I don't grow any of these. Have you looked for pictures on Help Me Find Roses? They have pictures of most roses in commerce. http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/plants.php

You don't have to join - just type the name of the rose in the box after clicking on SEARCH.

Jackie

Hey Jackie, yes I have, I'm on there almost every day, lol. But, there are so few pictures shared that it is very hard for me to get a good idea on any of the roses.

I planted Reine des Violettes and Mme Pierre Oger (a lighter version of Reine Victoria) when I moved to Brooklyn years ago. They should be completely hardy in our zone, but tragically, I lost them both (along with quite a few others) to a rare, unseasonable post-Easter frost. I was so devastated I have never tried them again, concluding that I must not have optimal conditions -- too dank and shady, feral cats, etc. Also, those particular bourbons, among the most beautiful in the genus, demand quite a bit of coddling and even so may die suddenly for no apparent reason, as is the way of fussy plants.

Nevertheless, there was a beautiful specimen of Reine Victoria growing in the shady part of the Cranford Rose Garden of the Brooklyn Botanic Gardens for many decades that only disappeared when they decided to-re do the garden. So nothing ventured nothing gained. You probably already know that shrub roses generally tend to be rather large growing, but you could train them against a fence or wall.

The tea roses are also large and moreover not rated as completely hardy in our zone, but it can't hurt to experiment. Some people around here must grow them. Here's a picture of Vicomtesse d'Avesnes, described as "grimpant" -- a climber.

http://www.florum.fr/rosa-vicomtesse-d-avesnes/75157/rose-rosier-zp.html

I am just curious, what attracted you to these particular varieties?

I have been growing Vicomtesse d' Avesne for a little over 2 years. It has grown slowly ( about 2' tall), and right now, has buds for the first time. There really is not much information on HMF regarding this rose, but I found images online. If the windiness scheduled for next week does not destroy the buds I will post images.

thank you monarda and desertgarden!! I love old garden roses, but my small backyard is making me VERY mindful of the roses I am choosing to plant. I am MOST attracted to globular, cup shaped blooms, although not all listed above have them. I like the fullness and noted scent of curlypink but it might be too hybrid tea shaped for my liking. Beaute d'europe looks really stunning in some photos, although I am so limited on my room for more climbers.. in the next few months I will post pictures of the other roses I have coming and already have, the ones above though I have been going back and forth on.. Vicomtesse and l'abonance are unheard of and I was REALLY interested in growing them for that reason but I won't be able to cut them for a vase since their stems are so short so I'm just considering if it is even worth it.. I have wanted Reine Victoria for the longest her flower shape is exactly what i look for, but again, her blooms seem small, she might get really huge and I heard she black spots terribly which are all traits I'm trying to avoid.. I've read about Richards rose on here and Pam strongly suggested him, but I'm not sure I like how his blooms reflex, although the shape seems beautiful from the few pictures I've seen.. I have read so much in Old Rose Books about the HP American Beauty and was taken back by the history of her.. Plus she seems good for cutting but I'm not sure if she is disease ridden as are most others in the class.. I'm not totally against black spot susceptible roses, but I'm definitely being more mindful of it.

Desertgarden, I am looking forward to the pictures if you can get some!! I wasn't expecting anyone to have vicomtesse! Please note any fragrance if you remember, although I know that depends on the age of the rose and the person's nose who's smelling it ;)

Chris from NJ knows a lot about growing Old Garden roses in your zone, his yard is filled with beautiful blooms during the growing season. I hope he sees this thread. I have a bare root Curly Pink coming this spring.

hey summer, thanks! Yes Chris is very helpful :) What attracted you to curly pink?

Hi Michael. Congratulations on being a nursing student! When are you finished? I (hopefully) will graduate in December of this year! Busy times. I ordered Richards Rose from cool roses last year. I will see if I can find pictutes. Have you considered la reine or John Hopper? They might be a bit hardier, but I can't comment on bs. I have both on order for spring.

Kelly, i had you in mind when I listed Richards rose! Please let me know any comments you have from your limited time with the rose! Pictures are GREATLY appreciated. How has disease resistance been thus far? Richards rose came highly recommended from Pam but I have so much pink already.. John Hopper is on my must have list, but I am hoping to find others to trade cuttings with later on in the season because I have a bunch of roses already that I know others want.. it's a great way to save some cash! Maybe we could trade cuttings eventually when you have enough budwood! I missed out on ordering John Hopper from rosepetals.. I already have La Reine and Barbara's Pasture rose (wish I skipped on La Reine since they are almost identical). I also ordered dames de chenonceau which i know you grow and planted Nahema last year. I can't get enough of the globular blooms!

I am in my second semester of nursing, I have 2 more to go and then I will have to get my bachelors after.. I'm just exhausted (as I'm sure you know). I have to be up for clinical at 6:30 tomorrow.. Mondays Mondays, Lol. I can't wait for you to graduate and report back to me how nursing is in the real world! :)

Oh wow thanks so much kelly, he's beautiful!! I read he was also very fragrant, did you remember?

Hi Michael, I have 3 subzero roses for 7-8-9 years, but I lost the tags. They were $3 each. I thought they were Curly Pink, but I am not sure, they might be Show Garden, so I ordered 1 Curly Pink and 2 Show Garden to find out. :-)

The BBG used to have a large bed of Curly Pink -- for years and years outside the Cranford Rose garden. They apparently had to get rid of it when funding was cut back. I guess they thought they could raise some money by showcasing, in a revolving manner, new roses produced by large nurseries. It is sad. They also had a big bed of Clytemnestra. Gone. Curly Pink is, well, curly -- that is, full and quilled. It is a Brownell rose -- bred to be tough and hardy. Member comments on Helpmefind are uniformly positive. It is technically a hybrid tea, but to me has a timeless appearance. I think you should go for it. Incidentally, I found this info by Shirley Hibbard on Vicomtesse in google books. He says it makes a good cut flower (I don't think the alleged "stiff habit" should put you off too much. Lots of good roses have stiff habits).

Michael - I don't grow any of the roses on your list, but even in zone 6b I'd be cautious about a climbing tea. I've successfully overwintered 5 or 6 tea roses here in zone 5 which I realize is a zone colder than yours technically, but these are all in my virtual zone 6 on the sunny side of the house. They need very careful protection with standing leaf bags around them all winter and even so they lose most if not all of their canes over the winter, even as mild a one as we just had. Teas don't really like that kind of pruning, but some of them will survive it (Maman Cochet is probably the most robust survivor). Some teas won't survive even with this maximum protection, and if so I can't fathom any of them climbing even under ideal conditions. In my yard, I break out the champagne if they reach knee height and also bloom, which is laughable in regions where teas really belong. You might get Lorenzo to survive in your zone but I'd lay considerable odds that it wouldn't climb for you.

None of this says not to try these roses, however, just that you can't take anything published from warmer zones to help you decide whether to try Lorenzo Pahissa or other teas. As MadGallica says, you have to experiment to know what will work for you, and don't let us dissuade you from something you really want to try. In general, most hybrid perpetuals are reasonably hardy for me and would be a good bet in zone 6. From what I hear in eastern climates, if a rose will blackspot it's liable to be problematic for you, so my input isn't all that valuable for you. I don't have Reine Victoria, but Mme. Isaac Periere is pretty disease free for me in my dry zone, though she's a once bloomer only for me and that only if she has surviving cane from the winter.

You might get a more reliable range of options if you asked about OGR roses and very double blooms in a separate thread, and broadened out beyond Angel Gardens. Pam is a sweetheart and has healthy strong plants, but I get discouraged looking at her listings and the ones from A Reverence for Roses since so many of them are just not sustainable in my cold climate, even for a zone pusher like me. We'll be happy if you hear of the feasibility of any of these roses however so that we can follow in your footsteps!

Cynthia

Monarda, What do you think about these? These are the ones I was talking about, are they Curly Pink? Or Show Garden?

I remember the botanic garden Curly Pink blossoms as being a conspicuously lighter, silvery pink, or rather the edges of the petals are lighter and the petals more "quilled" (rolled back), so you could see the contrast in color, to tell the truth, so I'd be inclined to say, no, your rose is probably not Curly Pink, though photos can often be inaccurate. Is your plant a climber?. Helpmefind says Show Garden is a climber. Curly Pink was a mannerly, spreading bush, at least as pruned in the BBG. Sigh, I think with regret of all the Brownell specimens they used to have.

http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.213306

I'd love to see photos of Vicomtesse D'Avesne,Too. I got it own-root from La Roseraie du Desert this past autumn. It's true, it's hard to find info on this as well as many another noisette and tea...