How exciting! I think it's great to start thinking about the spaces you need and how you want them to relate, but your design should be done when you have your land so you can take advantage of views, work with terrain, plan for orientation to the road, etc.

If you do get a nice big lot, as you hope, are you sure you want your garage in front? As drawn it will rather dominate the front of your house.

How can you design a house if you don't even know what your land will look like? If there will be anything that needs to be accounted for? If you don't know which direction will be north or south?

If you're going to be working with an architect and your Dad, your best bet would be to first find the land you're interested. Then get yourself a good architect to walk the land with you. Instead of laying out the house the way you think you want it, do some rough bubble diagrams on paper and pencil and hand them to the architect along with your absolute needs, your wants and wishes and how you want the house to work for you.

Let the architect do what he was best trained to do and design a house that will be the best it can be for your needs. A good design person will give you what you want sometimes in ways you might never have even thought of. Sort of like how none of us knew we wanted or needed an iPad until Steve Jobs showed us we wanted and needed one. :)

There is a front to the house, which will face the street. I'm unsure of exactly how the house is going to change based on the lot? I can see how things will be different if it's a corner lot. Can you elaborate more on why I need to have a lot first? We are specifically looking for relatively flat land as we don't want a basement. We have plans in the future to add on a pool.

Maybe I'm just cramping the architects artistic style by drawing up how I envision my house and the flow? I would have thought that an architect would love to see my vision drawn up so that they could see exactly what I want. I obviously have a lot to learn. Maybe I just need a designer and drafter?

I agree with Virgil.

You may be amazed how much wall thicknesses can impact a design.

I think the "exactly what you want" has a few problems.

The drawing could be very helpful to your architect but don't expect him/her to think of it as anything more than a graphic program. If the resulting design isn't very different from what you have drawn then you will not have received much in the way of design services from the architect. As others have made clear, architects are not drafters.

As for "flow", that's the first thing I noticed was missing from he design. You should rely on your architect to fix that.

Maybe I just need a designer and drafter?

Well that's the route I went because my builder told me he was a designer. As it turned out, he really was a waste of time except for drawing out what I gave him and even then he made so many mistakes I spent half my time correcting his mistakes.

And the only reason I continued along the path was because I DO have a design background so could easily visualize flow and how a space works in 3d. I didn't and don't need a CAD program to see it either.

Secondly, I had the wonderful help and advice from the architects on this forum. If it wasn't for them, I'd have had a frankenstein house. When I get back I'll link up some threads for you.

The I like your plan Julie G, but like the others have said, you really need to buy the land first. My homes width was based on where the existing septic was, where all the 40-60 foot tall trees where on the lot, direction, our habits, etc. You might not have these things to contend with in a subdivision lot (if that's what your doing), but width and depth of your home is definitely going to be determined by your lot size, direction, etc. I think it would be a bummer to get a vision in my head, then for whatever reason, it would have to be changed later on.

To get the square footage down, I think the size of your bedrooms are way too large. My master is 15 X 16 and it fits a king size bed, two end tables, GC stand, a dresser and a recliner. I think the rest of the bedrooms could be sized down to 12 X 12. It really is enough room. Your guest bath could also bescaled down. Just don't skimp on the closet sizes.

I also think your foyer is too large and your laundry room could use a foot or two. I've never regretted having a large laundry room or closets.

Don't get discouraged, have fun and post your progress on here if you would. Your boys are going to enjoy that bonus room.

Very exciting to be planning your custom home! Built by your dad? Even better! I like what you have so far.

Have to agree with MsLindley that you could certainly shave some square footage from the kids' bedrooms. However, when I was a kid, I would have loved a bedroom that size!

We all live and use space differently (some like their laundry room near the bedrooms and some like it on the other side of the house near other areas, some like an open floor plan and some don't, some want and use a formal dining room and others would rather use that square footage elsewhere). It certainly can't hurt to provide your architect or designer or professional a sketch of what you had in mind. Whether they use it or not. Hopefully after getting ideas and suggestions from here, you will have a better idea of what you want. Please don't be discouraged by all the questions as I want to believe everyone's intentions are to help you think "outside the box" now so you know better what you need/want.

Good luck and I look forward to hopefully seeing more posts from you!

Can't add much more, but +1 to most of the comments above. Most of the discussions above hit the nail on the head.

JDS, please elaborate more on how it lacks flow. I'm not an architect and would love a glimpse into your trained eye.

I'm totally open to new layouts, flow, etc. I just want the final design to include all the spaces/rooms that are included in the current plan. With that being said, all of those components, no matter their layout requires a decent amount of footprint. I don't want to have to compromise on these spaces because of the land. I'm in no hurry to do this and would rather find the perfect land that would accommodate a house with these spaces. We have been looking at lots, mainly in subdivisions, but I don't know how small we can go. I don't want to be able to open my window and touch my neighbors house. I also don't want a massive yard to mow. Somewhere in the middle would be good. Ideally I would like to have enough space to have a tree line between houses. We most likely won't initially put in a pool but would like space to do so. We also want to be able to have a garden similar to what we have now (see picture). So with all those constraints are we talking 0.5 acre, 0.75 acre, or more for minimum?

Upstairs: the kids will not use the kids study. They just won't.

Those are long, dark, narrow hallways. They separate the boys from one another, and from the action downstairs.

Those are big bedrooms for one boy each.

Why not just give each bedroom its own bathroom, or let them share one bathroom with hall access? (I have two boys, they share a bath. Oh, and it has two sinks and a big vanity, and they only ever use one of the sinks. The other one just gets dusty! They'd be better off with one sink, and a bank of drawers on either side.)

The walk-in storage takes valuable space from the bedroom closet, and is oddly-shaped. It will become a mess pretty quickly. Great place to store contraband.

What is your plan for the bonus room? I've learned that you'd better name such a room and have a purpose, so you can define its placement and dimensions.

In between: The stairs are completely separate from the rest of the house, making it harder for your boys. How do you holler up the stairs in the morning that breakfast is ready and you'd better not miss the bus again, young man. How do they holler down that the other one threw up, or the toilet overflowed, or where's the toothpaste, or their girlfriend just called and said "we need to talk"? (He may be only 11 now, but he'll be 13 by the time you move in, and then...)

Downstairs: what's the foyer for? The powder room is on the way to your bedroom, the guest closet is between the living room and kitchen, it's even past the dog cubby. Let the foyer work a little harder than that.

The guest bedroom is behind the kitchen, laundry, pantry, mudroom, and garages? That's "Hazel's" or "Alice's" room, not your guests. If that's a guest bath, it should open in to the bedroom. And with only one sink: your guests arrive with a Dopp kit or makeup bag and hair tools and need somewhere to set it all while at the vanity.

You have a great opportunity to build with an experienced builder who knows your standards and expectations. Work with an architect and make it all work for you and have a great house for your family!

First where in the country are you building?

First I agree with everything said before so won't repeat it all.

As for how much land, there is also any zoning restrictions too. For example, in my area, we are only allowed to have 35% of the lot built on for a house and that includes the garage, the porch and the lanai. Anything under a roof. We were also restricted where our driveway could be placed.

And what are the setbacks for where you're looking? I am buying a city lot so our setbacks are only 5' on each side, but there are some areas where you can have 20-50 foot setbacks on each side. The reason I mention all this is so you can see that how much land you need, will depend on many factors.

Again, find the land and the house can be created to make it work.

And you talk about reducing the size of the house. Just a few thoughts.

Is it really necessary to have a kitchen that is 14'9" x 20'? If so, I hope you have roller skates. Seriously though a well designed kitchen doesn't need to be large to be efficient. In fact there is such a thing as a too big kitchen.

Your guest bedroom is the size of most people's master bedrooms. Why would you need a room so large that will not be frequently used?

Right now you have two people driving so why do you need a 3 car garage?

How much time do you actually spend in your bedroom? If it's not a lot, do you really need such a large bedroom?

Why do you need two staircases? Staircases take up a lot of room for little return.

I agree with the person above who made mention that the kids bedrooms are very large. Bedroom 4 is the size of my master bedroom in my new house.

Who will be using the upstairs bonus room?

I agree about the flow. I would show you with lines and arrows, but I can't download the pictures to show you.

I agree with a all that you have said bpathome and cpartist. I even laughed at a few of the comments. To answer some questions.

We are building in Forsyth County, North Carolina. Specifically in the west part of the city (27104) or more rural Lewisville.

1. Wishful thinking that our boys would use a study area :) That is a space that I could save sq ft on.

2. The boys bathrooms are like that because we currently have a problem with them having to wait on the other to poop so the other can take a shower. lol. I walked through a parade of homes with a similar layout and it was a cool idea. Not opposed to 2 full baths for them.

3. Walk-in storage was just a space thing. With a 1.5 story house we are going to have plenty of walk-in storage and it's location isn't that important to me.

4. Bonus room is going to be a man cave / room for the boys to hang out in. So wet bar, couches, tv. I would love to put built-in bunks in there but that may not work out.

5. The kitchen is way too long.

6. Bedrooms are way too big.

7. I spend a decent amount of time in my bedroom now b/c our current house is only ~1250 and I need a place to escape sometimes. This won't be an issue in the new house.

8. 3 car garage. We currently have a 2 car garage and NO cars in it because of all of our stuff! We have just completely grown out of our house. Because we are not having a basement the 3rd garage is for storage - mountain bikes, road bikes, kayaks, tools, etc.

9. Not set on 2 staircases. Husband wanted that....I think to have an easy access to the bonus room.

You do need to find the land. Each lot may have its own restrictions and even though the lay of that land may be similar to another lot (geographically), the restrictions matter. Also, direction of north/south/east/west. I did luck out in that I am building rurally, so I have more options than someone building in a HOA region.

I do admit I first went to an architect, but for me this one didn't work out -- the design was wonderful, but the house building price was way out of scale for the rural plot I bought in this region. I am instead building a modified (via a draftsperson designer) house from a log home kit -- same square footage, same location on the land, different but modified design -- for a lot less. But I'm building for one person (and guests; I plan to entertain) -- not for a full family.

BUT, I've had this land for almost a couple of decades now -- I knew where I wished to build, and where I could get the best solar gain for my plans. I'd recommend, find your land, check out whatever building restrictions may exist, then if it suits, purchase; and then worry about house construction design -- making sure of course you have enough buildable square footage before you purchase. Perc test (if septic), too.

"unsure of exactly how the house is going to change based on the lot"

With any luck you'll find a little slice of Eden that sings to you, and your whole house will be designed to take advantage of the views, terrain, sunlight, outdoor rooms, etc.

Your doodles are a wonderful exercise in defining what you want, why you want it that way, what you absolutely don't want, etc. A great architect will be able to walk through your doodles with you to understand what you're trying to do, and then completely scrap your doodles and come up with something brilliant that incorporates everything you need AND the best aspects of the lot you choose.

it sounds like you're building in a city, but even lots within city limits vary wildly. My first build was a flat infill lot in an established neighborhood, my current one is a sharp slope with sweeping views of a wilderness area (but I'm actually closer to the city center!) you just won't know any of these variables until you find land!

If you do get a nice big lot, as you hope, are you sure you want your
garage in front?

I wouldn't call 3/4 - 1 acre a big lot, but still it's big enough not to have the dreaded garage-out-front situation. The garage is rarely a particularly attractive part of a house, so unless you're building on a lot so small that it's listed in feet instead of acres, why put the worst part of the house out front to set the tone of the whole house?

Can you elaborate more
on why I need to have a lot first?

You certainly have ideas already about the type of house you want, but the specific lot -- especially when you're talking about an acre or less -- may dictate the type of house you'll choose. Examples:

- If you choose a corner lot, you may opt for a side-opening garage placed at the back of the lot so that it'll provide some privacy for the back yard ... whereas that layout wouldn't work at all if you choose a typical lot.

- If you find a great neighborhood that happens to have narrow/deep lots (or a neighborhood with large set backs), this house plan you've drawn could easily be too wide. Or vice-versa, you might fall in love with the last lot in a neighborhood, and it could be wide and shallow. Or, yet again, you might choose a cul-de-sac lot that'd necessitate a rather narrow front dimension.

- The neighborhood you choose may specify what you can and can't have in a house; for example, the neighborhood in which we're going to build specifies only all-brick or stone and at least 1900 sf. Some neighborhoods require that the house plans are approved by committee, others require very specific items such as a specific roof pitch, a garage of a certain type or size, insist up on two-stories, even mailboxes of a certain type.

- You may find a great deal on an oddly-shaped lot, and this fairly predictable rectangular house may not work on it.

- You may find that very simple lot that you think has no real distinguishing characteristics and can accomodate pretty much any house plan, and your builder may tell you that because of geographical features of the lot, the driveway /garage MUST be placed on the left instead of the right ... and that throws off what you wanted to do.

So until you know where you're going to build, it's absolutely not a waste of time to go through plans and develop a strong sense of what you want ... but don't get your heart set on anything specific until you've chosen your building spot.

To get the square footage down, I think the size of your bedrooms are
way too large. My master is 15 X 16 and it fits a king size bed, two
end tables, GC stand, a dresser and a recliner. I think the rest of the
bedrooms could be sized down to 12 X 12. It really is enough room. Your
guest bath could also bescaled down. Just don't skimp on the closet
sizes.

Agree. Your bedrooms are all master-sized rooms, and that's not really a plus in a house -- it just means you need more furniture and your heating bill will be higher. Also, ask yourself if you need a walk-in closet in the guest room; I think this, like the upstairs walk-in storage, is a space that just fell into existence -- you want to control the rooms, not allow them to control you.

I think you've defaulted to "oversized rooms" throughout this plan, especially in the bedrooms ... but in other areas you're skimpy. For example, you really don't want to build a study that's only 9' wide; by the time you account for wall thickness, this is going to be a massively tiny room -- it might work if you open it towards the foyer and use double French doors, but in its current rendition it's essentially the same size as your closet. Note, too, that once you allow walkways on three sides of the great room, you're going to have a fairly small area for seating. Yet in the dining room you've allotted space for a long table, yet really too much width -- the proportion of the room's going to feel "off". You might say "elegance" instead of proportion; an elegant room is properly sized, fits well into the grand scheme of things, enhances the house ... this first-draft house plan feels more choppy and haphazzard than elegant.

Back to bedrooms: I also agree on fairly large closets; large closets allow rooms to be smaller and keep rooms neater.

With that being said, all of those components, no matter their layout
requires a decent amount of footprint. I don't want to have to
compromise on these spaces because of the land.

Consider that an average house in America is between 2000 and 2400 -- you're looking at building something significantly larger. Is this realistic in terms of budget? Not just building, but also maintaining, insuring, cleaning? If it is budget-appropriate, do you really want to dump this much money and this much time into your house? Is this over sized house going to fit on the rather modest sized lot you're anticipating? If you needed to sell it, would a house of this size sell easily in your area?

I'm in no hurry to do
this and would rather find the perfect land that would accommodate a
house with these spaces.

I agree that "right" trumps "fast", and I have the impression that you're very much still in the "developing ideas" phase. Don't rush through this.

So with all those constraints are we talking 0.5 acre,
0.75 acre, or more for minimum?

More. If you want a large house, an over sized garage, a pool and a garden, you realistically can't do that on 1/2 an acre.

Test it. Go onto your county's GIS system and look at lots and houses -- pick houses that have pools -- you can easily see the lot size, the square footage of the house. You'll find that 1/2 acre lots can support a house of about 2000 sf and a medium pool ... but they're really tight. At an acre you can include the larger house, the deck and screened porch ... but not with a whole lot of room between you and the neighbors.

Upstairs: the kids will not use the kids study. They just won't.

Those are long, dark, narrow hallways. They separate the boys from one another, and from the action downstairs.

Agree and agree. No reason the kids can't study in their bedrooms. I agree that this floorplan has excessive hallways.

Why not just give each bedroom its own bathroom, or let them share
one bathroom with hall access?

Again, agree. This bathroom is overly complicated with too many doors. What it doesn't have is storage space by the vanities. I suggest a plain and simple 3-piece bath opening on the hall.
Not set on 2 staircases. Husband wanted that....I think to have an easy access to the bonus room.

Staircases require more square footage than you realize, and they are a very big line item in the budget.

Other thoughts:

- Pay attention to all your doors. For example, note that once you place a table in your dining room, you won't be able to comfortably reach that door. You also don't want doors that open towards the outside ... think about the hinges, think about what's going to happen to the doors in the rain.

- Look, too, at where the interior doors "park". The study has it right: When the door is open, it lays against a wall. Now look at the master bedroom -- the door is in the middle of the room, meaning you have an uncomfortable spot "behind the door". You want doors to open into the corners of rooms. And look at the guest bathroom: When you walk in, you're looking at the toilet -- nicer to walk in to a view of the sink/mirror; it makes the room feel larger. Also, if this door is left open (and it will be), it blocks the hallway.

- Note that you could easily use the guest bathroom as your downstairs powder room. It's in a private location and is accessible to guests. This would be a very big money saver.

- Pay attention to sizes in bathrooms; for example, neither the guest nor master bathroom has a vanity of adequate size to support two sinks ... and neither one has any storage at the sink. In both places, you'd be better off with one sink and a stack of drawers for your necessities. Note, too, that the toilet closet in the master bathroom is minimal in size; it'll be uncomfortable to use and impossible to clean -- since the 2'6" door barely opens into it, I'm thinking it's smaller than code.

- You say you're not clear on "good flow". Consider the pathways you'd take through the house to complete daily tasks. Here are two examples:

On the other hand, you have very good "food flow". Look at the blue line. You come in from the garage, and the pantry is located near the door. You put your food away before continuing on into the house / no interruption of the cook, no traipsing through the kitchen. Then when you're ready to cook, the food comes out of the pantry, moves to the sink, is cooked nearby and it moves straight on to the table for serving. This keep-things-moving-in-one direction is what you want.

Consider other daily patterns. Think through your return home from work, your kids setting up their materials to do their homework, washing the dog. In all cases, you want to arrange the house so that you have space and storage where you need them -- not too far, not too close, no backtracking. Often houses with good flow have a circular pattern, which allows people to move from one area of the house to another. For example, look at this oh-so-simple houseplan:

- What's the elevation going to look like? And the roofline? I'm not able to visualize a roofline from these drawings.

- You've placed the two first floor bedrooms on the sides and a screened porch on the back ... the result is that your living spaces, the places where you'll spend most of your waking hours, are squished into the middle. They'll have less natural light than the bedrooms. You could alter this by moving the guest room upstairs (and it could use some of that walk-in storage or the bonus room). This would allow natural light into your kitchen.

- Consider, too, that you want to attempt to "stack" your walls and your plumbing in a two-story house. Two-story walls are easier to build, and electrical and plumbing can be run "straight up" to the second floor. This is a big money saver.

- I'd move the dog cubbie to the mud room. It'd be quieter for the dogs, and it'd get them out of the way when you have guests who don't necessarily want to be around the dogs. I'd also move the coat closet out of the kitchen and into the mud room.

I will disagree with mrspete on one point:

You'll find that 1/2 acre lots can support a house of about 2000 sf and a medium pool

Actually my city lot is 9000 square feet and my house is 2870 not including the two car garage, lanai and front porch. We have a pool, and just enough land for the dog to run.

My house that I raised my two kids in was 3600 square feet on a 12,300 square foot lot, which is just shy of 1/3 acre. While it didn't have a pool, it certainly had enough room for a pool and I had lots of room for gardening.

My point being you can't generalize that a lot that is a certain size must have a house a certain size.

Wow! I am overwhelmed by how much time you all have put into helping me. Thank you so much! The reason we want our guest on the 1st floor is our aging parents and we want a place for them to stay/live if need be.

As Virgil mentioned earlier, start with a bubble diagram - begin looking at relationships. Room relationships to each other and site directions help guide a plan. Think of who will be using spaces and when. I.e. I saw you mention a garden a pool eventually - if you've been out dirty in the garden or are sopping wet from swimming and need to use the restroom - where will you go? Walk in through the dining room, across the living room, past the foyer to the power? Or through the kitchen down the hallway to the guest bath? Or around the house, through the garage, through the mud, into the guest bath?

I thought I would update everyone on our progress as I really appreciate everyone's feedback. We fell in love with a lot in a private, small neighborhood that is tucked away. It is 2 acres and fully wooded. We plan to only clear enough for our house and a small yard to keep it private. We are doing a combined land and construction to perm loan which will close at the end of this month. We are looking to start building in September to get the roof on by winter. I am busy picking out everything these days! We worked with an architect who took one of my drawings and made some changes and put an exterior on our house.

Does your architect have an actual architecture degree from a college or is he/she really a designer/draftsman?

I ask because I'm surprised an experienced architect would use mutton chops.

I'm surprised an experienced architect would use shutters on the exterior windows that don't actually cover the windows.

I'm surprised they would use stone on the facade so it looks stuck on and not like it is part of the foundation.

I'm also surprised they would put knee braces below the mutton chops.

It looks like they were trying to create a craftsman style house, but this looks more like someone who doesn't know architectural history would create if asked to do a craftsman house.

I'm surprised an architect would put a front door that clearly has no design relationship to the rest of the house.

I'm surprised an architect would put a useless dormer in an attic space.

Why does your master bath get a better spot than your bedroom? Meaning your master bath has windows on two sides for cross breezes and your bedroom only on one side? I can't imagine an experienced architect would put the toilet closet smack dab up against the wall the bed is on. And he's got the toilet closet door opening in!

Plus instead of putting the bath/closet as a break between the public and private space of the living room and bedroom, he put your bedroom right up against the living room.

And in the guest bedroom, the guest on the south end of the bed, would need to walk completely around the bed to get to the bathroom. Come to think of it the person on the north side of the bed in the master would have to do the same thing.

And in the guest bath, if someone needs to use the toilet, they have to step into the bathroom, move to the side to close the door and then walk to the toilet. There isn't enough room.

Then to make it worse, if someone decides to stay up late and use the powder room, they too will be possibly waking the sleeping person in the master bedroom since the toilet is up against that wall.

Your front porch shows two chairs except the only way to get past the first chair would be to scoot over and sit on the person's lap.

To get from your bedroom to the laundry will be a hike.

Your stairs going upstairs being a straight run can be dangerous.

Your kitchen will be dark with absolutely no windows in it.

Why the odd angled wall in bedroom 2?

That back hallway is a bit odd the way it's laid out.

Again is this a licensed architect?