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paraveina

The Great Garage Debate

paraveina
7 years ago

Rather than continue to hijack RusticRaven's thread, I thought we could continue our discussion here.

One thing that was said on that thread when I expressed my preference of front facing garages that are functional was that resale must also be considered. I find that fascinating, because when I stopped to consider it, I realised that I would never buy a house with a detached garage or a side facing garage that had the entry far from the front entry (aka not a courtyard side entry). That would be enough of a deal breaker for me that I would rule the house out regardless of how perfect it was in layout and location. I would prefer front or courtyard entry, and I would consider rear entry only if I lived in one of those communities where there's a tiny road in behind the houses for garbage pickup and vehicle access (although that's not a thing where I live so it's a moot point for me).

Am I crazy? Is this just akin to the preference between master on the main floor versus upstairs? Is this related to my intense dislike of automatic transmissions and refusal to buy a vehicle with anything other than a proper manual transmission (aka I'm just used to going against current popular opinion)? Or am I the one conforming, given the prevalence of front facing garages?

Comments (80)

  • qbryant
    7 years ago
    For us it was about aesthetics,we like the look of a set back detached garage.
    It definitely goes against the grain in our area.
  • PRO
    Springtime Builders
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    While space and costs are good reasons to attach, weather is something I take issue with having so many clever design strategies to address it. To some, healthier indoor air quality is the ultimate reason to never attach.

    paraveina thanked Springtime Builders
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  • paraveina
    Original Author
    7 years ago

    I'm sure driving itself is statistically much more dangerous than having an attached garage, and I'm not going to stop driving. I'll take my chances with an attached garage.

  • ILoveRed
    7 years ago

    I live in a very safe area but safety is another area of concern to me. If DH is out of town the last thing I want to do is park my car in the detached garage then have to walk and let myself into the house with keys. Silly I know but it is what it is.

    paraveina thanked ILoveRed
  • User
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    I lived in the burbs...where the garages were massive, and so were the hipped roofs. If that's the way everyone's is, then fine, nobody will care.

    For me it's what happens when you leave the garage. Our entry into the house put you in a dark, cramped, tight space with walls, doors, stairs...really a design mess...and that's how we entered every day, and how everyone ended up entering the house. I think our front door could have been nailed shut. If the doorbell ever rang you didnt answer it because it would be nobody we knew. The garage had been pulled in and forward during the modification of the builders stock plan to fit the narrow lot better.

    We have one of those courtyard garages now. Not real different from the old one except the design of the house just works better to funnel the flow to the front door. We always use it now and it's a nice change.

    If we enter through the garage, we have light, a big window, wide hall past the laundry room, and through to the back of the house, a framed window view to the mountains and the water. It's almost as nice an entry as the foyer. And a real bonus to us because we didn't tell our architect that's exactly what we wanted, but he discernined it through our process.

    Good luck.

    paraveina thanked User
  • worthy
    7 years ago

    The front-load garage at Hulk Hogan's former estate doesn't distract from the front facade--it's just another structure in what resembles a rambling medieval village.

    paraveina thanked worthy
  • dauglos
    7 years ago

    worthy, you are absolutely correct, but I laughed out loud at the idea of the Hulkster being a source of architectural expertise and good taste. :)

    paraveina thanked dauglos
  • doc5md
    7 years ago

    So my current house has no garage at all.... And yes, we get cold and snow. I wouldn't care if I had attached garage or detached garage at my house right now!!!! ANY garage would be a blessing... Its all in perspective!!

    BUT, we are going to build a new house... and since I can, it will be attached.

    3 bays. And, since the driveway will already be between 1/4 and 1/3 or a mile, it will be side loading (the extra distance won't really be that much). I plan to heat it too... I can't wait!!! Not heat it to 72 degrees mind you, but warm enough to melt accumulated ice off the cars. There will be floor drains.

    paraveina thanked doc5md
  • cpartist
    7 years ago

    doc5md, sounds like the best of all worlds for you. :)

    paraveina thanked cpartist
  • artemis_ma
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    I'm building a front loading garage on my home.

    Why?

    I live in New England, and I'm tired of having to worry about angles and slopes when approaching my garage on an icy driveway, that was why. I didn't know there was anything "wrong" about them when we settled on my build design - I wasn't on GW yet. Even with my first build design (that utilized an architect) the house had a front loading garage.

    My current house is side-loading, but frankly, when you drive down the street from the north to the south, the first thing on my home you see is the garage, if only because my house is set up on a hill. (The first thing you see from the other direction is trees.)

    It didn't even occur to me to remember until about two months ago that Every Single House I've Ever Lived In except the current one had a front loading garage. They seemed fine, and not remotely ugly. Okay, I was a kid (young-un to college aged) while living in all three of those, but they seemed normal. Only one was tract housing.

    Last summer or fall, I drove around here, and counted up the ratio of front loaders to side loaders (excluding the detached or non-existent) garages -- about half and half, and no, not all the properties were small in road frontage. The only one that looked ugly to my discerning eyes was the one with three garage doors facing front in a block, and there was a lot else ugly about that house, too.

    So, yes, my build has a front facing garage, and even worse, it sticks out six feet in front of the rest of the home. (Okay, the porch comes out as far.) Because I wanted the view from the dining room, which would have been cut off if I'd pushed it back. I also wanted a circular driveway in front, which with a side-loader, would have meant cutting into some perfectly fine trees I was otherwise happy with, as well as adding in a lot of grading material. I can drive straight into my garage, while guests can circle around.

    Front loading, side loading, detached or attached -- let your own needs guide your choices!!

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  • CSKI 13
    7 years ago

    We ended up with a front load garage as well. Snow country and the front of the house faces south so Mother Nature can help w/the snow. Doing what I can to minimize the prominence of the garage by choice of garage door and paint. We're also putting in a circular drive w/center planter that should help focus attention on the front entry of the house, away from the garage doors. We'll see how it all comes together; part of the fun about building is to get everyone onto the "same page" in terms of vision, when each of us starts from our own heavily biased preferences! Have really enjoyed the journey so far. It's not been especially smooth, we're three house plans in and more than 2 years from when we expected to start, but all in all are exceptionally pleased with the way things have turned out!

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  • bluesanne
    7 years ago

    Garages are wasted on cars. None of our houses (two in town, one in the country on acreage) have had garages that were used as such. We live in very rainy NW Oregon, and we and our vehicles have done just fine. If we had a garage now, I would convert it into a barn for our horses. We have no plans on moving, other than feet first, but whoever owns this house after we're dead and gone will have plenty of room to put in a garage. I detest our car-centric society -- if we could, we would live without one, but it is difficult to carry a bale of hay on a bike or a bus. In my world, garages are best used for something else.

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  • PRO
    Virgil Carter Fine Art
    7 years ago

    HAIL--only one good reason to have somewhere to put the vehicles out of the weather! :-)

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  • PRO
    Springtime Builders
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Carports can work for that too and I like the way they are open, allowing more light, views of nature and the landscape. Not pushing this as a reason to detach vs attach or eliminate garage, just to raise awareness about achieving better indoor air quality.

    I understand your point paraveina and it depends on the situation on which might produce more exposure. Sitting in gridlock traffic or driving behind a vehicle with an outdated emission system is more harmful than most typical driving conditions. The problem with attached garages is that we spend most of our time indoors.

    It's not just CO exhuast that causes the pollution. Still cars offgas a myriad of pollutants and fuel evaporation is one of the most concerning toxic vapors and easiest to detect. Research is limited, but the EPA continues to raise concerns about attached garage impacts on indoor air quality.

    It's also things people tend to store in garages. Keeping questionable items in outside storage cubbies or sheds and always keeping the house-to-garage door closed can help. I encourage people to use their sense of smell when entering a garage. I can always detect stuff I would rather not be breathing on a regular basis.

    Ilovered, your safety concern isn't silly at all. I think many of the design solutions that address the weather also apply to safety. Sites with topography tend to make these types of designs more secure. I think motion activated lights and security cameras will do more to discourage trouble and increase safety though. Even sites without topography can use spaces that provide security while better detaching the garage for better indoor air.

    This screenshot shows a plan we are working with under development that I think addresses the security concerns well. The deck is over a walkout basement.

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  • PRO
    Springtime Builders
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Wildlife? That's a new one. When I was meth head, I would simply slip into the attached garage after the car pulled in but before the door was closed but most aren't as clever as me. Pick your poison!

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  • bluesanne
    7 years ago

    We have coyotes, bear, bobcats and cougars...and, yes, meth heads. We also have a perimeter fence with hot wire top and bottom, a locked gate, and a very big livestock guardian dog. I go out every night to feed horses, and she is constantly at my side. While you can never say never, any predators, human or beast, would think twice about coming onto our property.

    paraveina thanked bluesanne
  • jo_in_tx
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    In a suburban neighborhood with smallish lots, I much prefer the looks of detached garages in the back of the house. You drive down the street and see houses - not garages. However, in my previous neighborhood, 95% of the houses had detached garages in the back, while I was one of the lucky ones to have an attached garage in the front. It truly was the best of both worlds for me. Alas, we now have a detached garage, again, but with a short covered walkway to the house.

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  • User
    7 years ago

    I'm with Oaktown. Detached garage. The house should be able to stand on it's own.

    paraveina thanked User
  • ILoveRed
    7 years ago

    Ichabod...The house may be able to stand on its own but I won't when my feet hit the ice in the winter trying to go from the car to the house, haha!

    i never was a very good comedian.

    paraveina thanked ILoveRed
  • amoopen1
    7 years ago

    We made a courtyard by detaching our garages, garage doors face the house and the front door is framed by the opening between the garages. It's an acre lot, 85 feet wide at the street and 126 ft at the lake. The garages are 50ft from the street. Started construction late September, hoping to be done by late August. This drone pic was from March.

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  • cpartist
    7 years ago

    amoopen1, what is the width between the garages?

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  • worthy
    7 years ago

    A courtyard home by the lake enabled by relaxed zoning that allows varying setbacks and varied length of structures.

    Hope there's enough height to fit the moving van under the entry roof.

    paraveina thanked worthy
  • amoopen1
    7 years ago

    Believe me, it took 2 years of planning and a presentation to the Board of Zoning Adjustment to allow our house to be built this way. In our county you can't have a detached garage in front of the house, only behind it. Also, there was a square footage limit to the detached structure (garages add up to 1640 sf). The Board was fine with it when they saw the plans and the fact that I was able to get a letter of support from each neighbor to the side and front of the house.


    The width between the garages is 17 feet, and I made sure that a full size moving truck could fit underneath the connector. It is just under 11 feet in height.

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  • ILoveRed
    7 years ago

    Very cool! I see palm trees. Where is this?

    i hope you will post your progress.

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  • cpartist
    7 years ago

    Yes I'd love to see updates?

    Florida?

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  • amoopen1
    7 years ago

    Thanks! We are in Central Florida, just outside Orlando. I'll update the "It's ___ , how is your build going?" thread when it's done. Here is a picture inside the courtyard and of the garage entries. All the precast cladding and corbels and window sills were installed over the past 2 weeks.

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  • worthy
    7 years ago

    made sure that a full size moving truck could fit underneath the connector. It is just under 11 feet in height.

    Typical 26' straight trucks are 12.5'-13.5'high, as are the 18 wheelers used by most moving cos. However, U-Haul trailers will fit.

    I like the forbidding look. Gated too?

    paraveina thanked worthy
  • AnnKH
    7 years ago

    I live in North Dakota, so snow, ice, and wind are all a big part of our live 6 or 7 months of the year (as well as thunderstorms and hail the rest of the time). In addition to protection from the weather when we come and go, having a front load garage means less driveway to shovel. Climate is definitely a huge part of the equation.

    paraveina thanked AnnKH
  • cpartist
    7 years ago

    Agree weather plays a part. My 90 degree turn driveway isn't a big deal in sunny FL.

    paraveina thanked cpartist
  • chicagoans
    7 years ago

    I think lots of this depends on the rest of the floor plan. I like my detached garage, and I'm in a climate that gets snow. (But if I was afraid of the weather, I probably wouldn't live here!)

    In many attached garage plans the garage is the primary access to the outdoors other than the front door. I would NOT want that. I need a back door and preferably one that exits via a mudroom and a hall with a powder room. (that's what I have, and if my garage were attached it would block... something.) Kids going in or out; me going in or out after yard work or to get from kitchen to grill; dog going in and out... I don't want any of these to have to be routed through the garage.

    I agree it would be nice to have an attached garage, but I'd have to give up windows somewhere, and there's not really a space where I'd want to eliminate the outside wall.

    paraveina thanked chicagoans
  • loonlakelaborcamp
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Living in ND, snow is a biggy. Not just shoveling a longer driveway if the garage is behind the house, but the other consideration in town is WHERE do you put all that snow from the driveway over the course of the winter? You have to stack it up along side the driveway, not on the sidewalk, and not in your neighbor's yard. Here, snow does not melt until spring (and it loves to blow back and forth, side to side all winter long! Nothing like shoveling the same snow 3 or 4 times!) If your houses are close together, you may have to blow it forward and then over to clear your driveway.

    I vote for forward garages!

    When you can't blow your snow high enough over the banks on the edges of your driveway to clear it, you want to have the garage right in front!

    paraveina thanked loonlakelaborcamp
  • schreibdave
    7 years ago

    Like Loonlake says ... here in Syracuse most people opt for function over form. The first time my wife came home in formal work attire and had to walk through a foot of snow to get to the house ... the For Sale sign would be up. Having said that I very much prefer the look of a detached garage towards the rear of the property.

    paraveina thanked schreibdave
  • cpartist
    7 years ago

    I remember my days of snow in Syracuse and I was there for 4 years when there was relatively little snow compared to some years. Ugh! But traying down the hills was fun!

    paraveina thanked cpartist
  • User
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    If we had put our 3 car garage opening to the front instead of side it would have dominated the house and would not like that. Perfect world would be a house with alley and rear entry into garage as I grew up with. But that was in the city and we are semi rural. Guest parking will be front and forward and the walk to front door obvious so I do not foresee a problem. The problem in our house now is that EVERYONE comes to the back door and I really don't like that.

    paraveina thanked User
  • Meris
    7 years ago

    I'm I'm doing a detached garage, on purpose and I live in NH. I planned it due to the off gassing and health issues. We have remodeled and added on with superinsulation and all that goes with a tight home.

    We aren't exactly sure how we are going to "orientate" the garage yet. We have the architects plan, but we are doing this in phases, and we want to rope off the area and really think about it; a dumpster, storage unit and a porta-potty are in the way right now.

    I grew up here with a detached garage when I was a child, we never minded. I think for my current house, we will be considering it a courtyard. I like those.

    This conversation has been fun to read and has given me some other ideas to think about. Thanks!

    paraveina thanked Meris
  • schreibdave
    7 years ago

    cpartist - did you go to SU?

    My winter activity is snowmobiling so I look forward to the snow.

    paraveina thanked schreibdave
  • cpartist
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    cpartist - did you go to SU?

    I did. To give you an idea of how long ago, streaking in the dead of winter was considered sport. My senior year I lived in the toilet bowl (only SU people will understand that one).

    paraveina thanked cpartist
  • pamghatten
    7 years ago

    Ha ... cpartist, I lived in the toilet bowl my junior year! Currently in Buffalo, NY and just purchased a house with a front load 2 car garage. Not the look I would have chosen if I had more options, but am so glad to finally have a garage again! Last home didn't have a garage at all and was in the snowbelt outside of Buffalo. 79 inches of snow in November 2 years ago, was too much!

    I always admired detached garages with a breezeway connecting them to the house.

    paraveina thanked pamghatten
  • cpartist
    7 years ago

    Sometimes a front load garage is all that will work.

    paraveina thanked cpartist
  • just_janni
    7 years ago

    Oh my- I grew up in Auburn NY, spent some of the wayward youth on the "hill" in Syracuse, and went to college in Oswego... (Sorry for thread hijack)

    paraveina thanked just_janni
  • PRO
    Anglophilia
    7 years ago

    I don't like garages in the front of the house. Often, people leave the doors open so everyone can see all there junk. I also font like detached garages - dirt of defeats the whole idea and one must shovel a oath the the garage in winter.

    I prefer a garage test opens on the side, or even better, on the rear, and us attached. I have a basement garage - doesn't get that cold in the winter, and never boiling hot in the summer. Yes, I must carry my groceries up a flight of stairs but I usually gag my own groceries, and I have a basement frig so I can plan my loads going up the stairs. Remember - this was not a problem until I got old and my breathing problems worsened.

    Since we always came in this way, my late husband and I decided that it needed to be nicely landscaped so it didn't look like the service entrance. So we built narrow beds in the driveway, up against the fences and the retaining wall. It's very attractive.

    I have no desire to walk between a detached garage by myself at night, or in rain or bad weather. We regularly have hail and winds - tornado alley, and it us important to protect my car from hail or falling limbs. No garage? Cleaning off snow in the winter? Thank you, NO! As for a garage causing poor air quality in the house, well, that's a first one for me.

    paraveina thanked Anglophilia
  • PRO
    Springtime Builders
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Perhaps the garage was a contributing factor to the breathing problems, especially in a basement garage situation, the very worst for indoor air. A breezeway, covered walkway, or connected mudroom covers most of your concerns.

  • lookintomyeyes83
    7 years ago

    OK Springtime, you've repeated yourself a few different ways now, please stop?

    paraveina thanked lookintomyeyes83
  • whaas_5a
    7 years ago

    I get the feeing I'm a 100x more likely to get struck by something other than the small leak in my garage, lol.

    I went with a canted garage for various reasons but mainly based on the lot positioning with the street as you drive up. Nice to see who is in your drive as they pull in. Guests have a short walk to the front entry as well.

    paraveina thanked whaas_5a
  • paraveina
    Original Author
    7 years ago

    Agreed, Springtime I think you've made your point. It isn't helpful to comment the equivalent of "well you probably caused it with your choices".


    I think another reason I'll never go with a detached garage is the ice. I'm in a town on the ocean, and it really moderates our temperatures, to the point where we can have rain in between snowstorms, causing sheet ice. I'm used to walking carefully because we invariably have icy paths, but I don't want to do that at home.

    One time, I was listening to the police scanner and an officer said "we're going to have to shut the bridge down for a bit; I tried to walk over to the car in the accident and I can't get to it because the road has turned into an ice rink".

  • Architectrunnerguy
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Like most of the floor plans on this forum, posted as if they're some isolated thing floating in space like the Starship Enterprise, the location of the garage question can't be addressed without considering context. For some projects I've fallen on my sword for an attached garage while on others I've done the same while advocating for a detached garage....or for a variety of attached garages configurations for that matter. And the reasons are context, and context is everything.

    A front load garage on a narrow lot isn't necessarily the "kiss of death" if it's handled creatively and addressed from start to finish as a significant design issue. So many plans posted here it looks like the garage is a complete afterthought, two crudely attached rectangles that could just as well be in different counties. Picture a red Monopoly "hotel" with a green Monopoly "house" glued to the front of it.

    I posted a list of design thoughts here a while back. I pared it down to 80 from a few hundred but I left one in that concerned the garage, as I thought it that important. It reads:

    68. Try not to have the first view of the house be the garage door. If that's not possible try not to have the door on the closest wall to the street. If that's not possible, plan on spending a lot of money for a really nice garage door.

    Folks, if we gotta have a front load garage, let's spend some money on the door. So many houses have the absolutely cheapest product out there in probably the most visible part of the entire house but then have $7k of fancy Italian marble in the master bath!

    Another item on that list is:

    4. Our perception of a house is strongly influenced by how we arrive at it.

    It's not saying we can't have a front load garage but it is suggesting that it's design be creative and carefully considered and not seem an afterthought as so many, here and elsewhere, are.

    paraveina thanked Architectrunnerguy
  • paraveina
    Original Author
    7 years ago

    What about houses where there is a second level above the garage? (Not just a bonus room, but an actual part of the house.) Does that reduce the massing enough to make a front facing garage "acceptable"?


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  • PRO
    Virgil Carter Fine Art
    7 years ago

    Paraveina makes an important point about front-loading garages. In cases where they are most visually objectionable, it's almost always due to the fact that the garage massing, with it's large garage door, overwhelms the proportions of the house and becomes the most strongly dominant visual feature of the entire building. Front doors, porches (if any), windows--all of the habitable portions of the house--are simply overwhelmed by the size, scale and mass of the large garage and doors. This is amplified with the trend towards 3 and 4-car garages. In the photos above, the garage has been "subdued", and in the three photos, there are no "snout" projecting garages. The garages have been integrated into the façade of each house, and, as ARG suggests, attention has been given to busting up the scale and bulk of the large garage door, either with a more detailed large door, or, better yet, breaking the single large door into two smaller residential scale doors which are much more in scale with the other elements of the façade of that house. It's all about scale and harmony, isn't it?

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  • PRO
    Springtime Builders
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Apologies for solution repetition or implying anglophilia caused her breathing condition by her own choice. Like most homes, decisions by the original owner, designer and builder lead to future inhabitants and societal health concerns.

    Why you shouldn't get attached

    Health Canada warns of cancer from attached garages

    NIH UK science on attached garage risk

    Even if you think risks are small, life safety matters deserves attention in attached garage debates with choices and lack of mitigation impacting other families for hundreds of years to come. No apologies for repeating exposure awareness and encouraging public health.