir in 1/2
pound of fresh salmon or halibut cut into bite-size pieces, 8 or 10 shrimp,
and 2 or 4 large scallops when adding the fresh clams and cook just until
seafood is cooked through, 6 to 8 minutes and the clams open.

The other one I make for my husband is more like a CIOPPINO (link).

That sounds really good John Liu.

Kate, bread bowls are so 80's, hel-lo. (lol). Not blogging? Or study most important.

I don't use flour. No issues or any intolerances to any ingredient but all those memories of thick gluey Diner chowders. After I saute onion, celery, leeks, in the bit of bacon/ fat back oil,...bacon out on p-towel for garnish,...., I take some of that veg out and give it a good wiz in the blender or stick blend. I need to keep some aside and add some greek yogurt, or cream, sometimes feta and goat cheese....for a side at the table and those that want creamy can add as they wish.

A bit of the saute veg blendered does make a good bit of 'gravy' thickener to add back to the pot.

Just made a killer salmon chowder as another holiday test.