Did you use interior or exterior paint? Interior paint will not hold up to the extreme temps and fluctuations as well as exterior paint. http://homeguides.sfgate.com/paint-garage-walls-39596.html

1) Can you do that same Saranwrap test on the ceiling/walls too plz?

2) What state are you in?

3) Can you find an area of sheetrock that (hopefully) has the USG brand on it?

4) Was ANYTHING used to clean the sheetrock before the FIRST priming? Any vacuuming done for dust removal?

Faron

1. Will do saran on. Wall

2 ft bend co tx (houston

3 will try but I've never noticed markings

4 house garage is 35 YO . we're not first owners so no idea if garage was dusted prior. We have scraped and sanded and cleaned prior to painting and hasn't stopped peeling. I will say that workmanship in general is tops for the house so s/b same for garage but not absolutely certain. Also don't know if prev owners had this problem but freshly painted garage when we bought it.

5. Exterior paint

Behr?

Behr and glidden, don't remember which I used when. Both chipped

Well IMO you should try some better pant.

Although, I don't think that is your main problem. Have you had anybody come and look at it?

Sorry for my delay here!

1) Any results of note for your wall/ceiling saran-wrap moisture test?

2) Are you able to find out what BRAND of drywall it is?

3) Is the garage sheetrock literally 35y/o too? Could it have been done much more recently? Such as...when some of the siding was redone that you've shown?

>>> What I've been getting at here, is the possibility that some of that horrendous Chinese-drywall could've been used here?!???!?! Some Gulf & Florida-Coast areas literally had to have new homes torn down because of that crap!

* IF the actual drywall job is 35y/o, then it's NOT a possibility.

* IF however, the garage-drywall was installed 3-5yrs ago (by some CHEAP contractor or homeowner), when the siding changes were going on, the odds of Chinese drywall go up some. This is why I had you looking for some drywall markings/brands!

* Because of the unusual scale of this peeling (bad pun there...I know!), this possibility kept gnawing at me!

Faron

Hi Faron, there was no moisture accumulated under Saran Wrap and we had rain last week.

Despite the many peeled spots, I could find none with a trademark so no info on Sheetrock brand

house is 35 yo. We've lived here 20 and no work has been done in garage during our time. we believe sometime in years 1-15 the prev owner did major remodeling but no way to tell if garage was affected--kinda doubt it.

1st, it does appear to be some sort of moisture issue. Firehorse above suggested using exterior paint on an interior application. PLEASE DO NOT EVER, EVER, EVER do this.

Contrary to popular myth, exterior paint is NOT more durable, it is significantly less durable in fact, particularly for cleaning. And most importantly there are many chemicals and additives in exterior paint (anti fungal, anti mold etc) that continually release. Outside is fine, interior applications are quite hazardous to your health.

2nd suggestion, would be to take a CLEAN black cloth and wipe down a bare spot on the exposed drywall. Do you get any dust/debris captured on the fabric?

I have never seen such uniform release of paint before. Did you own the home in it's entirety? I almost wonder if someone treated it with a clear 'waterproof' coating like a clear deck sealent or something similar.

Also, I meant to ask, during application is there any beading or unusual behavior from the paint?

Groundbeef1, this is inside a garage, not an interior living space. As such it is subject to extreme temperatures. A shed is also closed off but would you classify the inside of the shed as interior and use interior paint on it? Here is yet another reference citing the use of exterior paint on the inside of a garage: http://www.ehow.com/info_11373258_type-paint-use-garage-wall.html.

Groundbeef1, so you are saying that you would paint the exterior of your house with interior paint and it would be more durable? I'd like to see that.

bossyvossy, is there any chance that original 'fresh paint' was oil paint? If you are attempting to paint latex over a surface previously painted with an oil paint it will not adhere properly unless the surface was etched first with TSP and a coat of bonding primer. How many coats of paint are you putting on and how long are you waiting between primer & each coat? As you said the 'good paint lasts 2 years' it would seem that at some point you are using lesser quality paint and that will not help. In addition, are you storing and reusing any of the paint? If so, the paint should be stored inside. Paint in the can will not withstand extreme temperatures and if it has been exposed to freezing or extremely hot temperatures it is spoiled and will no longer be usable. It should be stored in a utility room or laundry room inside the house until ready for use---paint likes the same temperatures we do. If your neighbors don't have the same problem, I'd check the kind of paint they are using.

Hi BV!

You can disregard most of the preceding 5 posts!

* It makes NO difference whether an INT or EXT paint was used!!!

* I can't believe how many people are "taken in" on debates like this! The ONLY difference with Int v Ext paints is this......the Binder-Resin in Exterior paints doesn't set up as "Rigid" as in Interior paints. That's it!!!! Yes, ext paints do have a teeny-bit more mildewcide, but that's TOTALLY irrelevant to peeling issues.

* Also makes ZERO difference if prev paint was oil! If prev paint was KNOWN to be an Oil...AND has a SHEEN, a light/even scuff-sanding to dull the sheen is required. Even if prev paint was Latex with a S/G or Gloss sheen, the same scuffing advice applies. Obviously, dust-removal is mandated.

* I'm now 90% satisfied that it's not a "moisture transmission" issue, due to no wetness detected in the saran-wrap bubbles.

>>> I almost hate to say this now, but....once AGAIN....scrape off the loose stuff!!

* Next, get a good pole-sander & some 120-grit SANDING-SCREEN. Lightly/Evenly sand until you're just starting to scrape the sheetrock paper itself. Do one wall as a test here!!!

* Vacuum off most of the dust. Then do a couple damp sponge/rinse passes.

* Depending on humidity & temps, wait a WEEK OR MORE for drying.

* Now...call some stores & ask if they have STIX primer from Insl-X. Don't ask the price ($40/gal +). Just get it! ACE's can get it. Don't push it (or ANY) primer too thin. Apply @ ~~ a 300sf/gal rate. NO higher! Use a Wooster 1/2" nap Super-Fab roller-cover (there's a reason why I'm not saying 3/4" here...). This means, when half your gallon is used, you should've only covered a 10'x15' area.

* Now the paint! If you're spending $30+ per gallon, I don't care what brand!!!! Just get an Exterior Latex 100% Acrylic SEMI-GLOSS. Apply 2 FULL coats ~ 2-3hrs apart, at a 350sf/gal rate.

Now the waiting begins.................!

Faron

Faron is laying out an excellent plan.

Waiting for the results.

Thank you all so much 4 input. We used Ext water based flat white paint. We have never noticed any kind of sheen so assume flat paint has been the only thing used.

no bubbles

faron, why semi gloss? Don't like that finish on walls, ceiling too?

pictures follow. Here is paper towel after wiping on raw Sheetrock--nithing

Wall tests, nothing so far and it rained last night. However, this is dryest part of year for moisture testing, I dunno.

Oops dupl pic

When doing the saran-wrap test, the tape has to cover all edges, to completely seal off the "pouch" that's created. Damn this is strange!! It's like someone coated your sheetrock with silicone (or similar) water-sealer!!

Get going on that plan now! ;-)

Post pics of what you buy!

I stress S/G in garages/shops because those areas tend to get dirtiest/wettest. Think about why your car is glossy......! Yes, even S/G on ceiling.

Faron

Tks. Will seal this saran sq.. Others are sealed.

It seems the general consensus is that it is a humidity issue. Thing is, Houston = humidity and nobody else in my sub has this prob. So, next thing to consider is prepping: What was done or not done b4 my time? After we took ownership?

Did I mention our garage is not insulated? Is that a factor? I am not averse to hard diy work but it has to yield good, permanent results. With regards to this project, it had been a losing battle. Don't get me wrong I'm not rejecting your suggestions it just that I absolutely shudder at the thought of doing this again for the xxxth time.

IME, most home problems stem from very easy, very simple problems that dominoed b/c of bandaid solutions. I kinda worry slapping good paint is just bandaid approach.

Just venting and thinking bout loud in frustration.

BV-

Re-read my "long-ish" post a couple back...

I hear ya on your new comments! I took all previous statements/tests/pics into consideration when I hatched that plan.

2 choices now:

1) Get going on the "Stix" plan, OR....

2) Tear down the sheetrock, & install new.

>>> Hate to sound "blunt" here, but words ain't gonna get that paint to stick....

Faron

From those pics it looks obvious that the primer did not stick, why?, cannot tell from here. I sure have never seen anything like that.

@Firehorse5 "Groundbeef1, so you are saying that you would paint the exterior of your house with interior paint and it would be more durable? I'd like to see that."

No- What I'm saying is that for interior applications exterior paint is significantly less durable that interior paint. Exterior paint has a little more flexibility, a lot wash-ability.

Plus, exterior paint (as noted above) has unhealthy additives that are not good to be exposed to on interior applications.

Try to keep up.

@ the OP - Bossyvossy-

The fact that it peels so uniformly, down to the face paper is highly unusual. I've seen a lot of paint complaints, but this one is really unique.

I'd be curious to try a couple of things.

1. If you spray some water from a bottle (like an old windex bottle) on the bare drywall what does it do? Does it soak in, or bead and roll off?

2. I'd be tempted to hang a fresh sheet of drywall in one section, even overhang it on the existing and paint it to see what the result is. However, as you noted it can take 2 years to fail, so that's not really practical.

3. If #1 results in the water beading/running I'd say someone at some point sprayed Thompson or something similar on the boards. Clearly the primer isn't penetrating the drywall and affecting adhesion.

In that case, you'd have to remove the old and rehang new drywall. Do you know if it's insulated behind the drywall? I wonder if either the insulation was hung w/out vapor-barrier face paper OR if they used the old blow insulation (and no vapor barrier). Is there an area you could cut a hole and peer in with a flashlight?

Not insulated. I'll do spray test and report back.

Either you didn't prime over the drywall or the primer is pulling off the drywall. Which is it?

About 5 years ago I finished my garage out with drywall, primed with Glidden el cheapo PVA primer, and used the super cheap Glidden semi-gloss interior paint. Sprayed and back rolled. No, it won't win any awards but it's not peeling. I'm located in the SE, we have very high humidity here as well.

This looks entirely like a surface prep issue not a paint issue.

@christopher Nelson: isn't that the strangest thing how primer had not stuck???! It's just the earnest thing.

faron I'm going to Ace tomorrow to order that primer you suggest

Faron, if after sanding and dusting entire garage, some of the paint still remains on walls/ceiling, will the stix primer seal the old paint so it doesn't fall off in the future ?

Lucky,

It's always the preparation and the more expensive the paint, the more precise the preparation needs to be.

Faron, the paint is peeling away from the mud seam which insulates it from the drywall. That may rule out a drywall issue and take us back to dust or moisture.

The paint doesn't appear to be peeling away from the wallboard where it's nailed to ceiling joists.

Brush-

The one suggestion here of seeing what water does when sprayed on has some merit! I'm certainly curious as to that result!!

>>> The fact that no water appeared under the saran-wrap, AND no insulation, AND adequate eaves-venting....took away the moisture issue for ME anyway!

This means that the humidity is THE SAME on BOTH sides of that sheetrock. There's no drastically "dryer side" to force migration of water. To ME....something unique HAPPENED, or WAS APPLIED TO that surface.....

BV1-

I'm starting to think that just RE-ROCKING that interior might be the best use of your time...overall!

Faron

Faron see my ? Two posting above re stix and old paint

Absolutely no condensation behind Saran and this is same block that I retaped per a poster's suggestion

@ Brushworks, paint doesn't seem to be peeling at stud lines but I don't recall saying anything about mud lines. Here is a pic where paint has fallen and there is a whitish substance that I'm guessing is mud

After all of your valuable input and after thinking hard on our actions and examining records, we're leaning to the conclusion that it is a prep issue and builder or his contractor didn't prime.

here why I think so:

about 10 yes ago we converted a 4th car stall into much needed closets. The new Sheetrock was primed/painted with average quality paint and so far. IT HAS NOT PEELED. Ceiling inside closets and any wall existing pre-closets are peeling. Not one little bit in 10 yrs when it comes to closer add on

The day we were considering that, we were staring really hard at the closets. A neighbor walked by and stopped to say hi. When he realized we were just staring at walls he thought we were pretty weird (b4 we explained)

i hope to find help to scrape ceiling,. I'm dreading that part.

faron pls comment on my ? Re sealer and oldf paint

BV-

* Read that "Plan post" of mine. IMO...KEEP SANDING with the drywall screen until you're JUST scratching into the sheetrock's outer paper. One this outer paper, I'd use ~~ 180-220 grit screen.

* In this rare case, I'm suggesting that (lightly scratching into the face-paper...)!

* Vacuum most of the dust off, using a "fine-dusts/drywall" bag/filter.

* As mentioned...lightly damp-mop off the rest. YES, you'll be getting your SLIGHTLY scratched-up facepaper a teensy bit damp!

* After drying a couple days or more, roll-on the Stix, and paint!

* Again, consider a test area or wall.

>>> OR <<<

Just tear it all out. That may be less of a headache..............AND PROBABLY FASTER, with a better final look!! If it were ME here, I'd be halfway done getting medieval in there, & just rip it the hell out!!

Faron

I read it, I read it! Just wanting to make sure. Will work up numbers for replacing. My neck truly does hurt just thinking about working the ceiling

You know, back in my new construction days, we painted plenty of garages with no primer and never had problems. It's important to know that if you skip priming and just use the paint, this doesn't automatically mean paint failure. You could just have some bad drywall there that paint just isn't going to stick to for whatever reason. I will say though that when you have a special situation like this where you are having a hard time getting paint to adhere and you apply Kilz2 as your problem solving primer, you haven't really made an attempt to solve the problem. That's how bad of a primer Kilz2 is. I'm not saying that if you use Stix or some other high quality bonding primer that your problems will be solved for sure because I don't know and this situation seems really strange to be having mass paint failure in a garage like this when moisture isn't the culprit. All I'm saying is that it's not hard to get paint to stick to drywall...like you said, all the other garages in your neighborhood are fine. One other thing comes to mind here though....what if the original paint was frozen and used after the paint thawed or the paint was applied when the temps were too cold? That could screw up adhesion for sure.

Can you suggest other high quality primers other than stix?

frozen paint in Houston? Unlikely but I guess orig paint could have frozen in transit and thawed In Houston--that I'll never know.

unlike prof. Painters, the only way I have learned as a diy homeowner is through mistakes/ disasters. i can live with that...sort of

So it looks like the paint has adhered to the mud joints but not the drywall paper facing. Interesting. Maybe you can get a Sherwin Williams paint rep to come look at that or a Benjamin Moore rep. I want to suggest using BM's Fresh Start but I may consider using CoverStain which is oil based for something like that too.

We have the identical issue in our garage in an 80s home near Houston. Did you ever find a solution that worked? We just scraped, sanded and applied fresh paint with primer and it‘s peeling right off. No idea if the drywall is newer than the home. Thank you!

My family also has this issue in our garage in Houston. It falls off in sheets and the drywall underneath looks perfectly clean. I am assuming it's a defect in the sheetrock and not a paint issue. Our garage was remodeled about 4 years ago and the paint began peeling almost immediately afterwards.

We have had the exact same problem in our garage in Houston. We have owned the home for 35 years. The paint has always peeled and it doesn't matter what paint or prep that we do. The paint falls off in sheets and it also looks perfectly clean underneath. We are facing the same problem once again and we do not know where to turn. We are considering replacing all the drywall. Does anyone in this climate have any luck with new products on the market? Do you have any new suggestions on how we can proceed?

Also in Houston with the exact same problem. Home was built in ‘65 and we bought it in 2018. I was hoping to find an answer before attempting to paint but it looks like the only real option is to replace the drywall :/

Hey everyone, we're having the exact same issue in our garage in Houston. Were any of you able to find a solution?