Well,this thread has by now gotten out of hand,in the sense that it's not really talking about my specific issue anymore, which is OK, of course,but I think I better stop reading it since it's starting to frustrate me. My RdV is a very large,(6 or 7 feet tall) healthy plant,did defoliate with bspot this year, as have many other of my old roses (I'm trying to give up spraying entirely, and the weather has been less dry than usual...),literally, my only gripe with it was it's inability to produce a flush of flowers,it did plenty of buds which just dried out, or opened warped and aborted-looking, with only one or two good flowers. After digging it up,I am not surprised...and I think if anyone other than Ingrid had bothered to read my second post on the subject,they would not be either. If giving the thing decent conditions doesn't work, I'm sp-ing it; I don't want to do" penguins in the desert" either. I understand the thing about own-roots; I tried an own root Chateau de Clos Vougeot, clbg,and in three years it remained 8 inches tall. I decided to try it grafted, and my new one is growing enthusiastically. But I also had a total failure with a grafted Gloire de Dijon; maybe it just got too weakened by the fact that it was growing in overly poor soil for it's first couple years, and just never recovered.Both of the rugosas I tried were grafted,and both failed ( all that grew on Wild Edric was the rootstock). But I see no reason to jump to the conclusions that are being presented here! Kim's and Jeri's comments at the beginning were pertinent...

Yes, RdV can be grown in container. If it is large enough it should be able to live there permanently. I use a bit of extra sand, course compost (bark, woodchip), a bit of cowmanure and sometimes even a bit of clay (dry and powdered). Then I just replace the top layer with new compost once a year, it has a tendency to slowly disappear by its' self. I have had trouble with roses in peat based potting mixes, especially after the first year or so, and this is the alternative approach which has worked much better. Good compost with some real soil from the ground can also work. If you have an ownroot plant I would not mind the size too much really. Just be patient and care for it; and it will come around.

Ingrid, I thought Marchesa was a Portland, too, but HMF, ARE and RVR all list her as HP, so who knows. Whatever she is, I do like her a lot. Buford, IâÂÂve been following your posts about the yard âÂÂdigâ and can imagine itâÂÂs a muddy mess with all these storms. Mine is a gushy nightmare even without being dug up. Thank goodness I havenâÂÂt put out my fall seeds yet or my neighbors downhill would be growing some pretty poppies and stock next year :) And evidently all the work weâÂÂve done to correct the basement flooding issue hasnâÂÂt worked! Our conditions should be about the same, so I think Marchesa would do well for you and maybe a RdV from a different source would do better, as well. Mine from ARE is the thornless one. I top dressed her with manure and mulched with pine straw when I planted her, but havenâÂÂt given her any special treatment. Her foliage has been good, and she has been a better bloomer than I expected for a first year rose with questionable rebloom reports from others. SheâÂÂs not lighting the world on fire with her prolific blooming by any means, but after her spring flush, she has given me a handful of beautiful, smelly purple blooms about once a month. I was worried about planting her in full sun, but didnâÂÂt have a part shade spot available. SheâÂÂs handled the sun just fine and maybe thatâÂÂs what is helping her to rebloom. No radiated heat in her spot like Ingrid has, though, and different soil, plenty of rainfall & humidity that IngridâÂÂs climate doesnâÂÂt give her either.

that in Graham Stuart Thomas' book on antique roses he specifically mentioned that RDV was in his mind the bluest rose he had ever seen, and that it was notably more "blue" than many of the modern so-called "blue" roses. Obviously since RDV's coloring varies a lot that "blue" only shows up when it's growing in the right soils, however Thomas must have seen it because he wrote that he often wore RDV as a lapel flower to rose functions to remind people that the rose existed and that it could be an unusually "blue" rose.