Agree with you, Carol, that clay is good stuff ..rich in magnesium & calcium which are co-factors for potassium. Potting soil is low in magnesium & calcium, both get leached out with rain.

Wish I had some to add every year!! But at least I didn't let them throw it away!!

Carol

You are welcome Nate. I am so happy that I could be of any help...

Carol: You did a wonderful thing by keeping the clay. It will be really handy for you not only for bees but for so many other things I am sure.

Here is my personal categorization of roses in my garden, on my personal observations last year and this year... In Islamabad, roses perform the best in spring (March - April) and fall (Oct-Dec). Hot dry summers (mid May to middle of July) and monsoon (mid July to end Aug) are difficult periods for roses. In summers, temps may rise up to 115*F on days and would generally stay in the range of 105*F. In monsoon, temps generally stay between 85 to 100*F but it rains a lot and in one month, there is around 24 to 25 inches of rain. Also, on few odd days when it doesn't rain and temps might shoot up to 105*F with over 75% humidity most of the time.

First thing, roses do not perform well during summers and monsoon. They are at their best in spring and fall for sure. However, some of them still do reasonably good and still add to the beauty of our garden, though not as well as in spring / fall. Such roses keep blooming though bloom size is relatively small and fragrance is less. I have named them as category A roses. Then there are few that lie between reasonably good and bad performance shades.... doing well for a while and performing miserably sometimes. Bloom size is generally small but the keep blooming. These have been categorized as Category B roses. And then there are roses that perform bad. Either they don't bloom during this period and if they do, they produce small sized single petaled miserable looking blooms with no fragrance. These are Cat C roses.

CATEGORY A - CULTIVARS THAT PERFORMED REASONABLY WELL IN HOT SUMMERS AND MONSOON
Crown Princess Margareta, William Morris, Glamis Castle, The McCartney Rose, Paul Neyron, Rose de Rescht, The Dark Lady, St. Swithun, Alan Titchmarsh, Graham Thomas, Golden Celebration, Iceberg, Burgundy Iceberg, Casino, Ebb Tide, St Ethelburga, Westerland, Blue for You, (please note that most of the roses are DA / OGRs)

CATEGORY B - CULTIVARS THAT PERFORMED BETWEEN REASONABLY WELL AND POOR
The Prince, Chartreuse de Parme, Jubilee Celebration, Pat Austin, Gruss an Teplitz, Lady Emma Hamilton, Tradescant, Princess Alexandra of Kent, Doris Tysterman, Winchester Cathedral, L.D.Braithwiate, Julia Child, Fragrant Cloud, Violette Parfumee, Bronze Star, Shocking Blue, Rhapsody in Blue, Gold Medal, Fredrick Mistral, Mirandy, The Alnwick Rose, Jude the Obscure, Just Joey, Tom Brown, La France, Oklahoma, Black Prince, Scentimental, Belley Epoque, Augusta Luise, Hafiz Zaman, Parveen Shakir, Tipu Sultan, Secret, Liv Tyler, Crimson Glory, Papa Meilland, French Lace, Maurice Utrillo, Fourth of July, Evelyn May, Alexander, Gentle Hermione, Graaf Lennart, (a mix of DA, Hybrid Tea, Floribunda)

CATEGORY C - CULTIVAS THAT EITHER DID NOT BLOOM AFTER SPRING OR PERFORMED POORLY OR BOTH
Gertrude Jekyll, Benjamin Britten, Sharifa Asma, Teasing Georgia, Double Delight, Troika, The Painter, Sheila's Perfume, Mary Rose, Condisa de Sastago, Pink Perfume, Bajazzo, Signature, Maria Shriver, Chippendale, Rouge Royale, Papi Delbard, Alec's Red, Heritage, Charlotte, Spirit of Freedom, Jasmina, Abracadabra, Black Bacara, Fragrant Charm, Deep Secret, Michelangelo, Fragrant Plum, Nahema, Golden Showers,(mostly hybrid tea roses with few DAs)

This is a compilation based on personal experience in a climate that is quite different. I wonder it could be of any use to other members..... I would be very happy if it is

best regards

Wow!!! A lot of people on the regular forum would like this info. Great observations!!

Thanks, Khalid - I'm glad I saved the clay. I will have very happy mason bees next spring. :)

Carol

Khalid: Thanks for a fantastic list of which roses do well in hot climate, and medium-range, and worse category. I agree with everything you wrote .. a few in Category C is listed as "partial shade" in David Austin Catalog: Benjamin Britten, Teasing Georgia, Sharifa Asma.

Nahema for me was the biggest waterhog (besides Pat Austin). Dark-red roses are known to prefer partial shade, same with orange and yellow roses. Broze Star was a water-hog for me, did well in soaking wet clay & alfalfa-pellets, but died on a dried hill over the winter. French Meilland roses: Liv Tyler, Rouge Royal prefer hot & wet climate.

Lots of folks complain about "blind shoot" and stinginess in Rouge Royal, but thanks to Anna in CA, I trace the blind shoot problem to boron-deficiency. A tiny bit of boron can induce blooms, rather than just blind-shoot (with bunched-up leaves).

Double-Delight is my best bloomer in hot weather (over 90 F) .. also the best bloomer at the rose park at over 100 F or 38 C. Double Delight has a higher need for iron, same with Oklahoma. I give it DD high-boron and iron via red-lava-rock. It was a good bloomer in potting soil (fertilized with 20% iron blackstrap molasses) .. and even better bloomer with boron & iron (red-lava-rock).

You amaze me, Straw, with your experimentation and knowledge. You could write a book, easily!

Hey how are things going with you and your daughter?

Carol

Carol: My daughter is a pickiest-eater !! She complained every time I make Salmon for dinner. My kid just wants hot-dog, steak, and pizza !!

Straw: Thanks for the information about the requirement of various roses. Very valuable info indeed and I will definitely work on this but right now I have a much bigger problem in hand. Strangely what I think is a big problem for me is a blessing for my wife. I have been offered a new house by my company which is much better constructed. Has expensive stone work, wood work and nicely constructed attached bathrooms with all four bedrooms. My wife is getting crazy about that house but if I take it, I will have to shift soon. That means I will have to shift over 50 roses planted in ground during this weather when it rains one day and the temp shoots up to 98 degrees the next day.

I will have to take out large sized root balls making sure the roots are not exposed. This will take lot of effort / labour and perhaps quite a bit of money too as I will have to hire few people to do the job yet there will be no guarantee that all my roses will survive. I would have left some of the roses in this house but they intend doing some reconstruction in the place where the roses are planted so I can't leave them to be killed. But there is a plus point too that the new house has much better sunlight in the morning and almost none after midday which is ideal in my climate. So far it seems that I will lose the debate and we will have to shift. By end August, it will stop raining and temps will again rise for a month or so and will then come down in October again. But this one month of hot weather will come at a very critical time when the newly shifted roses would have been trying to reestablish themselves at a new place. So...... I am a worried man. Any ideas how can I move my roses safely? Any suggestions.....

Good luck, Khalid!! I think some Austin roses are easy from cuttings--the ones that are offered 'own root', see https://www.davidaustinroses.com/american/Advanced.asp?PageId=2295 --which presumably means they are easy from cuttings and don't have to be budded.

I've heard pet misters make good impromptu mist for rose cuttings.

Nate

Khalid: I moved plenty of roses in my life, my Mom also dug up plenty of perennials. Here are some tips:

1. Dig them up evening time, after 4 pm .. that's when the sun is doing down.
2. One day before digging up, water them so the leaves & stem soak up moisture. But do not water them right before digging up .. the soil will be too wet. Too wet means root-damage. You want 1 day of watering ahead, and leave a drying-period for the soil to be slightly damp, but not soaking wet.
3. Old bed-sheets, old T-shirts, or wet-rags can be used wrap roses' roots. After wrapping them up, the inside stem can be watered.

I often mail rootings through the mail .. 4 days in transit. For small roots I get old socks, cut them open, dampen with water, wrap roses' roots with wet fabric, then put in large plastic bags, but I leave the top open so it's breathable.

Wet newspaper wrapped tightly around rootings is A REAL PAIN to unwrap, since wet paper sticks tight to the roots and damage the roots when I unwrap them. Roots of tree come in burlap (breathable fabric), with a string tied on top like a bundle.

I use garbage-lid, face up, and put dug-up roses' into the lid .. take the rose out to wrap in wet fabric. The garbage-lid catch any left-over dirt.

My Mom once dug up lots of perennials from Michigan for me .. it was a 4 hours drive in hot summer. My Mom told us DO NOT COVER THE PLANTS with plastic, leave it open so roots can breath.

Straw - it surprised me once my kids got about 16/17 that they started wanting to eat different food...not the same old food they've always eaten. They started cook interesting food. It's bizarre, all of a sudden they weren't picky anymore. So hang in there!!

Khald - what a fabulous recognition by your company!!! Kudos!!! OTOH - what a dilemma! We've moved many times (about 8), and I always leave the roses behind. It's heartbreaking...but it may be cheaper than hiring people to help you. Sure would save a lot of labor on your part too. You could definitely take your potted roses. But, that's what I've done...not necessarily what you will do. :)

Good luck!! Let us know what you decide to do.

Carol

Straw: Thanks for the advise. I feel more confident now, however, I am scared about sudden temp rise that can suddenly shoot from 80*F and rain on one day to 102*F on the next day. It is hard for the plants that are not fully establish to endure such a big variation in temp. But I will hope for the best and take my chances, following the instructions you mentioned above.

Carol: I mostly leave the roses that I plant in a house and I have done it many times in the past but there is some construction that is planned in the lawn of my current house so the roses can't be left like that. I will have to take a chance and remove them as safely as possible.

best regards

Oh, I see. Yes..just do your best. That's all you can do. :)

Carol

Few pics in past few days....

Bloom size of Papa Meilland is still between small to medium, not really impressive. Fragrance is moderate.

Just forgot to post the pics of Doris Tysterman. It has been producing lackluster single blooms when it was hot but with temps going down and with rains, orange coloured double blooms with ruffled petals are back...

You have a lot of roses in the orange/yellow spectrum. I want to have more roses like that! I really like your Graham Thomas rose!! So sweet looking!! I really like your Pat Austin, and I've never heard of its fragrance being described like that. Incredible!!!

carol

Khalid: Just saw your roses, Alan T. and Doris T. both have really nice deep colors.

It looks like magnesium deficiency on Bronze Star (yellow edge and green arrowhead) .. I also see lots of bare-stems (means plenty of calcium). Too much calcium drives down magnesium and copper (crinkled leaves and smaller leaves, plus yellow-margins). Here's an internet pic. of magnesium deficiency:

Straw: You are right. That is Mg deficiency for sure but since I am going to shift these roses in few days, I will try that the problem is addressed in the new location. Thanks for the advise.

best regards

Straw - that's a really interesting shot. I've never seen anything like it. I went back up to take a look at Bronze Star, and you're right on the money! I never even noticed it. :)

Carol

I'd like to know how one goes about correcting this deficiency. Can on e top-dress or does it have to be nutrients in the hole?

Vaporvac: The below site has instruction on how to use magnesium sulfate (Epsom salt) .. that's sold cheap at Walmart for less than $2 in the pharmacy dept.

http://homeguides.sfgate.com/magnesium-sulfate-plant-care-31320.html

"Do not use magnesium sulfate for garden plant care unless symptoms of magnesium or sulfur deficiency are present. When deficiency symptoms are present, use a soil drench of 1 to 2 teaspoons magnesium sulfate dissolved in a gallon of water.

Magnesium sulfate provides the needed nutrients without changing soil pH levels, as is the case with dolomitic limestone. Ten pounds of magnesium sulfate for 1,000 square feet of bed area incorporated into the soil corrects magnesium and sulfur deficiencies."

Thank you, straw. That was a really great link clearly expressed. I put ESalts on my roses in Spring, as I thought that helped with green growth, but never really understood what it did.

Few pics in in last couple of days....

Khalid: thanks for the report on scent of PAOK .. Some Austins scent become mild in hot weather. I'm glad to learn that The Dark Lady scent smells good in hot weather .. it smelled great in cool weather at Chicago Botanical Garden.

As to the small & pale & crinkled leaves on Pat Austin, it looks like nitrogen deficiency: smaller leaves & pale and irregular. If you can get blood from a slaughterhouse .... Blood-meal has NPK 12-0-0, plus iron, plus acidic. Blood-meal is much lower salt than chicken manure. I never burn any plants with blood meal, but I burnt plenty with chicken manure.

I recently induced copper deficiency on Veteran's Honor by giving it high-pH pea-gravel water, plus high-pH Azomite .. leaves WILTED IMMEDIATELY, curled down, plus no blooming. Will post a pic. in nutrient-deficiency thread.

Copper Deficiency Caused by: - High pH & high in organic matter.
- Waterlogged soil & Increased Zinc, Nitrogen and Phosphorus levels.

- Young shoots are distorted or wilting.
- Younger leaves become yellow between their veins. Later on their vein become yellow too. Poor or no blooming.

Straw: In my garden during hot summers this year, the top Austin rose (rather the overall top rose) from fragrance point of view has been Glamis Castle. Though I do not like the myrrh fragrance of Glamis Castle much, it was perhaps the only rose in my garden that had reasonable fragrance at 110*F and above. Most other roses were almost non-fragrant in these temps.

In second shade, ie, moderate to fairly strong fragrance, come Pat Austin, The Dark Lady, The Prince, Alan Titchmarsh, St. Swithun, Jude the Obscure, Graham Thomas, Lady Emma Hamilton and Crown Princess Margareta

In third shade, ie, mild to moderate fragrance fall Jubilee Celebration, Golden Celebration, William Morris, Sharifa Asma (Sharifa Asma hardly bloomed for me, all three bushes), Mary Rose, The Alnwick Rose, Heritage and Winchester Cathedral, Charlotte

Spirit of Freedom had no fragrance and bloomed only once during summers. Gertrude Jekyll, Benjamin Britten and Teasing Georgia never bloomed for me during summers, not even once.

From Blooming Power point of view, three toproses have been Crown Princess Margareta, William Morris and Glamis Castle.

Pat Austin, The Dark Lady, St. Swithun, Alan Titchmarsh come in second category. They retained a reasonable bloom size and had reasonable bloom life in high temps.

PAOK bloomed profusely whole summer but had very short bloom life. So was Pat Austin. Jubilee Celebration and Lady Emma Hamilton.

hope this info is of some use....

best regards

Khalid - I love your Mirandy shot!!!!! Wow!!! And I also really loved your William Morris!! Great going! Tipu Sultan is my favorite!!! Wow!!! Wish it were growing in my yard!!!

Lots of great info there!! In my climate (cool and rainy) PAOK (new this year) had blooms that last weeks at a time. I think it's going to be a fabulous rose! Yours may get better in your cooler winter months.

Carol

Khalid: I appreciate the info. you gave, that deserve another thread, like "Rating of blooms' scent, bush & vase-life, bloom frequency".

My own-root Sharifa Asma likes partial shade, and need more nitrogen and potassium than normal to pump out shoots for blooming.

At first I gave it high-potassium, it's too short, then I gave it high nitrogen plus potassium, then it became taller & blooms sooner.

Gertrude Jekyll is a once or twice bloom for most warm-zoners. Seaweed in CA also said her Teasing Georgia didn't bloom much. I notice that yellows like Golden Celebration bloomed more in 4-hours of morning sun, than when it was in full-sun.

Spirit of Freedom bloomed tons at Chicago B.garden when it's cool & tons of rain .. and did well for Niels in cold Denmark & acidic clay. My Austin roses in partial shade, less than 4 hours of sun bloom better than the Austin roses in full-sun .. I moved most of my Austin roses to few hours of morning sun, except for Mary Magdalene .. bloom lots in full-sun, but blooms don't last long & faded by hot sun.

Carol: With temps going down a little (90-100*f) nowadays, mostly in early 90s), Tipu Sultan is doing great. The old rose fragrance has also improved a lot and so has bloom size.

Straw: Thanks for information on Sharifa Asma. I agree with you that Austin roses perform much better in part shade, something like 3-4 hours morning sun. Actually, I have noticed that if they are saved from full day direct sun, they keep blooming even at 105*F and higher which is a very high temp for roses. Most roses stop blooming in this temp.

Actually, my observation is that many OGRs and modern roses having close lineage with those OGRs perform very well in extreme weathers. If your notice the list of the roses that performed well in hot summers, you would find that there is either an OGR or a specie rose amongst the parents or grand parents or parents of grand parents.

Most fragile and poorly performing roses in my garden were hybrid tea roses that were great to watch in springs but when it got hot, they performed miserably. When I see their lineage, I find modern hybrid tea roses in the last 4-5 strings of lineage. Breeders have been able to produce good sizes, wonderful colours etc after extensive breeding but very few of these roses are robust and hardy enough to survive extreme weather.

best regards

Oooh!!! I love that the fragrance has improved!!! I need more heat to get better fragrance. This summer it got above 24C (75 F) only once. So, I guess fragrance here isn't what it should be. Darn. :)

Here, with the cooler temps, I really like hybrid teas. Interesting info.

Carol

Agree with Khalid that hybrid teas can't survive extreme temp (cold or hot). I lost so many hybrid teas through my zone 5a winter. I'm leaning toward Austin roses or Old Garden Roses since they don't die through my cold winter.

Straw wrote: "I'm leaning toward Austin roses or Old Garden Roses since they don't die through my cold winter."

Same is the case here. It has been repeatedly confirmed to me through my own personal experience and through experience shared by my friends that "Roses that perform well in extreme cold perform well in extreme hot weather too". Perhaps it is the ability to perform well in extreme / difficult conditions which these plants have, whether it's very hold or very cold climate doesn't matter.

Hybrid Tea roses produce stunning blooms when the conditions are good / ideal but in extreme weather, they either don't survive or perform poorly most part of the year, except that spell of weather when the conditions are good. I don't want such roses in my garden so like Straw, I will also be shifting to OGRs, Austin roses and other shrub or even HT roses that have a close lineage with OGR / specie roses (and are supposed to carry those genes in abundance).

Few pics today.....

Location, location, location....I'm leaning away from Austins. :)

Carol

I have also found that many roses that do well in extreme cold do well in my hot, humid climate also. Winters here are extremely hard on roses, we have fluctuating temps, wet cold, dry cold and hot in the winter. This causes plants to prematurely break dormancy and be subject to freeze damage because of this. I believe this subjects us to some the same dieback diseases as experience in the extreme cold climates where freeze damage is common. Maybe the extremely cold tolerant roses' resistance to dieback diseases also helps get us through our summers where many diseases are rampant.

Val: Very good point !!

Khalid: Marigolds attract the predator insects (wasps) that eat thrips. But Marigolds also attract spider mites for hot & dry places. Since my climate is humid & wet .. I don't have spider mites. The year which I planted 2 dozen marigolds, I got bitten by a wasp, but didn't see any thrips in my garden.

I am unable to give proper time to my roses and I can see the effect. Hope I can shift them safely to the new house, which is just across the road but still all roses are to be taken out from beds with large size rootballs.

Few pics...

Blooms are small with almost no fragrance. Bush is growing well in pot in full sun.

Belle Epoque hasn't been blooming much in hot summers but now it is developing few buds.....

BTW, a combined shipment of DA roses reached last to last week. Most of the roses belong to a friend of mine but there are few for me as well. We already possess almost all the DA roses available to us locally but wanted more. And they had to be ordered from one of the countries housing a DA Nursery.

When they reached my place, they were all half dead without any leaves. Leaves had fallen during 15 days journey in a container. I took care of them and all of them revived. This is just to tell you that you ladies and gents are so lucky that you can order anything that you want anytime.... you just have to arrange finances. This is the kind of ordeal we go through to get those roses which are not available to us locally.

Good thing is that all roses have survived. They include Darcey Bussell, Wollerton Old Hall, Poet's Wife, The Ancient Mariner, Munstead Wood, Strawberry Hill, Olivia Rose Austin, Thomas A Backet, Summer Song, Carolyn Knight, Harlow Carr, Port Sunlight, Young Lycidas and Boscobel.

Hope they grow well. Can't wait to see blooms on them.

best regards

Thank you, Khalid for updating us on your roses. And I'm happy to hear that your Austin roses are OK. The biggest mistake I did when I dug up roses is to dunk them in a bucket of water, that broke-up their root-system and roots hate that .. takes 2 to 3 months to grow new leaves.

When you dig up roses to move to your new house, the soil is best barely damp so the root ball don't crumble. The more you keep the root-ball intact, the more tiny-roots survive. I move lots of roses & perennials around .. the more dirt cling on to the root-ball, the better chance of bouncing back.

I have 2 more roses to dig up to fix poor drainage, I'm going to get a long piece of rag and tie the root-ball together, so soil don't crumble .. while I fix the drainage.

Glad to here that your Just Joey smells good !! I like its deep color. About the "mother rose" decline in health? I had seen that with grafted-rose .. the grafted juncture gets damaged by temperature fluctuations. I also see own-root decline in health when it keeps secreting acid, but no-buffer is given to neutralize the acid. For roses, older roots are MUCH MORE SENSITIVE to acid than young-roots.

When roots are young, they are fibrous and can take acid well. Thus an acidic medium is best for rooting roses. But when roots get older, they get woodier, and are more sensitive to acid. My tomato roots, snapdragons, marigolds are like young own-root roses, I dumped sour "used lemon" water .. and they don't mind. But putting such sour-solution on big woody root like Dr.Huey .. leaves wilt immediately, plus leaves become thinner and breaking out in mildew or blackspots.

Khalid: I don't know much about Rose de Rescht scent, but Comte de Chambord's scent is always good, hot or cold temp. I recently drilled too many holes in my pots, and Bluegirl gave me these tips to converse water & keep cool for hot climate:

Bluegirl wrote: "Maybe you can plug holes a bit with caulk & plastic pieces cut from scrap pots. I often use a trick my uncle showed me to stuff up holes. I use it with young plants in small pots that I don't want to drain too quickly--stuff the holes with wads of batting from old pillows or whatever--slows down the drainage & lets the soil get moist,

Might not be a problem in your climate, but down here, we get "crocking" in pots--the dirt hardens & pulls away from the pot sides. Then, when you water, it just runs down the sides & out the pot without hydrating the soil. Much less a problem when I use potting soils, but even fluffy native soil will crock in the hottest weather.

Also helps for me to dig pots at least 4-6" into the soil below them. That also lets earthworms come & go into them & keeps the a bit cooler." Bluegirl in Texas (very hot summer).

Straw: Rose de Rescht always has a fragrance, even when the temps crossed 105*F. It's a very sweet scent, unlike most other roses that I have. I smells like camphor to me at times....

Regarding the root balls, what size a fully grown rose root ball should be? Around 1 ft x 2 ft? I rarely shift roses, usually I leave them there but this time there are so many of them and they will be destroyed during reconstruction.

Had it been winters, I would just remove the soil from root balls and replant them, bare rooted but I can't do it in this weather when the temp is in the range of 90 to 100*F.

There is termite in the rose beds in my previous house and if I take out bushes with root balls, termite will transfer to new house also. Is termite dangerous for roses? I mean their roots etc. Normally I have seen termite only going for the dead wood. But one of my very healthy bushes of Melody Perfume just dried up last week withing days. When I dug it out, I saw that the roots had become small, sort of eaten up and there was termite in that area. Does termite eat roots?

Since it was a large sized bush, I took lot of cuttings when the wood was still green. I am not sure how many would survive.

best regards

Khalid: You are right about termites, yes, they do eat the wood of living plants. I meant OWN-ROOTS don't like to be bare-rooted by dunking in a bucket of water, OWN-ROOT has fibrous roots like marigolds, and marigolds don't like to be bare-rooted when I transplanted them.

Your roses are grafted on CENTIFOLIA, which is very drought-tolerant, THUS BARE-ROOTING them in a bucket of water isn't bad. I dug up Pink Peace (grafted on Dr. Huey) and bare-rooted Dr.Huey-root-ball in a bucket of water for 1 hour. It was OK and recuperated fast within a week. Dr.Huey rootball is 1' x 2' deep.

I'm killing Le Nia Rias (Centifolia) that suckers badly today .. will report back as to how big the root-ball is.

Austin roses with climber-heritage do best as OWN-ROOTS ... probably best just to get cuttings, and leave the grafted-root behind to avoid termites. These are Austin roses with climber-heritage, and best as OWN-ROOTS: Abraham Darby, A Shropshire Lad (likes alkaline), Benjamin Britten, Crown Princess Mag, Evelyn, Gertrude Jekyll, Golden Celebration, Graham Thomas, Heritage, James Galway, Spirit of Freedom, St. Swithun, Strawberry Hill, Teasing Georgia, Tess of the d'Urbervilles, The Pilgrim, the Wedwood rose.

Golden Celebration roots very easily .. and folks who have both (own-root vs. grafted) reported that the own-root blooms more and more healthy. Same with Teasing Georgia, best as own-root. I saw a pic. of 1st-year own-root tiny Abraham Darby with tons of blooms, versus Abraham Darby (grafted of Dr.Huey) which is 7 feet tall, and one lousy bloom at the rose park.

French Meilland, and Romantica roses are best as OWN-ROOTS: Liv Tyler (a blooming machine in my alkaline clay), Frederic Mistral, Bolero, The McCartney rose, Pink Peace, Firefighter. Those are known to be very vigorous as own-roots.

Hybrid teas like Angel Face, Heirloom, Double-Delight, Chrysler Imperial, Oklahoma, Gold Glow are WIMPY as own-roots, thus best as grafted. I grew two Double-Delight as own-roots .. roots too shallow and died through my zone 5a winter.

Very valuable information, Straw. Which roses (category) in your experience do not perform well on own roots?

Straw: Do you think it will be safe to remove soil from the roots (in the evening), dunk the roots in a bucket of water for some time and plant it at a new place in temps ranging between 90-100*F during day but 80 to 90*F at the time when the rose is being shifted (evening time)?

Few pics taken today.....

Thank you, Khalid, for a wonderful show of roses blooming in hot temp. I like your dark-color roses: McCartney rose, Ebb tide, H.Z, Doris.T., and Oklahoma. Alec's Red is known as partial shade rose.

Old Garden Roses are usually sold as own-roots here in America. In my experience, floribundas are better as own-root. Floribundas such as Ebb Tide, Bolero, French Lace are very good in acid-phosphatase (producing acid to break down minerals for blooming) .. thus they can root easily & be able to go deep into my hard-clay for winter-survival. I have to give high pH dolomitic lime to my FLORIBUNDA roses: Bolero, Old Port with dark green leaves.

The exception is my Kordes Floribunda Deep Purple (ultra-wimpy as own-root) .. some Kordes roses are bred to secrete LESS acid, to prevent blackspots, and folks in alkaline clay California complained that some Kordes roses don't bloom well.

My hunch is: if a rose blooms easily, it means roots can secrete acid to utilize minerals in soil, which means it will root easily, and does well as own-root.

Per Khalid question: Do you think it will be safe to remove soil from the roots (in the evening), dunk the roots in a bucket of water for some time and plant it at a new place in temps ranging between 90-100*F during day but 80 to 90*F at the time when the rose is being shifted (evening time)?

Answer: Yes, it's safe to remove soil from a GRAFTED-rose (Dr.Huey rootstock or Centifolia), dunk that in a bucket of water to get rid of termites, but NOT safe to plant at that high temp., unless you are in wet-season with frequent rain. I dug up roses at 90 F, bare-rooted in a bucket of water, and had to water it 3 times a day, otherwise the leaves droop.

I bare-rooted Bluegirl (Dr.Huey-rootstock), then planted in another location. I had to water it daily for 2 months .. before it sprouted new leaves. Thank God it didn't lose leaves being dug up at 80 to 90 F, but it's a pain to water it daily for 2 months. I had seen Dr.Huey rootstock being wrapped in wet-sawdust, with a plastic outer-cover, sitting inside the store for 4 months, yet sprouted green leaves.

If you don't have wet sawdust, anything damp & soft like cloth can sub. and the roots can be stored inside for weeks, then plant later when you have time or the temp. goes down.

Khalid - wow! That's a lot of effort to get beautiful roses!! What a shame it isn't easier for you....but ingenuity and perseverance has paid off. Kudos to you!! You have a lot of roses blooming now. Good luck with your move - you have a ton of work to do...but you're decicated and motivated - good luck!!

I love your The McCartney Rose!!! Looks wonderful!!! And I love its smell too!!!

My Oklahoma did well the first year...then slowly devolved. I dug it up last year. It's nice to see yours doing so well.

Love your St. Ethelburga!! Mine has started to get some really long canes. The fragrance is wonderful!

My Alec's Red is a poor performer. It balls a lot and never has many blooms. This is its last year. If it doesn't do well in my cooler weather nor in your warmer weather...it doesn't sound like a very good rose. Mine alsoo has little fragrance.

Your locally bred rose looks great!! Lots of pretty blooms!

Carol

Carol wrote "My Alec's Red is a poor performer. It balls a lot and never has many blooms. This is its last year. If it doesn't do well in my cooler weather nor in your warmer weather...it doesn't sound like a very good rose. Mine alsoo has little fragrance."

I have same observation. I have now started shortlisting roses that are good performers with minimum of care. Alec's Red is certainly no one of them (and there are many more in this category).

best regards

Yup...let's use each others' knowledge and get rid of ones that aren't good anywhere!!

Carol

Straw: I vividly remember that when I last logged in, your post wasn't there and the only post that I could see was Carol's. I was actually looking for the reply on shifting of roses. But now, I see your post on top of Carol's post..... I am not sure how that happens. You also made a mention of this many times that you didn't see my post till quite some time.

Thanks for the tips..... I think I can wait for another week to 10 days or may be more. They are not starting construction outside immediately..... first they intend renovating the house from inside whatever they want to do. That gives me some time. Thanks a lot for a detailed reply. That gives me tons of confidence.

Carol: I made a post few days back where I categorized roses in my garden in three categories, those that performed well in high temp, those that performed average and those with poor performance in high temps. The purpose of that post was the same as you mention in your post. Let's short list the roses. A rose that performs ok in 110*F in Islamabad and also survives -13*F in Chicago is simply a robust rose with strong genetics. It will perform well anywhere in the world in my view. And by exchanging information, we can short list such roses.

best regards

Good point!!

Carol

Monsoon season is over in Islamabad and so are hot summers..... no more burning heat. I guess it's time to close this thread. Will start a new thread for my roses in September.

best regards