I did not mention, the four that I found at the nursery later after my earlier started cuttings had just begun to root. One of the four I purchased at the nursery looked like it was struggling at the time I purchased it. It clearly had a thcker trunk and was about 8 inches tall. I brought it home and transplanted it to a 3 gallon pot. It too has been growing under the oak tree. Now it has abundant and nice dark leaves, and its main leader trunk is about 1/4th inch thick. All summer long its flower buds just dried up. I think that might have been due to the amount of shade where it was located. when I purchased that larger one, I also found three more that were in 4 inch pots. Their trunks are about 1/8th inch thick now, and have developed lots of dark green leaves and has bloomed a little under the dappled afternoon shade of the oak tree. At Ken's advice I took those 4 young potted starts out and set them just south of some taller azaleas, west of a still young camelia, and a few feet just east of my house. It seems reasonable that they will survive the winter if I dump them out of the pots to plant and over winter them in that location. But I am still concerned about the rooted cuttings that have been staying alive in 6 inch pots under my oak tree. They look healthy now, and I know I need to take them out from under so much shade. The fact that their main leader trunks are only about 1/32 or just slightly thicker, makes me doubt that they can survive our outside winter condtions, even when they go dormant. I do not have a greenhouse, but should I find someone with one, who is willing to over winter these 4 smallest ones in their greenhouse for me?

You have good wind blocks under that deck so that will help, Tammy. I get my burlap at Home Depot or Lowes usually but I think most garden centers carry it. You may have to ask them for it though. I literally beg, borrow and steal bags of leaves from all my neighbors in the fall! We have 5 big trees and I still need extra. I go out early on trash day and drag the bags over from my neighbor's lawns. Two of my neighbors now just bag their leaves and put them on my lawn instead of theirs, lol! But if leaves aren't available you can also use bagged bark mulch. It's way more expensive though. If you go that route make sure you bag it back up next spring to reuse. You could also use straw or hay. One of them has seeds, and I don't remember which, so you may get more weeds in the spring but they do work well as insulation. You want to wait until they are completely dormant before you put them in storage. And the ideal is to keep them completely dormant until you are past any freezing temps at night in the spring. The worst thing is for them to go through repeated freeze and thaws during the winter and especially the spring. The most roses I ever lost, 37, was during the big Easter freeze in April of 2007. I had just taken all the pots out of winter storage and they were all leafing out when the temps fell drastically for a weekend. Thankfully, Alan came up with a plan for the pots. He wheeled his tractor out of the shed and we put as many pots as we could in and he set up a couple of lamps with 100 watt bulbs in them for added warmth. I only lost 3 or 4 potted roses that we couldn't fit in the shed. All the rest of my losses were roses planted in the ground even though I had NOT yet taken off their winter protection! I don't recommend the cones for a couple of reasons. First, you have to really cut the rose back severely in the fall to get them on and I don't prune in the fall. You are going to get winter die back no matter what. If you cut them to 12 inches in October by April you'll be cutting them to 6 or less. Second, unless you cut the tops off for air circulation (which sort of destroys their integrity) they create the perfect breeding ground for fungus to grow. Particularly in the spring when conditions are very damp, the sun is getting higher up and days are longer and the temps are warming up. I understand that you disagree with me about raising up the pots, Michaelg. But I will stand by my opinion. It's not to protect them from freezing. I want them to freeze and STAY dormant until the temps will stay consistently above freezing. The freeze and thaw yo-yoing is deadly. It's for moisture retention. Desiccation kills them quickly too. That's why I water during the winter. They're asleep, not dead, and still require some water. How many of you have a glass of water on the table beside your bed because you get thirsty during the night? When I didn't put them up off the cement the pots would be bone dry with nice damp rings in the cement under them. And I lost roses. I do not raise them up where they are on the dirt. The dirt retains it's own moisture and does not pull water from the pots so it isn't a problem. BTW, I do winter my tree rose inside the shed, with the tractor, every year and have had no problems with the gasoline fumes affecting the rose.

Thank you Bruce and Taryn for your help, it is much appreciated. My concern now is the lack of a sunny window in a cool room. On the south side of our house we have a sunroom, one window in the bathroom, and one window in the bedroom. The house is pretty evenly heated, sunroom ofcorse gets warmer on a sunny day. We have windows in the rest of the rooms with sun exposure from all angles. The basement has windows all around (raised ranch) but we have a woodstove down there, so it is cozy warm there, too. Will the seeds and babies be ok in windows other than a southern exposure, and in a place that is not cool, but 70ish at a pretty constant temp? Guess I will just have to do the best I can, and hope it is the right thing, what are your suggestions? Thanks again, Joan

I know summer is still in full swing, but I know I'll forget to ask later on. So while I still remember and have time, I wanted to know if anyone stored used potting soil in a root pouch/smart pots on a fire escape over winter. I would like to reuse the soil and from reading online here and elsewhere most people seem to leave the soil in the container used outside. The problem is I used unglazed terra cotta containers which I know I'll have to store indoors to prevent damage from the cold. Since I planned to purchase a root pouch/smart pot to use next year, I figured I could purchase one now, store the soil in it and have it ready for use come spring. My questions are: If using a root pouch/smart pot, did you cover the top from the elements or do anything in particular to keep pests out? Is it possible to add used coffee grounds/mulch/etc to the soil to compost over winter in these conditions? Is it advised in this case or foolhardy because of potential vermin and pests? Anything in particular to know or consider? Thanks.