Here is the back of the house.

I would take out the bay window in a heartbeat. I assume the soffit over the peninsula will be removed and you are sure you have room for the island you want?

Two questions:

what is the distance from the sink window wall to the wall behind the desk?

can you sketch out the space with dimensions and label the rooms around it so we can throw out some layout ideas?

How deep is the bay?

Why not add regular size counterheight windows across that entire wall and not have the bay?

@nnie - it looks very nice now! That is a beautiful view. Since you have room, have you considered going out a little? Your layout reminded me of fouramblue's gorgeous kitchen. (Scroll down at the end for a picture of their exterior)

It is really lovely, oldbat2be, but I don't think that major construction like that is in our budget. We also have a finished patio in that location which we just put in five years ago so I wouldn't want to mess with it.

When people complete renovations such as the one you reference above, it would be wonderful to know what they spent on it. While the location of the work will change the price, I think it would serve as a good barometer for those of us still working on design.

practigal, that is what I am asking. Some people say don't ever remove a bay window and replace it with flat ones, but I want to hear arguments both ways.

benjesbride, here is the layout of our first floor. The kitchen layout is really dependent upon two things: 1) whether or not I switch out this window and line up cabinets underneath and 2) whether or not we can afford/want to remove a load bearing wall.

emilyam819, I have already removed the soffit, little by little, piece by piece. An island can fit but the size of it is dependent upon two things 1) whether or not I switch out this window and line up cabinets underneath and 2) whether or not we can afford/want to remove the load bearing wall here.

Based on a depth of 158", you can have a 42" deep island with seating, if you incorporate the shallow stud-bay pantry idea. Although a whole wall of windows would be amazing, I'd put the range between the existing windows, with chimney hood, and put the fridge on the short wall, near the pantries.

The dish hutch would have glass doors, with a drawer, or two, on the counter, for flatware. The work aisle is only 42", but the work spaces don't overlap, except at the trash pull-out. This is a rough layout, so cabinet widths are not included:

Additional thoughts: The fridge is close to incoming groceries from the garage, although it's farther from the family room than I'd like. The corner by the fridge would make a nice snack prep space.

The clean-up area is separate from the prep and cooking zones, therefore it would be easy for a helper to load and unload the DW, and gather dishes to set the able, without crossing the other work zones.

I think the large window is wide enough, that if you have sliders or double-hung sections on each side of the sink, you could have a pass-through on each side, to a serving counter on the patio.

Another option would be to combine the shallow pantry with a reach-in pantry, or step-in pantry, just inside the garage entry, or if the larger pantry is sufficient, skip the stud-bay pantry.

mama goose_gw zn6OH, thank you very much. The only issue with this concept is that the bay window that is shown (where you have the sink) is below counter height so we would definitely need to replace the bay with other windows. But I think doing so would really open up the kitchen to more layout possibilities.

Would you have any issues with the dishwasher being the first thing you see when entering the house and looking straight back?

If you have 158" from sink wall to dining room wall, you don't have to mess with the load bearing wall at all. 158" is perfect for an L shaped kitchen and island with seating. Just put the L of the kitchen across the back and powder room.

Put the fridge where the range is and put the range on the back wall flanked by two large windows. Clean up sink between range and fridge. Prep sink in the island.

It's not that big a deal to patch siding. Ten years ago we renovated a kitchen adding a large window and changing a slider to a swinging door. It really wasn't expensive in the whole scheme of things.

Whoever said you never get rid of a bay window is flat wrong. Especially a bay like you have. If someone has a historical home with an architecturally significant bay, of course.

Exactly, Mama! I I was typing when you posted. I don't like clean up sinks in full view, so I'd try to put it between range and fridge but that's just personal preference.

ETA: if your people are good about putting dirty dishes IN the sink, I think Mama's suggestion is the best. My people stack things on the counter next to the sink and I'm not confident I could re-train them. Seeing a pretty dish hutch from the entry hall would be so lovely plus it's convenient right next to the DW.

buehl, the bay is 19.5" deep.

You can get a paneled DW, and a deep apron sink to hide dishes--no one can see the dirty dishes in my sink until they are within 6 feet (my kids evidently never see them ;). As BB posted, the dish hutch with pretty glass doors, would be a nice focal point from the entry.

I drew the plan as I did, to take advantage of the existing window locations, but, if you are willing to change the window configuration, you can ease the clean-up zone to the right. The layout wouldn't be as efficient, because the zones overlap somewhat, and the DW opens against the island, but it's still workable. Prep sink could be switched with the trash pull-out.

With some re-framing of the wall between the kitchen and DR, you could make it symmetric, and open up that space more, since you would no longer have a table in the kitchen:

I would totally ditch the bay. We, again, are doing similar. Getting rid of a French door in favor of a counter height 54x48 window. No brainier.

Buehl it's beautiful, but I would not want to crawl over the sink.

I loved sitting in bay windows when I was a kid. My mother hated me in those windows....if you can't sit in it, why bother...?

Crawl over the sink??? I reach over it, I don't crawl over it.

I don't think I'd have been able to open double hung - and I'm assuming you mean on the sides, not the center.

Either way, screens will obstruct the view a bit.

In general, though, casement windows are less obstructive than double hung b/c the window is all one pane of glass, not two separated by the window frames.

You have such a pretty view. I wouldn't install any more mullioned windows. In fact, I'd see if I could remove the mullions on the window over the sink to remove that visual obstruction/clutter.

I put your kitchen in the planner--like I do--and I much prefer putting the clean up sink under a large casement window where the bay presently is. This would be a fantastic kitchen to work in. Bonus is that at a later phase, you could increase the width of the opening between the kitchen and dining room; you'd probably hang out in there a lot more if it was open.

Note that the center front of the prep sink is located approximately 9' from the center front of the refrigerator. This is the maximum distance recommended by the NKBA. I ignored this recommendation in our last kitchen reno and I lived to totally regret it.

benjesbride , your layout looks nice. The back run of cabinets is about 22' plus another 12' for the island and 5' next to the fridge. Is that a lot of linear feet of cabinets?

I like the idea of opening the dining room up and moving the entrance to the center at some point in time. Would love to do it right away, but I'm not sure what the rest is going to cost.

Our window guy is stopping by tomorrow to give us a price on replacing the bay with other indows (double-hung, casement or sliders). I know the new bay would be almost $3,900 so I am hoping for a quote that is much less than that.

I am also meeting with a KD tomorrow who, based upon our conversation, will most likely be proposing something like this photo. I am not sure what I think about it, but know that he has actual photos of other kitchens with a similar layout. What do you think? I still think the bay causes a problem.

I HATE walking around my peninsula and it is a lot shorter than the one shown. It is not a design I would embrace over an island design. I really like am intrigued by the solution offered of the sink in a shorter-window bay.

Oh boy. That peninsula is bananas. Don't let that bay window boss around your kitchen design. It's not that special. Replacing it with a picture window that shows off your view and patching the siding should not be that big of a deal. If the view is important to you all why not just install a picture window?

I like the really large picture window idea however there are structural issues especially if you have a second floor. But I still think a whole wall of smaller windows to give the entire kitchen dining area that view would be great. The view is the point, not the bay window.

buehl I could not imagine how you would be able to open those windows without getting up onto the countertop each time-but you must have casement crank windows?

If the picture window is the same width and same header height as the existing bay window, I don't think there would be any structural issues. This bay window just projects from the house like a garden window, apparently supported by two brackets.

You are correct, benjesbride. Keeping the same frame will not require structural work, only cosmetic. Our window guy was in today and will be sending us pricing next week. He said that sliders or double hungs will not cost as much as a new bay which is just under $4k. I am excited about the possibilities.

BTW, the KD I met with this morning is suggesting plans very similar to these pics. I am sort of disappointed. Just substitute my ugly bay for the patio door here. What do you think?

If you are changing out the window, I don't see why you would go with that kind of layout.

emilyam819, we won't be if the window fits into our budget. That is a big if.

I was just expecting something more attractive within the parameters we gave him. Now that I see an example of it, I like it even less than when he explained it to me.

I would much prefer the layouts that Mamma and Benjesbride did above. Hopefully, you will be able to address the structure and flow of the house. Your kitchen will be much improved for the changes.