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navymomma77

TINY Kitchen reno advice

Navy Momma
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago

We just bought a house, yay! It has a tiny tiny tiny kitchen, boo. I need help formulating ideas of what to do. I'm willing to do a full reno, knock down a wall, but in terms of relocating stairs, etc....probably not going to go that far.

The room is basically an 7'7" x 8' box, with 8' ceilings. On the right side of the box is currently a door to the back deck. I'm thinking of making this into just a window as there are french doors to the deck in the adjacent dining room.

The adjacent dining room is 10'8" by 10'10", and next to that big brown cabinet is the staircase down to the basement- this limits expanding the kitchen becuase that's the stairwell right there.

I'm fine with knocking down the wall to the dining room, and putting the appliances wherever they best go (moving gas line, plumbing, etc. is OK with me). In terms of storage, I figure I can put a high pantry cabinet on each side of the dining room near the side window and then low base cabinets along the wall between them for extra storage and food storage. We aren't fancy people and I don't need a formal dining but I do have a family of 5 and need to fit a regular 42x66 dining table (with space to add a leaf, even tightly for holidays).

In terms of the look, I like clean white cabinets with shaker-style trim, subway tile backsplash, marble or marble-y quartz counters. Simple and clean and classic.

These are the listing photos, not my stuff:
dining room (to the left of that brown cabinet is the staircase to the basement)


the kitchen (the wall with the pans is the staircase wall)

kitchen looking towards dining room entrance (it's just adjacent to the window on the right):

Help! I will be calling in a kitchen reno company once we get in the house (close in a few weeks) but I would love some starting ideas....the rest of the house is great (it would have to be to deal with this tiny kitchen, right?!).

Comments (49)

  • cpartist
    8 years ago

    Can you post a floor plan of the kitchen and the house? Just photos really don't give us enough to go on to change things up. For example since you're willing to do a complete reno, it might actually work better moving the kitchen to one of the other rooms. However we need to see the floor plan. Congratulations on your new home.

  • PRO
    Precision Carpentry
    8 years ago

    First thing I would do is move the fridge.While at the stove you can even get into it.I don't see where to go with it from the pics but a better view from farther back to see the whole kitchen or what is leading into it would help .You could fit a tall pantry in where the frig is now.things would be handy and at 24 -30" wide and double doors they would not interfier with the cooking at the stove.I don't see where you gain a lot by taking out the wall between the dining room and the kitchen window at the expense it would cost but some different pics of just that area may change my mind.

    Looks like you have ample room between the countertops and uppers .You could lower them to the counters a bit and run them to ceiling height.

    Just a few quick suggestions that may help.

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    I am so gracious for all of these comments and feedback. You guys are really helping me to target my objective here. While I could spend more on a total remodel, it really is "unnecessary". I realize that the decent sized formal dining room is a plus. Also, optimally, at some point down the line, I'd like to extend the back of my home by five feet and add a floor (giving me a larger kitchen and enlarging the size of the bedroom above it, which is the same size). At that point, a total remodel would make the most sense. So perhaps for now, the NON PERMIT route might be the best path to take to get some modernity in the home while keeping the expenses low. I've been looking at homes in towns near me which have kitchens with similar square footage, yet sell for $200K+ more than my home. Here is an example. Their kitchen is 12x7. They have their refrigerator in an adjacent pantry (this home is over $200K more than my own!) A NON PERMIT route with "storage tricks" (i.e. slide out spice racks, smaller fridge, ceiling cabinets) sounds like the right path. I get to save on not having to move plumbing/gas/electrical. @mama goose_gw zn6OH and @mnmamax3 I see your point about the off-putting feeling of coming out of the powder room into the dining room/kitchen area. While this might be the cheapest way to get a powder room because of the existing closet door, since I'd need a permit to construct a powder room anyway, perhaps a better entrance would be a new door constructed along the door of the hallway, sealing off the existing closet door, or turning that existing closet into a shallower closet. I believe the wall down the hallway is load bearing. This could be the modified floor plan which puts the entrance to the powder room in the hallway. Would it be a 100% NO to put a 24" refrigerator where my drop leaf table pot rack and radiator are? If I were to put it in that spot, there would be 3" between the fridge and radiator. On the other hand, if I went with the 24" refrigerator in the place of where the 30" one is now, I'd get 18" of counter space between it and the 30" oven instead of the 8" I have now!
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  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    Here's a quick sketch of the space for kitchen (left) and DR (right). This is the only space for the reno. I don't think we can expand unless we put an addition on the house and we aren't prepared to do that. I just want to maximize the space I have with a functional design.


  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    The main issue is that it's a galley but it doesn't have an "end" entrance. So part of the galley is missing so that you have a way INTO the kitchen (the 30" opening into the DR). I think if it was a true galley, I'd probably leave it be. As it is maybe I should just relocate the opening to the middle and make it a true galley going horizontally? Then put the sink where the door is now (and make the door a window) and close up the other 2 windows to make room for overhead cabinetry. Not sure.


  • Nothing Left to Say
    8 years ago

    Our first kitchen was 8 x 8 with two doors and a window. It was a nice little kitchen. One of the great things about a small space is that you can sometimes splurge a little on tile or other finishes because you need such a small amount.


    We bought a small LG refrigerator--about 24 x 24. It was much cheaper than other small refrigerators and worked great. They now sell a very similar successor model.


    I would consider either an 18 inch dishwasher or a single dish drawer.


    People here really dislike over the range microwaves because they don't provide great ventaliation and the position is too high to be ideal for a microwave. But small spaces come with constraints. If you decide that's the best solution for you, I'd look into a GE Advantium speed oven because it would offer a lot of versatility.


    I would take a look at an induction range, rather than gas. I love mine. And the smooth surface can double as extra counterspace when the cooktop is not in use. There are many threads on induction over in the appliances forum.


    And I would look at some of the sinks that offer some extra functionality like the kohler stages. The stages might not be ideal because it has a shelf in it and you might not have the space to devote to that, but there are some threads on alternatives that might be worth considering.

  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    I think something like this would be great, what do you all think, this is pretty much a galley layout but I'd make a few tweaks to maximize storage space:
    http://www.homebunch.com/wp-content/uploads/The-Cross-Design.jpg


  • huango
    8 years ago

    My friend had a similar tiny kitchen.

    She opened it up into the DR and it felt way more spacious.

    example: Take the wall between kitchen and DR down to countertop height

    Amanda

  • cpartist
    8 years ago

    I don't know if I'll be able to play until after next week as I'm preparing for a show. (I'm an artist.) However there are plenty on here better than me who can help you. Looks like I would open the wall to the dining room and create a more open space. Maybe even move the dining room to the kitchen area and the kitchen to the dining room area? Depends where the living room is?

  • rebunky
    8 years ago

    Yes, love that navy momma! I actually started to draw a little layout for you earlier but had to go help in the yard for a while. Just got back to post and saw your link. My drawing was the same basic layout after losing the wall between the rooms. Here's your picture...

    That turquoise retro fridge is my dream! I love it!

    I almost played with the same thought as cpartist of switching the kitchen and dining rooms and adding a cute banquette in the kitchen space. Maybe like this...

    But, it was just really feeling too tight with your table size.

    My concern is the width between the fridge and dw at 7'8". Not sure the depth of those fridges. Might have to do the counter depth one. And remember to account and inch or two passed the cabinets for the countertop and any handle on the dw calculating the isle space. I think it will be okay. You will definately have to close the dw to access the fridge. But I think in small kitchens, you just have to make it work. It's really looks like a great home!

    Maybe others will have some ideas? Best wishes...

  • PRO
    MDLN
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Can you take down, or open up, the wall between kitchen & DR?

  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago

    I love your inspiration picture, but with standard 30" range and fridge,
    this is how is would look in your space. On the top left corner I
    flipped the sink and DW to show an alternate plan. With the first plan
    you have two blind corners, but prep space between the sink and range.
    In the alternate plan you could possibly have a 33" corner cabinet, but no
    prep space. And it would be difficult to access uppers in the corner between the fridge and range--nearly impossible with a hood. If you have a cutting board made to fit over the sink, that
    would increase prep space in both plans.

    You can get a little more space with a counter depth fridge, and/or 18" DW and 24" range, which would leave room for a 36" super susan in the left corner.



    Navy Momma thanked mama goose_gw zn6OH
  • Nothing Left to Say
    8 years ago

    Here is the LG refrigerator I mentioned. It has no handles to stick out and is 24 3/4 deep and 23 wide or so. Someone on the appliances forum here suggested it to me and it was genius. It made our small kitchen work so much better. It held enough food for three of us for a week easily.




    I personally would go with a small refrigerator and a small dishwasher over a small range. I never use all four burners on my range at the same time, but if the top were any smaller, I think it would be hard to fit a big pot and anything else at the same time or to fit two frying pans at the same time.


    The kohler Indio is one of the sinks I was talking about.



    It may seem counter intuitive to get a big sink in a small kitchen. But I think if you get one that can have a cutting board, etc used with it then the sink space can double as counter space when needed and you also get a big sink. There are other options out there, the kohler stages being the one with the most reviews on here. I'm getting the stages 45, but that's huge and I don't think it would fit in your space. Kohler also makes a stages 33, but the main bowl in that one isn't all that big so I'm not sure that it would work well as an only sink (more used as a prep sink I think)


  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    In this plan I moved the right wall even with the French doors(edited)--another 3 feet m/l since I wasn't sure of that measurement. The 9" pullouts for spices, oils and cooking condiment could decrease to 6" if available space is less than 3'.

    This leaves no space on the right side of the sink, but gets you a 36" corner susan--if you block off the corner, the sink can move down, leaving space on the right side. I love the door/window combos in older homes, and I'd keep the door, but if you make it windows, the DW could be put on the right side of the sink. Of course, it can be on the right side even with the door, but I don't know about having it open when a kid decides to blow through the kitchen.

    Also, blocking the left corner, and moving the range against the right 42" corner unit, would give you 30" for a bank of drawers.

    This version moves the fridge out on its own between the front doors (edited to correct--French doors) and kitchen windows, with landing space across from it. The door opening and aisle are only 36" m/l, and the exterior door is preserved.

    The door becomes a window in this plan, and except for only 36" in the doorway, I really like it. (1" filler on the left wall.)

    With another quick cut and paste, the fridge moves across the room, and can be recessed into the wall space to gain a couple of inches for the aisle. Disadvantage is that it can be seen from the French doors.

    Navy Momma thanked mama goose_gw zn6OH
  • stephanj
    8 years ago

    The house has some really charming "bones". Piggybacking on the great advice you are getting, I wanted to give you ideas around keeping those windows, since it's a shame to lose the natural light. not sure what your open shelving tolerance is...

    Mt. Baker · More Info

  • Kimberly N
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Can you take out the 61" wall? How much do you want a formal dining space? How do you feel about your kitchen being visible to living room? Are you ok with it being a 'one-butt' kitchen or do you want it more open?

  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago

    stephanj, My heart sings when I see that picture. :)

    Navy Momma, it occurs to me that if you like the last plan, could you possibly put a jog in the wall to recess the fridge farther? It looks as if you might have a few inches between the stair opening and the wall that I extended 3'.



  • sherri1058
    8 years ago

    mama goose, I think what you have labeled as front doors is french doors to the deck, no?


    Navy Momma thanked sherri1058
  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    Wow, amazing ideas!
    1) the french doors in the DR are NOT my front doors. They access the back porch of the house. None of the kitchen is visible from the front door of the house, which is clear on the other side of the LR. I would prefer that the fridge face the rear of the house so you don't stare at it when you enter the DR.
    2) I am planning to remove the casement/wall between the LR and DR and as far as the home inspector could tell, that will not be a problem. I'm okay with adding a beam if I need to, to be able to open it up either way. In that way I am good with extending the cabinetry as close to the french doors as possible, and getting rid of the door in the kitchen. I'm not sure about removing the side windows and doing a single window over where I'd like the sink to be or not. Shelves don't really appeal to me because I just feel like everything gets dusty and it's not really functional for me.
    3) I plan to do a french-door counter depth fridge. I will probably keep the existing fridge in and put it in the basement for additional storage.
    4) I would like to have standard size range and dishwasher if possible. I know this is an apartment size kitchen, but we are a family with 3 young kids and we eat at home a lot! We use a lot of dishes and cook a lot. I'm the primary cook in my family, my husband does not cook at all.

    I don't want the fridge sticking out into the DR, I think I'd prefer it within the kitchen space. Do you think it would be more space-saving to have a cooktop centered on the 91" wall and then put a built in wall oven on the staircase wall and then move the fridge over? I think the fridge will be 36" for a counter depth. I may not have room for 2 super susans. Probably just one.

    On the wall in the DR at the far right (the 10'10" wall) I envision a tall pantry cabinet in each corner for food storage and then low 15" depth cabinets running for more storage of not as often-used stuff.

  • Lavender Lass
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Steph- Nice picture! :)

    Since there are the French doors out to the deck, what about taking Steph's idea without the door? Using MamaGoose's very nice sketch....maybe something like this?

    Galley version....

    And like the picture Rebunky posted above with turquoise fridge...nice :)

  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago

    Oops, yes, French doors--not front doors. Long day yesterday with a family wedding--maybe I should have had another cup of coffee before reading layouts. ;)


  • cpartist
    8 years ago

    My concern with Mama Goose's plans is that only allows less than 3 1/2' inside the kitchen. Not sure what the answer is. What about changing the doors out the sides instead of the back? then you could do a one wall type of kitchen across the back with pantries on the wall against the stairs?

  • cpartist
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Not sure this is viable but maybe it will help you to think outside the box a bit and figure out something totally different. the thing on the left is a door out that way.

  • cpartist
    8 years ago

    Additionally something like I did would give you the room to do a separate cooktop and ovens with the 42" of space to the right of the range or what would be the cooktop.

  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I agree, cpartist, the narrow aisle was my concern, too.

    "Do you think it would be more space-saving to have a cooktop centered
    on the 91" wall and then put a built in wall oven on the staircase wall
    and then move the fridge over?"

    Navy
    Momma, I think you could center the cooktop, have a 36" super susan in
    one corner, and a trash pullout in the other corner to provide symmetry,
    then have 18" drawers under the cooktop. If you don't care that drawers
    aren't centered then there is room for a 30" drawer base.

    I'm not sure if this is what you are thinking:

    (Or did you mean to keep it within the original kitchen space?)

    The problem again is the narrow aisle--even with a CD fridge the doors have to project beyond the side cabinet in order to open. BTW, how wide is your current aisle between range and fridge? Cabinets counter-to-counter probably 41"?

    Navy Momma thanked mama goose_gw zn6OH
  • lisa_a
    8 years ago

    I drew in your kitchen table, estimating the extra leaf at 18" wide, with my kitchen plan. I don't think you should steal more than 22" from the DR, not without sacrificing room around the table and a decent aisle to the backyard. That is only possible if you opt for a banquette. Given the space's small size, I think that would work well, plus you gain storage under the benches.

    So here are two ideas for you:

    Go by measurements; it's definitely not drawn to scale.

    You will either need to widen the entry to the LR or shift it to the left. 66" is a generous aisle; I erred on generous so that if you need to move large things into the basement (furniture, W/D, etc), you have room to do so.

    I made the bench deep enough to pad the back. Since this will be your only dining area, I think you'll want it to be comfortable for lingering over meals, chatting over coffee, etc.

    Here are banquette ideas:

    Georgian Style | Minneapolis · More Info



    Burlington Lakeside · More Info


    This banquette isn't L-shaped but it does show drawers under the bench.


    Bluebell, PA traditional · More Info

    Here's an L-shaped bench with drawers (but with uncomfortably straight backs).
    Waterloo Complete Renovation · More Info


    I added a 24" wide base cab with upper at the end of the bench for more storage. This could be your Command Center. I figure with 5 of you, that would come in handy.

    When you extend the table, it's definitely tight - just enough room to pull out a chair - but you said you were okay with that.

    If you can, go with out-swing French doors to give you more room at that end of the room. Check to see if code permits them (not all areas do).

    Okay, on to the kitchen.

    24" fridge, which is small given your family of 5 but so is your kitchen. ;-)

    I gave you a 24" DW. You could opt for a 18" DW (check Bosch & Miele brands) and put those 6" elsewhere.

    27" sink cab is on the small side but doable. You could even go down to a 24" sink cab if you go with a apron front sink. There aren't many in that size so you'll have to do some research. If you do a positive reveal on the sink, you could fit cutting boards, strainers, etc over the sink so that it would function similarly to the Kohler Indio (and most likely for less money).

    The range is on the end wall with a long wall of 12" deep, floor to ceiling pantry cabs opposite the sink run. This will provide ample storage for food, dishes, glasses, small appliances, etc. I added a GE Spacemaker II MW to this cab. It's designed to fit in a 12" deep upper cab. Here's one behind a door.

    Divine Kitchens LLC · More Info


    If you can steal stud space from the stairwell wall, you would gain 3" of space, either to add a wider cab to the left of the range or to increase the depth of the pantry cabs.

    Here's an example of pantry goods in stud space (this cab is only stud depth).

    Feng Shui Fix · More Info


    Plan A gives you ample room to move about in the kitchen and lots of storage but it's lean on counter space. You could increase it by adding a small table or flip down shelf to the pantry cab, something like this:


    Central District Kitchen Remodel · More Info


    but perhaps not permanent so it only takes up aisle room when you need it and disappears when you don't. Another option is a roll-out cart:

    Haight Ashbury · More Info

    or a flip down shelf:

    Across the island · More Info


    Plan B is a galley set-up. Oops, hit the photo posting limit so Plan B will be in a separate post.

  • lisa_a
    8 years ago

    Plan B

    The DR area is the same as in Plan A. The kitchen is a galley with pantry storage on the end wall. Again, if you can steal stud space, you'd gain more storage. This plan gives you more counter but has a tighter aisle in the kitchen and perhaps less storage. You could do a OTR MW or opt for the GE Spacemaker II in an upper cab next to the range. You could also opt for a MW drawer next to the range.

    You could also move the DW to the left of the sink. Just think about where you'll store dishes and glassware so that an open DW door doesn't block where you want to store them.

  • lisa_a
    8 years ago

    Oh, forgot to add that you have the room to extend the counter run on the range wall so that it lines up with where the fridge ends. It will be tight clearances between fridge and counter, though, so that could end up a pinch point for you.

  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I know you don't want to build an addition, but if you did a 16" bumpout (12" + 4" framed wall), you'd have a nice aisle. I lived in a bungalow with a bumpout before we bought our current home. There was no plumbing in the bumpout, so that might not be as easy in your case. This plan does leave most of your current dining area intact.


    The top corner susan could be eliminated in favor of 33" drawers beside the sink, and a 12" trash pullout (+1" filler) beside the range. Adding: In that case the bumpout could be set in from the outside corner (with window placement adjusted) to make it look more like a bay, but that would eliminate some of the counter space in the corner.


  • balloonflower
    8 years ago

    This looks a lot like my current kitchen, with a slightly different layout. Just to give practical advice on some of the plans that list 36" between counters. That's exactly what I have right now and quite functional for one cook. I have two squirts (4&6) and stay at home, cooking a lot as well. I don't have problems when it's just me. The times it drives me nuts is when we want to cook together as a family--DH is trained as a chef and we like to do family cooking. It works, but barely and only with good communication on bum-bumping and when to watch for hot stuff. But if your Hub doesn't venture into the kitchen, it's quite doable.

    We do have pantry space outside of the main cooking space, so those cupboards are pretty much cook equipment. Just bought first house, with a small galley kitchen as well, but it has 48" between counters. It's very exciting!

  • williamsem
    8 years ago

    My drawing program is on the fritz, but what about opening up to the DR more, but leave enough wall for the fridge facing the window in that bottom right corner, then shallow pantry cabinet facing the window, then along the left side the range, then the sink and DW under the window, with a shallow dish hutch built next to the DW by the slider (can add another on the far side of the slider to balance the look too).

    You'd have to be careful with fridge depth, and it would help if you can also recess it into the stair wall to gain another couple of inches.

    Too close to tell without seeing it, maybe someone else is having a better day and can math in their head enough to see if that works. Too many variables for me to track at once without drawing it!

    Navy Momma thanked williamsem
  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    williamsem,
    I cut and pasted on a previously posted plan. Is this what you were thinking?


    Navy Momma thanked mama goose_gw zn6OH
  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I wonder if I do a smaller sink (30"?) and then put the trash in between the DW and a curved shelf (like in my inspiration picture) up to the french doors... Just because with kids, easy access to the trash can would be nice without having to enter all the way into the kitchen if I'm working in there.

    I like the shallow cabinets on the fridge side for more floor space, but then you really only have the super susan side of the stovetop for a food prep area, and to the right of the sink up to the french doors. Hmmmm.

    I'm not actually IN the house yet- we close in 2 weeks. This is going to be our immediate priority. The current dishwasher is not even a real dishwasher- it's the portable variety that you run through a hose in the sink!! Yikes.

    I wonder if the contractor will have some other idea with the staircase- that would enable moving them in some way to allow me to use some of the stairwell space. The basement is a finished living space so we need everyday access for sure.

    You all are awesome!

  • Karenseb
    8 years ago

    I like Mama Goose's last layout and the idea of putting the trash to the right of the DW. Are you reusing any of the really cute windows you have now. They would look great over the sink. If you wanted to keep the larger sink, perhaps you could just do a narrow dish hutch (21 in wide instead of 36, then do the 15 in trash next to the DW. You could prep over the DW and trash ) total prep space 39 inches.

  • Lavender Lass
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    What if the fridge is on the left wall...and the range is opposite the garbage?

    This space will be cramped for more than one person, no matter what....but it would give you prep space between fridge and sink (or clean up area) while you cook. And I'd keep the kids at the table. I like the banquette idea :)



  • cpartist
    8 years ago

    Can you post a plan showing also where the doors to outside lead and what's on the sides? I assume that won't work but maybe moving the doors, would.

  • lisa_a
    8 years ago

    I love your inspiration pic, Navy Momma, but given your kitchen's small space, I encourage you to forgo the curved display area for more counter and storage space. You could add open shelves in front of the windows for display, ala the photo stephanj posted above, to get a similar effect.

    I drew up 2 more ideas for you:

    This U-layout gives you a nice stretch of counter between sink and range, plus a shallow pantry cab opposite the fridge. It bookends the kitchen but it also closes it off so I drew up Plan D, which is similar to your inspiration pic.

    I extended the wall behind the range run. I also adjusted the LR opening: I widened it to the left but left the upper part of the opening where it currently is, adding a half wall behind the banquette bench on the right.

    Plan D

    The fridge moves to the bottom wall, book-ended by 12" deep, 24" wide pantries. You could do pull-out pantries instead but this option will give you more storage space and also be less expensive.

    I shifted the DW and sink all the way to the right and added another window (couldn't tell whether the sink would end mid-window or not). This gives you about 40" of counter between sink and corner, which is a marvelous stretch of counter for prepping. You also have 25" on the other side of the range so 2 people could be working in the kitchen at the same time.

    You could opt for the GE Spacemaker II MW in one of the pantry cabs or go with an OTR MW.

    I kept the aisle from LR to backyard at 44"; that is the recommended aisle width to allow people to walk behind seated diners. You could cheat this by a few inches but less than that would make it tight, physically and visually. 10" less, as a few of the plans above call for, would give you a 34" aisle, which is less than the minimum recommended aisle of 36" for edge past seated diners. And that's only if you do a banquette set-up, which is a great small space solution.

    In all of my plans, I call for trash to be under the sink. Yes, you could opt for a trash cab but IMO, putting trash under the sink makes the best use of your small kitchen.

    If you haven't already, tally all that you need to store in your kitchen, sorting them into groups (measuring cups, measuring spoons, mixing bowls, etc are prep items) and measuring how much space you need for them. That will help you determine how much storage you need and where you need it. It's time consuming but it will help you narrow your plan options down to the one that will suit you and your family's needs best.

    Navy Momma thanked lisa_a
  • funkycamper
    8 years ago

    I haven't posted in this discussion but I've been following it. You've been given a lot of good ideas but I think the last one from Lisa is an outstanding plan because it does allow for two to work in the kitchen and gives you more space in the aisles. Also, I'm not personally fond of fridges being so visually obvious so the placement on that wall keeps it accessible but less obvious from the dining area. Good job, Lisa!

    Navy Momma thanked funkycamper
  • lisa_a
    8 years ago

    Thank you, funkycamper!

    Navy Momma thanked lisa_a
  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    Thank you so much for all your insight!


  • mama goose_gw zn6OH
    8 years ago

    I posted a pic on another thread, and thought of you. To increase storage, you might consider a plate rack (or more than one) across the window above the sink area.


    Navy Momma thanked mama goose_gw zn6OH
  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    cpartist- the back porch is just on the back of the house. I can't move the doors to the side because...there's nothing on the side to exit onto. I can't wait to get started with all your lovely ideas!
    I will post once I meet with some kitchen designers and formulate a plan.


  • lisapoi
    8 years ago

    I also think the last plan looks really functional. We just finished our new kitchen and put a 12" deep "pantry" on the end of our refrigerator. We totally removed the wall between our DR and kitchen, and the pantry faces the DR instead of the side of the fridge. Not only does it look great, but I was surprised by how useful that 12" deep pantry is! nothing gets lost in it . . .everything is easy to see and reach. We also used the middle two shelves for our dishes and glasses . . .So convenient to reach and see!

  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    On the last plan, If I use a 36" width fridge, drop the right side pantry and move the fridge and 12" pantry over so they aren't jutting out as much.... or do a very slim spice cabinet on the side of the fridge, since it's close to the cooktop....


  • lisa_a
    8 years ago

    To answer your question: maybe.

    It will depend on whether you intend to go with a built-in fridge (the cab is only slightly wider than the fridge itself) or a stand-alone. If you opt for a stand-alone and if you intend to box it in with a cab, then you need to allot more width to the fridge area, up to 3 or so inches more, depending on cab construction and fridge clearance allowances.

    I drew your plan up assuming a built-in, based on the fridge someone suggested above and realize now that I shouldn't have made that assumption.

    If you buy a stand-alone fridge, make sure you purchase a counter depth fridge. You do not have enough room width to handle a full depth fridge. That would eat up 4" to 6" of aisle, creating a pinch point at the neck of your kitchen.

    If you purchase a stand alone and don't put it inside a fridge cabinet, then you'll need to get clever with how you mount the cabs on each side of it. I'm sure it can be done, I just don't know how.

    Can you add a second fridge/freezer to the basement for overflow? That would allow you to get a fridge in a size more in scale with your small kitchen.

  • Navy Momma
    Original Author
    8 years ago

    I would def do a counter-depth. I really need the 36" wide version, even if I keep the existing one for my basement. 3 kids eat a lot of food! I do plan to do a built in cabinet around it.
    Thanks so much Lisa. You've had some great ideas! I wasn't really liking the banquette idea at the start of the thread, but you've all brought me around to it and now I really think it is a great option.


  • lisa_a
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I chuckled when I read "3 kids eat a lot of food!" Yeah, I bet they do!

    And you're welcome, Navy Mom!

    I just had another thought. Instead of a shallow spice rack on the side of the fridge racing the range, install a between-the-studs cab, as I showed above, on the wall between fridge and range run. You'd gain storage and a slightly wider aisle between fridge run and range run. That would be a plus if you put the fridge closest to the range with the pantry cab facing the dining area. You'd have a little more room for door swings. A French door fridge would also help with aisle room since the doors don't take up as much room when open.

    Navy Momma thanked lisa_a
  • texasgal47
    8 years ago

    Wow, lisa _a, great plan, and great work by the whole GW "team." Lisa, I like that you've given Navy Mom the 3 drawer bank to the left of the sink. She really needed that for unloading the dishwasher -- silverware drawer in the top, perhaps dish drawer for the second. Following this thread has been great fun as small kitchens are my favorite.

    I'm wondering if Navy Mom follows through on lisa_a's suggestion to use the wall space between the studs for spices, in the area between the drawer bank to the left of the stove and the side of the fridge, if bi-pass doors would need to be used rather than regular doors. Would the drawers of the 24" 3 drawer bank (to the left of the range) hit the sides of the doors on the wall spice cabinet or the pulls or knobs of the doors?

    Navy Momma thanked texasgal47
  • lisa_a
    8 years ago

    Good point, texasgal. I think a spacer between drawer bank and wall would be required as if that were a corner of cabs, because if she adds a between-studs cab, it is essentially a corner of cabs. That will allow clearance for drawers to move past doors and handles. A GC and cab designer will be able to fine tune things to work well.

    And thank you!

    Navy Momma thanked lisa_a