I would also consider a 2-level approach or something similar that lets you make the transition to ground seem more gradual. There is also the idea that you may find you want to do a good deal of grilling the food outside, then eat inside, because well, it is just so convenient and you can grill under less ideal circumstances than required for outdoor dining. The utilitarian steps down to patio just to get to the grill will be a barrier to that. The problem with same level is that you have to use decking, then it does tend to force you to a large deck, then a large area underneath it plus lattice or whatever, plus maintenance--though new deck materials as you suggest make that less of an issue. So I do not want to discourage you from thinking about having a "stone" patio that is part of the yard. I think over time that area could be very nice and will feel more permanent--properly landscaped. So the deck idea gives a more immediate sense of its being just an extension of your kitchen and feeling like a "room", but the patio has the ability to feel "in the yard", as noted above. The problem with bi-level structures is you have to design carefully so that neither part is too small to be useful or it breaks up your party in the wrong way. So, for example, if you envision 6 guys or gals yakking around the grill, you want room for that in your design. I think the deck landing as shown in your picture has that dreaded ubiquitous tacked-on landing look that just gets you up and down, and if you do actually make just steps, I would try to put more into their design to make a more graceful descent to the yard--whether that is broader, curved, or something. Of course that might be too expensive, so part of the fun of the forum is that we can brainstorm about how you might spend your $$! Really, just giving you things to think about. Broad steps or more gradual transition type structures can also often be used as seating/dining (for kids) as long as is wide enough. You don't show anything about the exposure of the back of the house, sun patterns, etc, so any design needs to think ahead to whether you will plant trees for shade, use umbrellas, arbor, or what--meaning, leave space in yard, or plan layout of space.

I just stumbled upon this discussion and felt compelled to make my contribution. I know brick because I work for a brick manufacturer. However, I will try to keep my personal bias at bay. The first issue to address is durability. When installed properly, either option will provide many decades of service. Both materials have the compressive strength and moisture absorption ratings to withstand the harshest climates nature can throw at them. There is actually another factor affecting cement pavers, but since it doesnt actually cause failure of the unit, I will address it in the appearance section. Either way, make sure your bricks/pavers are designed to go in the ground. Not all cement materials, nor are all bricks designed to do this. It was mentioned that the deterioration of house bricks in a patio was unheard of and that it would actually be an advantage to find reclaimed bricks from a demolition project. DO NOT DO THIS! For a segmental paving material to withstand Mother Nature, it must have a minimum compressive strength of 8,000 psi and a maximum absorption rate of 7% after a 24 hour soak in cold water. I have seen historical test data from the mid 1900Âs that showed that many solid house bricks (which were often used mistakenly as pavers) had compressive strengths around 5,000 psi and absorption rates in the double digits! Needless to say, those ill-fated patios are either long gone or a horrible eyesore now. Now that you can be comfortable in choosing a durable product, the second issue to address is appearance. Additional factors besides just the look of the brick/paver should be considered. For instance, do you want your pavement to match the colors of the bricks on your house? Will you be incorporating any retaining walls in your project? No matter how hard you try, you simply cannot match a clay color in a cement product and vice versa. Brick makers do not currently make a dry-stack retaining wall system; therefore a brick retaining wall will require more work. However, if you are trying to create a stately atmosphere it may be worth the additional work (or hiring of a mason contractor) to build your retaining wall. The first factor of appearance, the look of the actual brick/paver does speak pretty much for itself. However, I do want to address some comments from the thread. To my knowledge (I have not researched this) cement pavers have always had their colors mixed throughout the paver. (End lack of research warning.) What is actually happening is fading due to ultraviolet radiation. This can be mistaken for the coloring only being on the surface because with time cement pavers will actually wear down. This is evident in a cement paver project once it has been installed for about 10 years. Because the erosion is visible (you can actually see the aggregate) it is commonly believed that coloring is superficial as well. I do not see the issue of erosion as a durability factor since the units will still be in one piece and the pavement system as a whole will not fail. (Personal bias warning in effect)However, after all your hard work and money put into your project, wouldnÂt you want it to look the same as it does now in ten years? (End bias warning.) To be fair, cement pavers can be sealed on an annual basis to ensure their color retention. However, when you add up the cost of initial construction and yearly maintenance over ten years, you could probably install solid granite for about the same cost. (I havenÂt done the math and may have exaggerated, so research it for yourself and see.) There are advantages for both products (Although one list may be longer than the other!) and your unique concerns and application should be considered. In addition, other pavement options such as bluestone and granite are worth researching and considering as well. I know this has been an extremely long reply, but I sincerely hope it helps you make an informed decision. While there are not as many "genuine clay paving brick" retailers as paver retailers, we are out here. Do your research and you will find us!

We are in a real mess because of bad concrete on an almost 4 year old pool. The entire 1000 square feet is failing. It started showing signs of problems from the first week. Our builder has been evasive and defensive concerning this issue. Finally he said "call my lawyer." So, even though it is not "our style," we are forced to go the lawsuit route. We have paid about $1000 for a core sample which said it was a bad mix due to lack of entrained air, and needed to be entirely torn out and replaced. We have spent MONTHS trying to get an estimate on the tear-out and replacement. No one wants this kind of job! Finally today we should get a written estimate which is likely going to be about $16,000. I am very concerned about what else might break as the concrete is being chopped up. I keep wondering if the replacement should be something other than concrete......

The big issue would be "is the concrete done settling" The surface water and water from the roof needs to diverted away from the patio, if not then the problem gets worse. The deterioration is caused by trapped surface water which freezes and expands therefore breaking the brick. I saw just 1 crack in the photos and it looks like a settling crack. The pool and patio looks like it's been there for a good amount of time therefore I would think the compaction was done right and the settling would be done. The space where the plantings are next to the house would be a collection space for surface water to get in under he patio. I believe this is also the space you're planning to install a hard surface which is good. The concrete overlay is a good idea. I suggest looking at an installer with a lot of experience. I'm not familiar with the breathable stone. I will research it if you would share the company and stone name. My thinking is you need a non porous stone that would divert the water.