lukki - sometimes I think it's better to say something now rather than to lose my cool and say too much.

VedaBeeps - that's how I feel. saying something will change nothing.

Pick your battles and let this slide...

Moonie, those who recommend saying nothing may very well be right. I was thinking speaking up might reduce some of your stress levels. But everything's a trade-off, and only you can weigh the pros and cons.

There's always humor, though. If he knows you have a good sense of humor, a funny response to his criticism may be all the de-fusing you need.

Moonie, for me it's all about self esteem, yours, not his.

I get that he's obviously feeling inadequate in some way and/or that it's important to know when to pick your battles. However why is it your responsibility to take his abuse? And technically, that's what that is.

If you didn't care or it didn't bother you then that would be one thing. But your posting about it shows that it does bother you. So, why should you have to let it go?

Being assertive isn't the same thing as being rude and there are nice ways to express that his criticism is not appreciated or unwanted. Humor is good or just using a tone in your voice that isn't threatening. My point is, is that because you've never said anything, he thinks it's okay. He will never stop until you tell him to, better to do it now than at a time when he's really gone to far. KWIM?

ETA: he doesn't do it in front of your husband, why? Because he KNOWS your husband wouldn't tolerate it. So again, why should you have to?

As Eleanor Roosevelt said, No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. Just because he's being rude/ annoying doesn't mean she's taking it personally or feels devalued by it. To me the OP reads as annoyed but certainly not in any way hurt.

Moonie- I am so sorry, it's exhausting having a nonstop critic.

Well, Veda I guess it's all about perspective and the experiences we've each had as individuals, right?

With the tables turned, I have an in-law who is boorish beyond description. Completely lacking in good manners and good judgement. Why? Because they are too self-focused. I have at times had to say to this adult "Please don't eat with your fingers and then lick them while others are at the table", or interrupt them when they're speaking to say "You know, that's really none of your business". Should I be more tactful? No, as far as I'm concerned, my house, my rules. And when elsewhere with this person, I avoid eating with or near them. The experience is disgusting, like sitting next to a homeless person given food after not eating for a week.

There's no justification for a guest to have bad manners.
Tactless criticism is also exhausting. But these situations can be
nuanced. Forgetting his inexcusable reactions to what you do, how is it
that you have to TRY to remember to not mispronounce words? And how is
it that you don't remember? This person's reactions are wrong, and how they make you feel is also wrong, but there is a message to learn from.

Have you told your husband how you feel?

Well, just as I'm ready to respond, I can't let Elmer's comment side.

If I saw a homeless person that hadn't eaten in a week, I would not find his fervor, disgusting.

Sorry, that's all I took from that post.

I'm sorry, maybe I used the wrong illustration. A starving person can eat or act when given food however they want, there's no reason to think of anyone else. Someone else who is not in that circumstance needs to be a bit more considerate of others, that's what manners are all about and what the person I was describing is lacking. That was the part of the picture I was trying to convey.

hmmm.....your BIL probably doesn't have much of a sense of humor. But I wonder how many mispronounced words could be stuffed into once sentence...he wouldn't know where to start!!!! I seen it happen before. ;-) Hang in there, sounds like tough company.

In most circumstances, I'd say stand up for yourself - your house, your rules, and you have a right to certain expectations of how you will be treated. But in this case what is standing out to me is 'DH has wanted a relationship with his half brother all his life and has only begun this relationship'. You're annoyed, you don't sound deeply wounded to me. When your DH feels on firmer ground with his brother and if it looks like he will be a regular part of your lives, you could then point out some grievances, keep your sense of humor in the meantime. Come here and vent, we'll be around while he's visiting ;0)

"Oh, that's interesting". Then, smile vaguely and hold his gaze until he averts his eyes ;-)

And while you're at the liberry, borrow him (LOL) a copy of Miss Manners or Dale Carnegie's How to Win Friends and Influence Enemies. I'm sorry you have to entertain him.

Man what a pain. Kudos to you to be willing to hold you're tongue for your husband's sake. It's there any reason you couldn't just look at him and say politely "please don't do that anymore". And if he asks what, then politely tell him, "please don't correct me or tell me how to do something". And say it everytime he does it to you.

I agree with asking him to stop it and expressing very clearly what you mean. That puts the ball back in his court. There is the slightest possibility that he is just not aware of how demeaning and annoying he sounds. I often wonder if recording and playing back a conversation like that would help the speaker 'hear' how they sound to others.

You could always turn the tables and ask him, "Does the way I speak or pronounce words bother you? I notice that you seem to correct me when I speak".

Let him listen to himself explain exactly why he feels the need to correct you. Once he's aware that you are very aware, he might think twice.

We have a friend who is a bit passive-aggressive. She'll watch me doing something and say 'that's interesting, that isn't the way I would do that.' Meaning, of course, that I'm wrong. My standard response is 'just because it isn't your way doesn't mean it's wrong.' She always quickly backs down.

And she never, ever does it to my DH.

I'm pretty sure I couldn't hold my tongue with your BIL.

Aok reminded me that my ex-husband would do that. He watch me mash potatoes, make dinner etc and he'd say "I'd have done this or that way, etc."

He did this about 3 times and I informed him that he could do the cooking from then on, and he did.

Thank you, Elmer. It seemed impossible you could be that insensitive so I thought you may want an opportunity to clarify.

No, I have not actually told DH that I'm annoyed by some of the BIL's "corrections". But we have both shared a couple of chuckles over some of the things he has said. I would just like to give DH the chance to get to know his brother on a more personal level without the influence of my irritation. It's my guess that he will, in time, see for himself should that sort of behavior continue.

In my family we do things differently than in yours, Elmer. We are tolerant of each other, respect each other and if the need arises, raise an eyebrow and move on. If I value another family member enough to have them at my table, I would never put myself above them on the "manner meter" and correct the way that they eat. I have a strong stomach and doubt that even the grossest table manners would make me retch.

As someone said, I'm more annoyed by the BIL, not had my self esteem shattered. My biggest worry would be getting so put out about it that I would flip my top. Could happen! But probably not. :)

Elmer, you asked why is it I have to TRY not to mispronounce words. Well, because those words have been brought to my attention and I do like to speak correctly, when I remember. WHY don't I remember? Obviously it doesn't mean enough for me to NOT forget! lol

dedtired - you got me to thinking. liberry... I think I say that! ;)

I say woof for wolf unless I purposely pause first and pronounce it slowly. I have no idea why. DH lovingly teases me about it and says I shouldn't put a new "Wolf" range in my future dream kitchen if I can't pronounce it. I think I'll go with a Viking instead :)

I also have a hard time properly pronouncing a few simple words like roof and iron. Again, no idea why. I'm an attorney who spends all day speaking and pronouncing difficult words, and am normally very articulate, so it's not for a lack of education or practice :)

Maybe it stems from my early childhood years raised in a different part of the country. It doesn't bother me but I wouldn't like to be corrected unless it was just in fun.

One pet peeve for me is sandwich pronounced as sangwich. A few adult family members say this but I keep my mouth shut and don't correct!

I'm moving to Tennessee from California in just a few months so I'm sure I'll be learning an entirely new way to pronounce my words soon enough. Maybe my southern roots will reemerge and I'll get my drawl back :)

My dear Mom told me to say "did you enjoy saying that because I didn't enjoy hearing it". LOL I never did take that advice.

Sorry he irks you. If that's the ONLY thing you don't like about him, you're lucky.

Is this man married? (Why do I think he's a loner? LOL)

It could be that he is anxious to be 'superior' to his half-brother, and running down brother's wife is one way to do it.

We'd need to know more about the back story here to discover his reasoning.

I do my best to overlook mispronounced words. If I know what they mean. I do try!

Fried chicken? 10 minutes per side when it's legs. ;)

Best to respond assertively from the start and every time. Discussions of positive assertion describe techniques used for different situations. For instance a basic one I remember is replying with "Yes, you probably do think that (or feel that way etc.)". This puts it back on them, maintains (asserts) your own position.

It is important to always deliver such lines with a pleasant tone, one without a hint of anger. Where even this statement ("you probably do think that") might be considered too cool for particular individuals (people who are supposed to be intimates) there are other approaches you can find presented. People even teach classes about it, I took one myself in college.

*high five-in' tnfarmhouse* I knew I wasn't the only one! :)

chisue - he was married once but was divorced years ago. I don't know if he ever sees his ex or how often he sees his two girls. They must be in their 40's at the least.

We are only just getting to know him. I actually enjoy listening to the conversations DH has with him. DH tells him all about their father and other siblings and he tells DH about the fathers side of the family. He was raised by his mother but in the same town with them and spent time with DH's grandmother.

BIL never went to high school but he has a sharp mind. He has said that he reads everything he can get his hands on, and we have witnessed that. He completes the newspaper crossword puzzle every time he is here. This is a different newspaper than the one he gets at home. According to him, our crossword puzzles are easier because the ones he has done here doesn't have those old world words. And this guy has proved he's no dummy in many ways.

Another irritant would be political talk. DH won't be baited and sometimes I just go outside. Sometimes BIL seems very judgemental and opinionated. Everything he says is said with such vehemence. He has a lot of passion on certain subjects. Unless I'm wrong, it's hard work for him to be pleasant when opinions differ. Time will tell, though. 2 more days before he gets here! :)

He hasn't arrived yet! Oh, I thought you were almost finished the visit. Well, pack up a lot of patience and good luck. You know that we have your back and if you need to vent you know that you can do it here and you will be supported.

I have a BIL just like yours.. Can't stand him. He thinks he is so much better then anyone one else!! We had words a couple years ago and I really let him have it!! I flat out told him he messed with the wrong family this time around!! Stay the hell out of ours!! I no longer have to ever see him since we no stopped having the family Christmas.. That's another whole story.. It's funny because we now go to the church he attended years ago.. They never liked him either..

I have a family member like this. I turn my face away from him when he corrects me and pretend I never even heard him. I see others do the same to him. ( OK sometimes I have a little smile when I give him this snub ) I hope someday he gets the hint.

I get the picture that he lived -- and was educated -- less well than his half-brother. He seems to need to *prove* that, despite that, he is not inferior. It's hard to be the odd one out while your father has a 'whole' family with another woman. I hope he and your DH can get past all that and become friends as adults. We all have 'that little kid' inside!

Many years ago, in a discussion group, I was laughed at for 'mispronouncing' a word that I was actually saying correctly. We were discussing something that veered into a mathematical concept, and I mentioned I couldn't contribute any further, saying "unfortunately, math has never been my forte." I pronounced it like 'fort' and one of them quickly said "apparently neither is English, because it's pronounced forte." (rhyming with for-tay) This elicited a good chuckle from everyone.

I knew I hadn't mispronounced the word, because forte (changing the silent e to an 'ay' sound) refers to a term in music, and not in reference to a 'strong suit.' But this was prior to computers and we had no dictionary on hand, so I couldn't convince any of them that I was in fact not mispronouncing the word. It's just that forte has become of those words that is mispronounced so frequently, that the incorrect version is now deemed acceptable, even in dictionaries, which refers to these words as a 'skunked term.'

I never correct people who mispronounce a word, but it sure was aggravating to be mocked when I actually was pronouncing something correctly, lol!

My 20 year old daughter just ended a relationship with a boy she's been seeing for 5 years..but he was always correcting Amiee if she mispronunced a word. She ignored him for a very long time than one day she looked at him and said...sooo what, very sarcastically. He stopped. But what I find ironic is this boy has a speech impediment, so many of his words are mispronunced. And before you say but the poor kid can't help it..yes he could, he has a tongue tie that would take one snip and than a speech training class, all of which his insurance would pay. He refuses the snip.

I also thought that you'd been enduring this fellow for a few days, at this point.

Sorry that you're enduring so much bother from this bother-in-law, moonie.

Maybe you could refer to him in that fashion, and if he objects, just say that you figured to call a spade a spade .... rather than just a garden tool.

ole joyful

There are some words that have two pronunciations and either one is acceptable.

Examples: Caribbean, either, neither, etc. The preferred pronunciation changes with location.

I was taught that last syllable of "Illinois" should be pronounced "noi", however, my dictionary also gives "noiz", Its a French spelling of a word whose roots are of Algonquian origin.

Hey picky, maybe they were used to playing a musical instrument, they'd only heard forTAY? Yeah, that's it.

Oh gosh, I'm sorry! lol No, he isn't here yet. You all must be detecting residual irritation from his last visit. Normally he would not be back in such a short time but he is helping DH with some projects to complete before it gets too cold. I'm glad these projects are not in his area of expertise or I would be afraid DH would not be taking the lead. :)

Maybe this thread has helped a little. I'm starting to feel kind of mean in my thoughts. Pickyshopper gave me an idea to 'test' BIL with the word "forte" and I was going to be ready with an audio pronunciation. But, I'm not going to do that. I'm already feeling somewhat guilty. If I get too annoyed, I just may have to throw in the term bother-in-law. Thanks, OJ! It's your fault! :) (BTW, I am one that says "forTAY") lol

I'm glad mamapinkys daughter left that guy. It could have been years of misery!

jemdandy - I was born and raised in the Caribbean and I say it both ways.

Fort vs fortay or ant vs ont for aunt- Sure. Many words have more than one accepted pronunciation, often varying geographically. Like the 50s song cited above - tomato, tomahto, etc.

But to say woof, nucular, subsiderary, ax (for ask) - Nope.

Elmer - would I be wrong guessing that you would be one to correct mispronounceds words? ;)

Yes, it's mostly not something I do. I won't say never-ever, but rarely. Certainly never in public.

In my working career, I needed to be very attentive to the impression I gave in meetings, with groups and dealing with lots of other people. Mispronunciations and difficulty in communications are high on the list of things that can lead to diminished confidence and making a poor impression for someone in a professional context. When someone working for me had such problems, it was my responsibility to help them improve and often we'd hire outsiders as coaches.

But outside of work, in my personal life, not so much.

Thank you, Elmer. The question bordered on offensive but I'm glad that I asked. You are sometimes hard to read.

I try to be tactful and of course polite because I know I am direct. I'm not always successful. My comments here and also in the real world tend to NOT be indirect or circuitous. I see the world and people in it in shades of gray and not black and white, and that's something about me that people often misjudge.

I believe that to be true of you, Elmer, and the question I asked you would not be one I would have asked most people.

But, you must know that sometimes you ruffle feathers. Personally, I adore you. Except when you irritate me. :)

Ha, well then I'll pull up my jeans after that half-kick in the butt and say "Thanks!".

:)

If you know what I mean, SHUTUP! If I say may-oh-naise, suga, or saL-mon. and you would like something on your sandwich or something on your cereal or some fish and you know what I mean, don't make a stuck up point about it. I grew up in the south a long time ago and I have an accent. (By the way saL-mon is an accepted but not common way of saying the word.) If I ask you to dinner, I mean the main meal in the middle of the day. Think Christmas dinner, Sunday dinner. Lunch is a light meal eaten at work or school. Supper is a smaller meal eaten at the end of the day. Unless someone asks, it is very, very, very rude to correct someones way of saying a word.

Yep!

There's another angle to what you're talking about, sherry.

Successful communication is all about expressing your thoughts in a way the listener(s) will understand. Whether speaking to small children, or foreigners with limited English skills, or people from other regions, or to lay persons about a technical subject using technical language, speakers may often need to adjust what they say and how they say it so that the meaning is clear for those on the receiving end.

Regional accents are fun and colorful, the small pronunciation differences you mention are just that. The dinner thing is less clear. Whether it's due to regional usage or something else, if you know a phrase or a word might be unclear or misunderstood by someone, the monkey is on your back to be clear in what you say, not on the listener's back to try to figure out what you mean.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/why-do-people-in-the-1299468681216054.html?ref=gs

Yes, if I don't know you well, I will say 1pm dinner, ect. It's my grown kids that drive me crazy. They KNOW when I mean, they just want to be...........

I live in an area that has a very wide group of all sorts of people from all areas of the world. Some have excellent English, some have very little, and some read it, but don't speak it. I have NEVER had any problem understanding them or they me. ( Even if they pointed and I pointed and they got the watch they wanted and we rang it up one hundred dollar bill at a time. Repeated 10 times. For a $30 watch.