I would flip the island layout, and put the DW closer to the DR entry, then the sink, and also flip the range run to move the range down toward the patio door. The sink would be off-center, but you'd have a better prep space.

If the MW drawer is next to the DR entrance and you want to keep it on that end, then just switch the range with the cabinet to the left.

Do you have a "2D" or overhead flat view? It's easier to see what you have and what you have to work with.

(See the Layout Help FAQ for more information: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/2767033/how-do-i-ask-for-layout-help-and-what-information-should-i-include)

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"The range side has no upper cabinets, wed prefer to be without them, just a hood and maybe some shelves"

If you have no upper cabinets flanking the hood, then be sure your hood is at least 6" wider than the cooking surface and at least 24" deep. Without upper cabinets, there's nothing to help the hood corral the steam, smoke, odors, etc. As steam, smoke, etc., rise, they expand to outside the width of the cooking surface. With upper cabinets, the cabinets help slow down the movement of the smoke, steam, etc., and allow the hood to capture and exhaust them. It's actually always recommended to have a hood this size, but it becomes even more important when (1) there are no upper cabs or (2) when the cooktop/range/hood are in an island or peninsula.

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Aisles...It appears you are measuring your aisles cabinet-to-cabinet. This is incorrect (don't feel bad - many professional KDs and GCs also make this mistake.) Aisles are measured to/from the items that stick out into the aisle the farthest - whether that's a counter or appliance or other item. So, in your case, your aisles are at least 3" narrower than you think they are. Looking at your labels, your actual aisles are too narrow.

What is the distance b/w the island's counter edge and the refrigerator? It looks narrow, but it's difficult to know for sure without a 2D view.

Is there seating at the island? It doesn't look like it, but if there is, then it's even worse.

Prep Zone workspace...how much counterspace is there on the non-DW side of the sink? That's going to be your Prep Zone. The bare minimum recommended is 36", but 42" or more is much better - especially since it's on the end of an island.

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I don't think I'd flip the DW. Right now, the Prep Zone is easily accessed from the refrigerator. If you flip the DW, the Prep Zone moves to the other end of the island and the island becomes a barrier b/w the refrigerator and Prep Zone ("barrier island").

What is the distance from the island to the fridge? When the fridge door is fully opened will it hit the island (and get dented)?

on one end or other of the island I would create an extended circular overhang for at least some seating. At the pantry end, decrease depth of pantry to allow this[pantry looks cave like anyway]. At fridge end, perhaps remove fridge and place in the pantry spot, putting shallower pantry in that fridge corner for seating at this end of island. Have you assessed exactly how much storage you need. In your space here, I would not favor the random corners utilizing storage as well as the oversized pantry. WHY? you have a wonderful opportunity with the visuals from front entry straight on with a wall of windows..as well traffic and socialization can so wonderfully be centered in this kitchen with living /dining/and outside folk converging . I think seating would embellish an island configuration. I think your plan is okay, but not the best for your space. This can be so much more creative, I don't think you are there yet. First thing is go back to drawing board and calculate more carefully your true storage needs. The range wall would be used for wall cabinets, to my thinking, as the "open shelf" concept is not anything compared to the wall of windows....use the wall for as much storage behind doors as it can handle.

Good point about the DW, buehl, but I was thinking that the dishes
could be stored in the pantry cabinet beside the DR door, since there
will be no uppers on the range wall. That would make it easier for a
helper to unload the DW, and set the table in the DR, while the cook is
busy in the work aisle. Where would you store dishes? In drawers to the
left of the sink? Across from the DW, in drawers, would be a good
location, but with the narrow aisles, the drawers couldn't be extended
more than ap 17", with the DW door and basket extended. Some things
could be stacked on the counter until the DW door is closed, then put in
the drawers, or kept on open shelves to the left of the hood, if the OP chooses to use them. A helper could carry dishes around behind the island,
without interfering with the cook.

GW discussions--dishes in drawers

MamaGoose - I know. I wrestled with that same issue when I read your assessment. I thought about it for awhile and finally concluded that I would rather have easier access to the refrigerator from the Prep Zone - I figured you can always yell at (or give the "evil eye") to someone trying to get through - whether setting the table or in general.

It's far, far from ideal. I'd like to see actual measurements of the space b/f giving any other advice. Without more information, it's tough to give really useful help.

It's been over 18 hours since Jomonster8u posted this question - hopefully we'll hear from him/her soon. Until then, I think we need to sit tight and wait for more information. (If there's no response in a day or so, then it's probably time to move on. We've had quite a few drive-bys lately!)

[Anyone else miss the actual date & time of posts? This "XX hours ago" is so primitive - as if Houzz can't keep detailed track of the time!]

Yes, it was much easier to reference 'your post at 1:39PM.'

So right! Now, the time changes all the time so there's no way to point to a specific post!

thanks everyone! Sorry for the delay, Ive got 2 under 5 and neither one likes to sleep through the night consistently........

Heres a better picture for your critique. The reasoning for eliminating more wall cabs was 1) because Im short at 5 3 and i can't reach anything up there anyway, 2) because we have a walk in pantry with shelving all around, and 3) because I wanted to try and eliminate the sort of tunnel effect we have going on right now, with cabs all over that range wall. It makes the room feel more narrow.

As far at the opening on the dining room side, it used to be a pocket door and we opened it up. It makes it so much more functional, and it fits an 5ft round table for 6 very nicely. It is literally right there so Im not sure we would use seating in the cooking space, especially because we have so much room at the rear of the kitchen. I didn't want to extend the island longer than the back patio doors by adding a table for seating there, but i thought i could always put in a breakfast type nook or somewhere to sit back there, especially since the windows prevent cabinetry.

The bottom wall in the diagram is tricky. Originally I had planned to close off the opening, as currently there is pocket door there too that we opened, so that we could use the wall for the sink, DW, and fridge. I don't have specs on it but I'm adding a picture of what i was thinking initially before things changed.

As you guys said, having the nice view when you walk in and being able to see right through to the back of the house is appealing. At the same time, I don't want to make the mistake of taking down TOO much wall. I am fully open to suggestions about that wall. The bottom right corner, which is in the middle of the L-shaped room is very structural so that cannot change. The opening, if we even keep one, is not. Thanks again!

heres the previous plan. That is the foyer wall closed.. I like the use of space from the dining room entry that is unobstructed without dividing the area, but this is a really rough idea from earlier on. Im thinking that something like this might prevent people from trying to take a shortcut through the cooking area, but it sacrifices the foyer and some of the living room view.

Also, Im not sure how I feel about walking in and seeing my whole kitchen. Is that weird, or not any weirder than walking into my living room..? lol

Thanks everyone, I appreciate the advice!

Can you move the pantry?

Maybe something like this.

You'd have more room for an island if the pantry is moved, but you can consider a peninsula instead, to avoid traffic passing in front of the range.

Just an idea.

Wow thanks so much sena. We have something like that now but the pantry is as before and theres a wall oven on the foyer side and the range position is a cooktop. We use the yard a lot and it becomes a bottleneck back there,which is why we want to change it. Sometimes we use it for our main entry and i bring he groceries in that way, and its a long way to walk around. But thank you its a great layout just not functional for us and all the stuff i almost always seem to be lugging, children included... lol

What do you guys think of this? Don't mind the upper cabinet above the sink area, its for above the refridgerator/pantry with some tweaking. I put it there for the price list because I couldn't get it to nudge over. Thanks!

I like this if you can put a prep sink in the island. Right now you have a fine clean up area but not enough room for prep next to a sink. But lots of space on the island for that!

I agree with lharpie--a prep sink on the island would give you a very good layout and nice prep space. A trash pull-out on the corner to the left of the prep sink could be shared among all zones--clean-up, prep, and cooking.

jomonster8u & sena1 - what programs did y'all use for the layout?