With the range in the peninsula, I would not make it one level. The riser provides at least some protection from the fire. If you will have kids would be coloring or doing homework at that peninsula I would try to move the range off of it altogether as I know my kids would have papers falling over, pencils rolling away into the pots, etc.

Hi Duke, I think you'll get a lot more helpful advice if you provide a floor plan. Also, I know I'm not a fan of the range on the peninsula, most here aren't. Are you planning/do you have kids? That would be a no go in our house.

Also, switch out lower doors for drawers where possible.

I agree with making the lowers all drawers when possible, and have doors near the corners so not to have dead space there. Not sure if that was the plan already.

I'm also not a fan of the range/cooktop on islands or peninsulas. But sometimes that's the only space they can go. So if you please post a picture of the surrounding rooms, it would help quite a bit. :)

"The space where the bar is in the mock-up is currently a wall which will have to be removed"

Have a structural engineer verify that this is not a loadbearing wall, and if it is design a proper support beam for it.

You can't just start knocking out walls.

Have you considered a corner range? The 30" range would probably work better, but here is a similar perimeter layout, maybe with a 36" cooktop:

Corner range pics.

crl, good point on the kids, we don't have any yet but that would be something to think about. The thinking was that the open space would look nicer and less "modern" without the riser, we want to try and stay period appropriate for the feeling of the kitchen as much as possible. We originally wanted to keep the range in the center of the other wall and move the fridge but with taking the wall down there is nowhere else to put the fridge really, we currently have it them against each other and it is a nightmare.

my four sons, I will see what I can find for reference and add it, good point. See my comment above about the range. I agree with the drawers, they are either drawers or cabinets with the pull out drawers.

houserookie, as for the dead space we are going to use the blind corner pull out shelves which should hopefully use the space well. See my comment above about the range also.

mama goose, what a terribly good idea! I never even considered that. How do you address the space behind the stove? i.e. if something falls there or something? would you build-out the wall to make it flush?

edit: Mama, sorry i missed that link before in your post, that is super helpful.

No to the range on the peninsula for the reasons stated. Off-hand, I would place the range where the glass cabinets are and put the sink on the peninsula. This gives you a nice, long prep area in front of the window where most of your time is actually spent. A 2D of the floorplan with measurements would really help us help you better.

ETA: Mama Goose's idea with the angled range would also work well and give a bit more space between fridge and range. Most people angle the back wall. There would be backsplash behind just like elsewhere in the kitchen. No open space for things to fall behind.

lazy, I agree on the wall. I did have the concern about that and the kitchen guy said they could address that with the engineer that they work with on some of the materials. though I thought that was a bit strange and would still prefer to pull in a structural to take a look at it of course.

funkycamper, agree on the plans, I will have to draw something for you tonight when I am back at the house. If you moved the range what would you do with the fridge? Working in the kitchen with them next to each other has been terrible.

In the pic I posted, they have a right triangle of counter top behind the cooktop, but you can block off the corner to make the back wall parallel with the range, if you plan a backsplash feature. Or build a little shelf/cubby for s&p, olive oil, etc. into the angle. I added a link to other pics to my second post. (I think we were cross-posting ;).

If I were going to keep that range in the peninsula, I would definitely go induction, which is worlds safer, and super efficient. (I would go induction regardless, just for the breeze of cleanup.) If you aren't familiar with the technology, visit the Appliance Forum. Most folks on GW have gone to either an induction range (Elux and Bosch seem favored) or an oven & induction cooktop configuration. Good luck!

Thank you for the input Miz! we have an induction plate we use next to the stove for an extra burner but we are pretty set on gas just because of the way we cook.

Also, here are some additional images for you, hopefully they help, I will try and get more later.

Oh, my. When you're finished with that kitchen may I have it? I'll clean grout off backsplash tile, or paint ceilings. ;)

Mama goose, you are a genius. ;)

houserookie, are you trying to get me to come to your house and clean grout? ;)

Mama goose, you are welcome in my kitchen any time! We'll have a grout-cleaning party. Do you seal grout as well? Hahahahahahahaha

I actually love your current kitchen. It's super cute! Although if it's not functional and doesn't meet your lifestyle needs, I can understand your desire to change it. But, gosh, it's darling. If I needed more cabinets, I'd be fighting MG for them. :)

Here are the dimensions we need

Yellow & Light Blue: room width and length

Red Box: Window width and distance from corner

Orange Circle What's going on in this area? Does the doorway from the porch enter into a hallway that goes straight down toward the dining/living areas? Or does the hallway end requiring you to turn into the kitchen to get to the dining/living areas? If it's a full hallway, why do you need a door in the kitchen? Why not just walk around a few feet? This would give you a bit more wall space to work with.

Small Pink Circle: How many inches from the wall to the door frames for the porch doors? I'm thinking of putting the fridge on the wall, insetting it, to give more space in the kitchen but it doesn't look like there is enough depth for that. But even a niche partially insetting it could help a lot in your small space.

Could the two porch doors be moved "west" a foot or two? Or would that mess up with door alignment to your interior hall? How wide is that hall?

Funky, I will get those numbers for you tonight. I wish the kitchen was as functional as it is cute, my wife does a great job with what she is given but it is rough, doors don't stay closed or fit well haha :)

I need to point out that the enclosed porch is really an exterior addition that is not super great, it does not stay very well conditioned. That wall between the pink and yellow is actually an exterior wall with a window (which is planned to be enclosed) and the back wall of the porch, the one to the left of the yellow, is also exterior wall. Sorry, the diagram is not clear on that. The yellow/orange space is a mess of doors, I will take a picture so you can see what it is better than me trying to describe it. I forgot to draw in a short wall in the circle off of that corner where there is a door frame with no door, we plan on removing it to open the entry way to the kitchen and make it feel more open. The door to the dinning room at the bottom of the kitchen is a swinging door.

Digging though old pictures now for some better shots.

Edit: OK here are some more shots to give some perspective, not clean shots, we are making jam, pasta, making and canning stock etc so don't be to upset by the mess:)

(back porch so you see what I mean with the walls.

Lisa,

Wow! Thanks, I am super intrigued by your rework, I think that does solve some issues we had with losing the hood and range as back wall focal points. I can see where dimensions are becoming a problem, I will measure everything tonight after work and update everyone so you are not shooting blind. This has already brought up a lot of really good points, I very much appreciate it and will be sure to update ASAP.

Lisa's plan is awesome. I just made a small change due to my idea of insetting the fridge into the wall to that porch. It gives you the option of a bit more counter space and cabinets on the wall behind next to the fridge (behind the island). That would also make an excellent location for a pantry wall. So if space could be created on that porch for the fridge, it could be an option but I realize that might be more remodeling than you were actually planning on doing.

funky,

did you attach a plan? I don't see anything, it might be me though. I will get you some pictures tonight so you can see the setup for the porch, we had discussed that idea before and it is a good one but the problem again is the nature of that back porch. It is not large or well done, if we put the fridge into that space we would need to do some significant work (I assume) because that is a exterior wall and we would have to to move the back doors and windows on the porch to accommodate. It would be awesome to expand the kitchen completely on to the porch and make it much larger but that is getting into extension territory which I think would explode the budget. :(

EDIT: I want to show you some images of what we want the kitchen to feel like as far as colors and textures, some inspirational pictures so you can see what we are (hopefully) going for (from the wife's pinterest board) :

Glad you like my idea! (and thanks, funky!)

Love Funky's idea to recess the fridge into the porch.

How wide is the existing window that looks out to the porch? If it's wide enough and you have enough depth without changing doors, you could use the existing window header to hold a recessed fridge.

If that's not possible, that space might work for a shallow pantry instead. Either idea should require minimal exterior work because you're reusing an existing header but you will want to double check with your contractor before committing to a plan that calls for such a move.

The downside of moving the fridge to that area, though, is that you lose the smooth path of ice (fridge)-water (sink)-stone (counter)-fire (range) while prepping a meal. You'd need to move past the range to go from fridge to sink and then back to range. People do it all the time but it's not as ideal as a ice-water-stone-fire path similar to the one in my Plan A. Kitchens are all about compromises; you'll need to decide which compromises you're willing to make.

A recessed fridge will impact the island seating aisle since a fridge door will stick out at least 3" from the wall. A recessed pantry would be less of an issue.

Oh, and I love your inspiration pics!

I'll leave your layout up to the pros, but I wanted to say that I love your (your wife's!) inspiration pictures and I cannot wait to watch your kitchen progress:)

Nancy thank you for the kind words!

Lisa, funky, mama, etc. please see the below pictures of the space, hopefully they will better reflect the layout so that you can visualize it better. Also below are scans of a rough measurements the father in law did with some updates from me, let me know if you need anything else!

small wall section planned to come out to open up space

window onto back porch

back door to porch

The wall to come out

I thought I put the diagram in a separate post. It wouldn't go through in main post. Odd. I saw it post but now it's not there. Will try again.

I agree with Lisa's assessment in that it puts the fridge out of the correct work flow. There are times when this makes sense due to space issues and, in a smaller kitchen, the walk isn't too far from fridge to sink. You do want to ensure there is plenty of space to walk behind the range so the cook doesn't get crowded. With all that said, Lisa's plan is superior for work flow. My plan gives a bit more room for pantry or extra counter/cabinet storage. And I have a weird quirk in that I dislike a fridge being prominent in a kitchen. So I'm presenting it as an option, not as a superior option. Make sense?

Hope things posts this time!

Oh, I also meant to say that your inspiration photos are gorgeous. I'll come back later and review your most recent photos and information later.

Funky, I like your revision, I think it would be great but I am not sure space would permit :( I look forward to your review!

Based on your 136" measurement, you don't have enough for an island. If you take 136 and take away 25" for the cabinets, you have 111" left. Then to have an island with cabinets reduces your space by another 42". That leaves you only 69". Not enough for two aisles. You want at least 42" for each aisle.

cpartist, I agree, I think it will have to be reworked, hopefully funky or someone else has an idea!

I need to warn you. I'm not one of the talented design gurus here, just an interested amateur. I think Lisa was working with the wrong dimensions, correct? I wrote them on the diagram. Please let me know if they're correct.

If so, cpartist is right. You don't have room for an island. I left off your peninsula only because you never answered the question Lisa asked: If a peninsula is put in the location in your original plan, will you have at least 60" from the edge of the peninsula to the edge of your dining table? That is the minimum needed to have seating at both and still have room to walk if people are seated at both locations.

Anyway, the best I could do is this:

First, let me know if the dimensions are accurate.

I didn't bother to draw uppers in on the fridge wall.

The blue line will be about 117" fro the end of the counter to the edge of the kitchen. The yellow line measure will be about 86" from north counter edge to south counter edge and about 81" across where the fridge is (unless you get a true counter-depth/built-in).

A lot of people do something a bit different in kitchens like yours that adds counter space and storage. They go with 30" deep counters. This adds a lot more counter space and, if you get custom cabinets, also a lot more storage with the deeper drawers. It will allow you to make a regular fridge look more built-in as the counter-depth will come out to the fridge door (you do need to allow for door swing). It also gives more space behind the range for less grease splatter on the backsplash and behind the sink for cleaning items (or pretties). If you do that, the north/south green line would be 74" and the east/west will be 105". Without an island or other blockage, there is plenty of room to walk from fridge to sink so crossing over the cook's area isn't a problem.

It's not the most creative layout but it is a functional one.

I know your wife wants some glass uppers. I wouldn't recommend them right next to the range and hood due to potential grease collection in that proximity, harder to keep clean. Also, keep in mind, your hood should be larger than your cooktop. I think you're going for a 36" cooktop? If so, you need a 42" hood. With a 30" cooktop, you need a 36" hood. If you go with the wider hood and have a couple inches clearance on each side before the upper cabinets start, then glass doors there should work fine.

Hope this helps a bit. Have you read the "New to Kitchens? Read Me First" thread? If not, please do. It kinda bounces around from pages 1-3.

GW is glitchy lately. It wouldn't let me post the diagram above. Trying again.

Well, it looks like it posted. Let me know if it has disappeared again.

Could you please draw the first floor to scale on graph paper where 1 sq. = 1 sq. ft.? A hand drawing is fine, as long as the measurements are basically accurate. The whole floor plan posted higher up is missing a bunch of walls and measurements. The better and more complete the plan we have to work from, the more relevant our suggestions will be.

Funky,

Thanks for the comments, sorry for missing the question from Lisa, yes we would be right at 60" clearance and those new dimensions are much more accurate. Interesting about doing the 30" cabinets, we will keep that in mind as well! I will try and read that intro with the wife. I think we are boxed in by the space and will be forced into a more functional layout, I wish we had the space to do something interesting with the layout.

Jillius, I will be out of town for the weekend but will try to find some graph paper and do that for you asap.

FYI, you can print graph paper. Just google and grab one to print. I have done that a few times to hold me over until I could get to the office supply store for the pads Might as well buy the three pack, IME.

As has been pointed out, you don't have enough room for the island plan I drew for you. Accurate dimensions make all the difference. = )

However, you would have room for an island without seating. IOW, an island that is only 27" deep (24" cabs with 1.5" counter overhang). That would give you a 42" aisle between sink run and island and a 41 3/4" aisle between island and porch wall.

But that's not the only option.

I echo Funky's suggestion to do 30" deep counters. The other plus is that it's easier to hide a standard depth fridge's bulk, which saves you money because standard depth fridges are cheaper than counter depth fridges.

Also, her U lay-out is along the lines of what I was considering proposing if your kitchen wasn't wide enough for an island. You may still be able to include a peninsula for seating. I need to do the math to make sure there's enough room for one that will have enough room for at least 2 stools. I'll work on that later.

Glad to hear that you'll have at least 60" of space between peninsula counter and table.

Crl, great idea!

Lisa, that is great, thanks for your help, I like the 30" idea and will discuss it. My wife would like to keep the peninsula if possible. I am still not sure if the fridge would work on that wall but I like the idea if it.

I did discuss it with her and while she is not super excited about doing a corner range I think that might take care of some of the issues though she said and I imagine she is correct I may need to let go of my 36" to make it fit :(

I am not sure how to proceed right now with the kitchen people, should I contact them and try to address some of the issues y'all have raised? I would hate for him to be working away on a design we change without discussing it with him.

I think we are boxed in by the space and will be forced into a more functional layout, I wish we had the space to do something interesting with the layout.

HUH? A more functional layout is the BEST layout. There is nothing better than a super-functional kitchen. Nothing. Don't get pulled into the dark side of wanting something that is interesting but less functional.

And besides that, once your basic layout is finalized, folks here can help you with all sorts of interesting details regarding good, accessible storage options that puts the items that you need where you need them so you're not traipsing all over the kitchen in order to cook basic items.

To me, a super-functional kitchen with great mise-en-place storage, that is spacious and doesn't feel crowded, makes cooking more enjoyable, has good lighting, and is finished with aesthetically pleasing materials IS interesting.

I find myself in a rare situation in that I'm disagreeing with Lisa. This NEVER happens, lol. But I don't think a 27" deep island is all that helpful. And I wouldn't want my aisles to be that narrow. I think it will make the island look like an after-thought. Something that was crowded in there just to have an island. I used to have a 24" square work table in a former kitchen. It was minimally useful. It was a good place to stage things but not quite big enough to actually use as, without a back wall to hold things on, items regularly fell on the floor. I don't think another 3" is enough to make a different. My husband put a 36" square top on it and it became useful at that size.

And, besides, if you really want a peninsula for some seating and it does sound like you have the space for it, you wouldn't be able to also have an island without things being way too chopped up in your smaller space.

I just wanted to say that on my layout diagram, the fridge can be anywhere along that wall. You might want it a bit closer to the dining room for easy access for drinks/snacks so someone doesn't have to come all the way into the cook's zone to access it.

How high off the floor is that central kitchen vent hood? At six foot one in height, I'm cringing looking at your initial picture!!!!