With apologies I'm not answering your questions but some things I noticed:

- How big is the landing on the stairwell behind the kitchen? It looks like the door swing takes up the whole landing (if the line there indicates the size of the landing.) That would be dangerous and probably not to code.

- The angles in the back hall closet are going to reduce how much you can hang on the rod.

- I'd move the door to BR2 to the right so it's closer to the private spaces and further from the public spaces

- Do you need two stairways going down? Stairs are expensive and take up lots of room.

- If this is to be handicap accessible, have you looked up accessible bathrooms to see how much space is needed? It doesn't look like there's enough turning radius near the toilet or shower in the master bath. The hall bath is also not accessible. Do you need an elevator to go down to the walkout basement?

- Draw in furniture to scale in BR3. The angled walls make it tricky so make sure yours will fit. With no dimensions on the drawing it's hard to tell.

- The kitchen island looks too long for the space as the walkway above it crosses under the opening to the breakfast area. With the ref on the opposite side of the kitchen from the breakfast area, people will be walking through the work zone, past the cooktop, to get drinks from the ref. I'd recommend posting on the kitchens forum for really good layout feedback.

- Lots of floor space in the WIC (maybe - no dimensions) where typically you don't need a wide walkway unless you'll have a bench in there.

Before I say anything, I want to point out that I'm sure you spent a great dial of time on this plan, and that different people live differently with different lifestyles.

The things that jumped out for me were:

- no privacy for the bedroom newar the entry.

- where are you going to put your office while the kids are still young?

- When you have 3 kids, where are all the toys going to be stored?

- off centered sink in the island. In struggling with that myself. I like symmetry. Think if this is something you will hate or not really mind later on.

- think about furniture placement. I could not read the size of the master bedroom, and I don't know the size of the widow there. Where is the bed and night stands going to go?

- do you mind that guests in the great room can see right inside your bedroom when you open the door? Can you re-work the entrance to the master and switch it with the entrance to the basement?

- how about a mud room/area?

I know some comments may not apply to your lifestyle, climate, or taste. Those are just my thoughts. Others may even see things I didn't. Good luck with your new build! :)

Along with the other comments so far, my comments are:

Is the only way into your master by walking through the breakfast room?

Bath one would never be ADA compliant with the toilet like that in the corner. Impossible to get in and might not even be enough room if not handicapped.

How large is the closet in the angled bedroom? It looks like if lucky you could put maybe 3 feet of hanging space there. Is there a reason you want it angled at such a strange angle?

I would definitely post in the kitchen forum for advice. I personally don't have a problem with the sink off center but how do you intend for the rest of the kitchen to work?

Chicagoans - thank you for the feedback!

For the basement door, the builder is moving the door back to that line (he had it there before and it just didn't erase well) and I already requested a large landing. My parent's house has a door that opens up towards the stairs and there is NO landing so that was one of my first requests. :)

He is reworking the entry/mud area, moving that closet, adding a built in bench/lockers in the corner, and adding a small desk. Sorry I don't have the most updated plan...still waiting to hear back....

I agree with moving the BR2 door further back.

2nd set of stairs are in the garage and would be for people coming to service the home needing access to the utility room. That way they don't have to traipse through the house. I have had muddy/snowy boots on my carpets too many times. But having them is kind of limiting what we can do with the mud area and BR3 so I have been debating their necessity.

Told the builder from the start we wanted handicap accessible and I even asked him about the guest bath and he said its big enough for a wheelchair for using the toilet. I don't think we need the guest shower to be accessible but would like the master, just in case. Master will be a walk in shower with no door or lip. I will have to do more research.

BR3 I haven't loved but did put in a queen bed to scale and it did fit along the wall towards the garage. We could do bunks in there and that would leave plenty of room for toys. Maybe even a built in window seat with storage.

The kitchen island will be 10'x4' and will have sink, dishwasher, and I'm hoping to be able to have 4 chairs for casual dining. Kitchen (to the arch) will be 15'x17', breakfast nook 13'x15', and walk in pantry 5'x10'. I thought the layout did a good job of separating work zones but would like others opinions and experiences. I think there is maybe too much room between the island and cooktop so maybe if that is shortened it would help with the flow issue. I guess I thought ppl would walk around the back side of the island to get to the fridge. Maybe I could switch the fridge and oven placement? I requested the sink off center and next to the dishwasher (and close to the breakfast nook) to make that side of the island the "cleanup zone." This, I thought, would leave more uninterrupted countertop to the left for "prepping zone" (which is between the sink and fridge) and across from the stove top "cooking zone". I am willing to sacrifice symmetry here for functionality. The pull out garbage will be in the far left side of the island. My husband and I both love to cook and he loves to grill and use the smoker outside as well. We will have a grill, sink, mini fridge, and countertop with prep area out on the covered porch so that will cut down on the traffic from kitchen to the outdoor cooking area. (Posted this in kitchen forum as well)

House rookie -

BR2 could have a privacy issue. I'm starting to wonder if the nursery would work better in BR3 and have the older kid in BR2, and then have them share BR2 when baby is old enough, or possibly the basement. I think I will move the door on BR2 back as suggested by Chicagoans.

As for the office, it might just be in the basement or I have been thinking of adding a small desk area in the kitchen. Either a small desk in the breakfast nook or switch the ovens &fridge and add a small desk there on the end.

As for toys, they can keep lots in the bedrooms. BR3 Thinking about a built in window seat with storage. And lots can go in the basement. Also thinking if I do pull the entry into the great room, that will create a little nook that we could have storage benches and toys, maybe even add a built in bookcase in the top left corner facing the great room. We would have to recenter the fireplace and windows but I think would actually work great. Then you could make it into a siting area later on. What do you think?

As for the off centered sink and mud room area, please see my previous response. :)

For the master bedroom, I asked him to do two smaller windows which would be behind the night stands. As far as seeing into the master, the curtain wall is supposed to try and hide that a little. I'm just not sure where else to put the door and I guess Its not too much of a concern to me but maybe that will change... I figure you can just close the door. ;) You can also get to the master through the laundry room.

Thank you so much for your thoughts!

cpartist -

You can get into the master through the breakfast nook or the laundry room. I figured I want my laundry room connected to my master closet because someday it will just be my husband and I and I like convenience. :)

I have to do more research on handicap accessible bathrooms....my builder told me the toilets are accessible...

The angled bedroom is not my favorite but it's how the builder got everything to work together. I'm not sure if it mostly how the garage roofline fits into the rest of the house or maybe it's just the second set of stairs in the garage messing that up. I'd say just the long part of that angled closet would be 6' or so of hanging rod. I think that sounds big enough for 2 kids ?? Maybe? They would also have a dresser in the room. Any sports/outdoor equipment would go in the mud entry closet he is adding or the garage.

Regarding the kitchen, see previous comments. :) Also posted in the kitchen forum.

Thank you for taking the time to post your thoughts!

Hi Megan,

I echo what cpartist said about the Master bedroom access off of the breakfast nook. I think that's really awkward and you'll end up getting scents from the kitchen in your bedroom. In addition, you are already creating a great private bedroom hallway near the other two, I think the master entry should be from that location. To me, it looks like you're putting a lot of focus on the laundry room location and entry/double entry and not so much on the entrance to the master. Plus, with little kiddos, and a growing family, don't you want your bedroom door near there's for those middle of the night wake up calls?

To fix that, I think that Bed #1 & #3 are pretty good sizes, and if you took a few feet from each, and if you eliminated the back stairs by the garage you should be able to fit a full bath in that side of the hall. Then convert Bath 1 to laundry room, have the access to the laundry room now be the access to the Master. Take a look at the sketch below. I realize that you lose the access from the master closet to the laundry, but now the laundry room is right outside of the master bedroom doors - which is easily accessible.

Just some food for thought. I realize that this might not work for you though.

You wrote: "You can get into the master through the breakfast nook or the laundry room. I figured I want my laundry room connected to my master closet because someday it will just be my husband and I and I like convenience. :)"

Yes I see that you can get in both ways and think it is a great convenience. Excellent idea. However the main way through is into your eating area through the breakfast area. It would be better I think if you didn't have to walk through your breakfast area. I think it would be better to find a different place for the pantry and then have your entry into the bedroom from the hallway that the other bedrooms come off of. that also helps to separate private and public spaces.

Actually have you considered moving the kitchen to where the breakfast area is and moving the breakfast area down into the living space instead. I think then you would be able to have a more workable plan regarding the pantry and your bedroom.

"I have to do more research on handicap accessible bathrooms....my builder told me the toilets are accessible..."

In the second bath if you had a straight run of the sinks without it bending around I think you'd be ok because you'd have a 51" aisle based on your measurements (figuring a 36" wide tub). However you have that bend and that takes away space so no, you do not have enough for wheelchair accessibility for someone to squeeze a chair there to go to the bathroom and then maneuver around. For someone in a wheelchair to turn around, they need 60"

Question. Is there a particular reason you need the garage angled the way it is? Seems it would cost more to build that way and creates some awkward angles for working with. Simple is usually the best.

For those who need a cleaner version of her plan to see I turned it around and lightened it.

Stephanie's idea for the master bedroom is really nice. That would make it a more private entrance. I understand you want access to the laundry from the closet. But it would not be a lot of extra steps. Still so close to the master bedroom and all the other bedrooms.

I like Steph's idea....but I would swap laundry and master closet. Then laundry is closer to kitchen and has a window :)

Quick try at bath 1...no time to really do it 'pretty' but hopefully, this would fit. Just an idea....

I thought I would post a few pictures that are similar to what I am imagining. I have also toured a few homes with very similar layouts, but they were parade of homes tours so there was no chance to discuss pros and cons with the owners. I'm pondering all of your ideas but still wondering if I can at least get this kitchen/nook/living area to fit our design. Is there anyone who has personally lived in a house with the master entrance in a similar spot?? Pros/cons?? I'm not sure that moving it where Steph has it will make it much closer to the kids rooms. And I'm not sure I want to swap the nook and kitchen. I'm kind of stuck on standing at the island and being able to see in the great room and out to the nice view outside. The good view will be along that side of the house and out the current nook & great room windows. One of the main reasons we originally put the master there was to try have a door to the covered porch from the bedroom (husband really wanted it) but we let that go.

I think if you switched the kitchen/breakfast room you could still arrange the kitchen in such a way to have views to everything.

I think the best homes tend to separate private and public areas and keep the flow within them. Additionally the only times I've seen breakfast rooms lead to bedrooms were in apartments where space is at a premium. You don't have that problem. So now the question is how to rearrange the back space to have the privacy, give you an entry to the master that works and yet still allow you to have the open feeling and view you desire. It can be done but it will probably take a bit of moving things around.

My advice is to not rush it but make sure you get it right.

Also what about the angled garage?

Megan - here's a link to a past discussion of people who have had their bedroom off of the kitchen http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/2563796/master-bedroom-location Maybe that'll help if you don't find too many people now who have had that set-up.

The photo you show above has a bit of a hallway off of the kitchen leading into the bedroom. I personally like that more than your layout of it leading directly into the bedroom. You're building your dream house from scratch, so I think only you can decide if having your bedroom entrance off of the kitchen is right for you.

Also, for what it's worth, I like the garage at an angle - the house I'm building is the same way!

Cpartist - The garage is angled because the husband doesn't want it perpendicular to the house and there isn't enough room to do it parallel. It will be a roomy 3 stall and we think it will work best for us this way.

Stephanie and lavender lass - thank you for the ideas, You are definitely making me think more about the master placement. One issue with your drawings is that there's no room for a mud area. As I stated earlier, my builder is reworking the garage entry to add built in bench/lockers, coat closet and small desk. Sorry again for not having it updated in the pic, I am still waiting to get it back. But I definitely want room for a drop zone and large bench.

Also, does anyone have any thoughts or advice regarding the original post about curtain walls and acoustics?

Thank you for the link Stephanie! And maybe I can have him add a little bit more of a hallway to the master.

I totally agree about the mudroom area and having a dropzone - we have that in the house we're building and it was an absolute must-have on our list. If you capture the alcove from the garage you can easily create a drop zone/benches area and the hall closet between bedrooms 2 & 3 could be a walk-in coat/storage closet.

You mention before about not thinking that the master was closer to the other bedrooms in this configuration, but I forgot to draw in walling off the kitchen (see below). this would give you more storage in the kitchen and provide a 'private' space in the house. then with relocating bedroom 2's door further into the hall, you've really separated the public areas from the private areas.

And you could always rearrange the master bed/bath/closets to be in whatever configuration you'd like - maybe keeping the bedroom at the back of the house like you mentioned before.

I do like the kitchen central to the house with the island where you have it. The photos look nice. As others mentioned, there will be a 'pinch point' with the island and the entry to the breakfast room - maybe shorten the island just a touch.

You've been given some very good options here for bedroom 2 and the drop zone area and baths from some talented people (stephanie and lavenderlass I think). The original plan for bedroom 2 was just too odd even if it was the right size. Sometimes being in an odd room makes people uncomfortable. I can't imagine building a beautiful new home and accepting the original bedroom 2 as the best that could be done.

We have an angled garage with stairs to the basement as well. Love it. Our garage comes out from the house a bit before it turns. That extra space is in the garage, but you might be able to incorporate it into the house and be able to get rid of the angles in bedroom #3. Just a thought...

I really like what Stephanie has done. I think it will be much better in terms of keeping private/public spaces and give you everything you need.

Flip the laundry to the right so your master bedroom doesn't open off the mudroom (too much like a maid's quarters). And can Stephanie's hall closet be opened up so that one or both bedrooms open into a little private entry nook?

I really like the suggestions about the angled bedroom and garage, and the private entry nook for the bedrooms. I shouldn't have to settle for the odd shaped bedroom.

I appreciate the concern about the master entry and keeping public and private areas separate, but I'm still not completely sold. I have seen pretty much the same entry in really nice, expensive, large houses so it must work for some people and not just done because they are short on space. For those that seem pretty opposed to the master entry where it is, have you personally had the same layout? What were the specific issues, besides food odors (which I honestly hadn't thought about until you mentioned it Stephanie)? If not the same layout, what was yours and why did it not work? I don't think sound will be an issue for us, we are both sound sleepers and we would most likely not have too many people hanging out in the kitchen while we are trying to sleep. But if I do keep it there, I think I will add a hallway like Stephanie suggested. We plan to have a family room in the basement eventually so I imagine the kids hanging out down there a lot.

As for the pinch point in the kitchen, I do not want to shorten the island at all. What do you guys think about moving the nook wall back into the master a bit so it would be flush with the kitchen cabinets? Then we could move the island closer to the cabinets (looks like he has way too much room there anyway) and have a better flow around the eating side of the island.

"I appreciate the concern about the master entry and keeping public and private areas separate, but I'm still not completely sold. I have seen pretty much the same entry in really nice, expensive, large houses so it must work for some people and not just done because they are short on space."

Just because someone builds an expensive home doesn't make it a well thought out home for layout. I've looked at 100's of homes in the past 35+ years and I have to say a good majority are poorly designed. Just because others are doing it...

But seriously, now you are sound sleepers and now your children are young. they will not be young too much longer, (yes I know it seems they will, but trust me, don't blink). As they grow up, they'll stay up later, have friends over, and use that kitchen to entertain their friends. And teenagers are LOUD. Very LOUD. LOL.

Also do you really want anyone staying up watching you as you head off to your bedroom? And do you want to be so far from your kids. I wanted to hear them if they got up if they weren't feeling well or had a bad dream and I wanted them to know it was easy for them to come into our bedroom.

the most important reason is resale. Right now you're building and not thinking resale. However it's always good to have it in the back of your mind. I bought and renovated a condo 5 years ago and we had no intention of moving. We love the neighborhood, but the neighborhood is becoming too busy and we miss barbecuing. So after 5 years, we're building a home. I remodeled our condo with a "just in case" so did nothing that would turn off potential buyers. (And I could tell you story after story of people who did some pretty wonky things in the condos in our building.) We've already had several RE Agents tell us we can get at the top of the market for our place for how well we rennovated.

Houses that sell the fastest are the ones where the floor plan flows and where there are well defined areas for different activities. In other words, public areas and private areas.

If you have time, go around to different houses for sale, and see which ones stay on the market the longest. Assuming both are equally maintained and decorated and built around the same time, if you have one with a good floor plan, and one with a wonky floor plan, (and yes, having a master off the breakfast room in a large house is wonky), which one do you think will sell more quickly and for closer to asking price?

I really see no purpose it serves to have the master off the breakfast room, unless you're continually running to the kitchen for the whipped cream. ;)

I personally do not like bedrooms that open directly off of main rooms. I wouldn't consider buying a house that had that placement. We have friends with a house that had the master right behind the kitchen (door was in space between kitchen and breakfast room. She HATED it....she felt like the room always had to be pristine because it was in view of the public rooms. Bed always made up, no laundry waiting to be folded, etc. She said even though there was a door obviously, her small children were constantly opening it and not shutting it, etc... She really disliked it, and has since moved. (Not directly because of the floor plan, but it was a definite pro in favor of making the move.)

Stephanie, I know what you mean, something is "off". Without knowing what the lot is like, the house doesn't seem to use the lot very well. There's the set-back LR, what will be next to the long, straight foyer? There's a lot of space behind the angled garage, so why are the bedrooms squished between garage and kitchen? And there seems to be no respect for the residents, that their bedrooms are mixed in with utility areas. And a bedroom off the kitchen just feels like a first-apartment type of layout.

I like the inspiration photo, and think it can be the basis for a nice house with more regard for the family.

Steph- I think you created a wonderful alternative! It's their plan....but better :)

"And a bedroom off the kitchen just feels like a first-apartment type of layout."

Exactly!

Stephanie - that is a great plan you put together, thank you!! But I think I should tell you more about our acreage and why certain things were where they were...

The top of the page is south, right is west, etc. We are limited in how much we can expand north/south because of a stream to the south and having a south walkout basement under the great room. And then There is a grove of trees to the north and west. The best view will be to the SW so that is why the great room, kitchen, nook, and master were placed on that side. The driveway comes in from the east and will have a circle drive in front of the SE facing garage. So the foyer has to be on the East side. Also, hubby hates wood decks so our grilling porch will be concrete so you can't really put it on the south. And it gives us more privacy from the road when it's on the west side.

This is all part of the reasoning behind our design. And the fact that we love whipped cream. ;) Hopefully this makes it a little easier to understand what we are trying to achieve.

Ha ha! Good points...looks like I drew it in reverse from your original floor plan! I guess I really was hurrying at lunch ;). Just imagine it mirrored and that's what I meant to do!

C'mon Megan tell the truth. Your hubby just wants to be able to run out for more whipped cream. ;)

Seriously though, this is why we all post on these forums. So we can see if maybe there's a better way to do what we want, and to also confirm why we made the choices we did. I know the people here have been a blessing in my planning my home and when I have final plans, I'm again going to post and have everyone give me their ideas. Some fit, some don't but all keep me thinking and help me to think outside MY box. :)

The circulation was what bothered me the most in the original plan. Oh, and those skewed closets by the mud, kind of like just to have skewed lines. The kitchen did not have enough counter space, kitchen was looking to small for this house.

All I did was fine tuning what you already had. I see not need of 2 stairs that close to each other. There are options that I can suggest but that means to change the footprint, while this was traced above your plan, to scale. I see no problem with the master entry off the dining room. The master bath could be lay out in a different way as there is enough room. I squared off the master bath corner as the shape you had only will complicate the roof and make it more expensive.

Having a refrigerator side view from the great room is not that nice but if you prefer to have the refrigerator next to the small pantry, it is ok.

You may not need a bulkhead between kitchen and great room. The change of ceiling and height may be enough but the way the columns are placed, you can have a think bulkhead. Without columns, you can have arches similar to the ones in your pics.

I did not detail a few things, like windows or some exterior doors..

Hope this helps.

So how did the remodel go? stephanie_sara brought up some GREAT layout changes as did others. I'm curious what you went with