Cold kitchen to be renovated-1880 victorian

8 years ago

We are renovating our kitchen this spring and I'd like to get some advice on heating our always cold kitchen. We are in 1880 victorian in southern New York with a hodgepodge of hvac. Most of house is radiator heat, one room has radiant floor heat and kitchen has 2 baseboards and 2 toe kicks in the island but the room always feels cold. The temp on the thermostat in winter is always about 5 degrees below the setting which we have on a programmable thermostat set to heat at 68 degrees from 6 am to 11 pm., when it goes down to 59. 1 of the baseboards can stay with the renovation though it's not pretty. It's 5 feet long near the kitchen desk nook area (8 feet x 5 feet). The other baseboard (4 feet long) is where a future floor to ceiling cabinet will go- this is in the main part of the kitchen that is 20 ft by 13 ft.
We have hardwood floors and will have Quartz counters- another chilly surface.
We added an in floor ducted ac when we moved in though some of those vents will have to be moved due to cabinetry.
I know converting toe kicks is an option, though noisy.
Is adding a ducted heating system for this old house kitchen an option? I read about mini duct heating. There won't be a whole lot of floor space for addition baseboard once cabinets are in because there are 5 doors/entrances into the kitchen.
Any ideas? Thanks for your input.

Featured Answer

ionized_gw

8 years ago

Forget about adding yet another system just to get heat in the kitchen, mini ducts or mini split. Although I am a booster of the latter and it just might be an last ditch option, but I can't imagine it in your situation.. If you are talking high velocity mini ducts, that is, I believe, a specialized furnace that you'd need to add for just one room.

bcarlson is sending you down the right track if you just need to add heat to the area. He did not get into all the details. You should definitely consider adding radiant floor heat if that is possible. You need to get a good hydronic heating person to look at your boiler and the mix of heat emitters that you have and that you want. A good designer can help you fit it all together. I'd keep an eye on designing the system with a new efficient boiler down the line if you plan on staying for any length of time in the home.

As bcarlson wrote, aluminum fin convectors need higher temps than cast iron radiators. Toe kick heaters also work better at higher water temperatures. (At lower temperatures, you need more or bigger and that means even more noise.) Radiant floor heat needs low temperatures. To do all this, you need the controls, pumps and valves to make them all work with the same boiler. A modern boiler works best with as low a water temp as practical. You really need someone that knows what they are doing.

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Comments (6)

Bruce in Northern Virginia
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
My best guess is that the system is tuned for the iron radiators, which emit heat for a long time due to their mass, but the baseboard units are cooling down quickly and because they are copper. A system designed for radiator heat may operate at about 140-150 degrees, while baseboard units need more like 180 degree water to work effectively.

You may find that you have to zone the system and run the water at a higher temp in the area with baseboard heating.

Mini-ducts and forced air would be an option, but it sounds like you already have forced air A/C and hot water heat. I don't know if you can add new mini-ducts to an existing force air system.

Bruce
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callights
8 years ago
Can you add radiant floor heat?
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Katonahmom
Original Author
8 years ago
Thanks for the comments. We could add radiant heating but prefer not to rip up the hardwood floor.

Bruce, the kitchen is on a separate thermostat zone. I tried tweaking the settings on the programmable thermostat since posting my query. I now have it go to 72 at 4 am which gets to a comfortable 68 by the time we come down between 6 and 7. On warmer days recently the temp was true to the thermostat. However we had a very cold days this past week and I fell back to a 63 degree morning temp with therm set at 72. My tweaking lets me know my kitchen is at least capable of getting warm. I just can't seem to get the right settings to have it consistently warm on winter days.
callights
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
You might try one of the various "smart" thermostats. My Nest is excellent at learning when in the morning to turn on the heat so the zone reaches the desired temperature by the set time. It adjusts for your house and the current weather. For example, when it's very cold my heat might turn on at 5:30am. In the spring, my heat might not turn on until 7:30.

I believe the Ecobee and the Lyric both have this feature, as do some of the more feature-filled thermostats from the big HVAC companies.

Do you have access to the underside of the kitchen floor from your basement or a crawlspace? You might be able to add radiant floor heat from the underside without removing the existing hardwood floor. Finding places for ducts and radiators in kitchens is always difficult, so radiant is always my personal preference.

Finally, I'd ask a professional to come check out your system. It sounds like the water temperature in your kitchen zone is too low to reasonably heat that space with the radiators you have.
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Air and Energy Soutions
8 years ago
Have you considered a ductless split heat pump system for this space. These are cost-effective where ductwork just doesn't work well in older houses, energy efficient, and extremely quiet. My favorite brands are Fujitsu, LG, and Mitsubishi. They will provide SEER ratings to around 21 and winter heating without additional strip heat. I like em!

I'm not in your area but have information on ductless split heat pumps on my website at Air and Energy Solutions
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Cold kitchen to be renovated-1880 victorian

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